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Old 01-22-2018, 07:14 PM   #1
linutzy
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General Take on Cryptocurrency - Bitcoin/Altcoin (any coin)


I haven't posted in a while. I'm usually here for some very noobish Linux and programming questions. First, it amazes me how Quara, Reddit LQ, and stack communities respond to the cryptocurrency movement.

Am I wrong in assuming the following

1) Mining = Waste of Time (no coin worth it even with free power) Not even XMR. I could in fact be doing better things with a raspberry pi; then mining, even for the sake of knowledge.

2) There is a definite herd mentality, and it's both sad and frightening.

3) This is a scam or is it? I feel there is no truth to the benefits and negatives of opting in on coins of any type.
 
Old 01-22-2018, 08:35 PM   #2
frankbell
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You might want to take a look at this thread: https://www.linuxquestions.org/quest...in-4175621799/
 
Old 01-23-2018, 08:01 AM   #3
sundialsvcs
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My favorite so far is Why Bitcoin Is Stupid.

Fundamentally, while "block chaining algorithms" have very-exciting possibilities if the computation problem can ever be worked out (we need to make billions of 'em ...), the current slew of "crypto-currencies are simply a swindle directly analogous to Tulip Mania, the "dot-bomb bubble" and so on.

In the eyes of any law anywhere, these digital numbers are simply barter tokens, not "legal tender." They are not currency; they are not coin of the realm. They have no intrinsic value at all, except what some other speculator might be lured to pay for them. Those "values" can evaporate in seconds, leaving you holding a possibly-dead tulip bulb that tastes like an onion.

Also, I am more than a little suspicious of these fanciful numbers, which could very well just be con-artists pulling numbers out of their ass hat.

Fortunately, I think that law-enforcement is closing in on this scam, around the world. These people have not staged "a good con."

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 01-23-2018 at 08:02 AM.
 
Old 01-23-2018, 09:23 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sundialsvcs View Post
Fortunately, I think that law-enforcement is closing in on this scam, around the world. These people have not staged "a good con."
onecoin has been raided by euro police, yesterday i think.
 
Old 01-24-2018, 08:58 AM   #5
sundialsvcs
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Some prosecutors in the United States are considering whether it is a violation of Federal law that the perps refer to these tokens as "–coin" and "–currency," when they enjoy no such legal status. This could be the basis for a legal case of fraud, and/or counterfeiting.

It's not really a question of whether these things are the basis of a swindle, but how to take it down given the enormous amounts of money that the perps very-obviously have.

I feel that it's accurate to say that these people intended to launch what might be the financially-largest and most-widespread international swindle ever before staged.
 
Old 01-25-2018, 04:57 AM   #6
enorbet
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It is a far safer bet to bet on Law Enforcement coming up with some "legal" means to declare crypto-currency illegal .... and in the process confiscate lots of it in it's job to keep "order" and make money while doing it, than it is to invest in BitCoin. I'm singling it out because it is currently so high profile, which paints a large, bright target on it's back. However I can imagine no means by which to outlaw block chain and whatever name one wishes to call any fair trade schemes/items it may develop. So BitCoin will very likely die an ignominious death, and while many reasons will be given, the main one will be The Wild West, it's a loose cannon that threatens status quo authority, and on top of that there are still a lot of people in positions of power that don't and never will, understand the deep paradigm shift that is implicit in changing from an industrial base to an information base. They can be counted on to fight tooth and nail to maintain but the odds are high they will join the Dodo Bird before too very long.

There now exists many corporations whose annual earnings exceed many nation states GNP, and each of them, nations included, are completely dependent on wealth to implement change, to exercise power. The movie "Gangs of New York" is just one example of how all serious power is in the hands of "gangs" that once they get big enough, they can change their name and their public face and become Government. All of them are, as they have been for millennia, tethered to banks. Since it basically only takes around 15 Million USA dollars to start a bank, chicken feed for many corporations, they can easily start one and often do BUT starting a bank immediately put's you under fairly strict regulation and corporations don't prefer to be regulated. Block chain is tantalizing to some nations and some corporations exactly because it is likely a game changer and high risk/high reward is a game with which they have a Love/Hate relationship.

It's going to be an interesting war, and battles will be won and lost on both sides, but block chain or something very much like it is very much "in the cards". It may take 20 years. It may take 50, but some deep level change in how we trade should be obvious to everyone is on the horizon.
 
Old 01-25-2018, 08:06 AM   #7
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To me, such "Libertarian philosophies" really don't hold up. But certainly, "vague fears" (and a mis-understanding of how currency actually works) can be used to drive people toward a swindle like this one.

There's no law against the possession of a number with unusual mathematical properties.

Once we can finally produce block-chain tokens cheaply and quickly, it will be "absolutely huge." They'll be every bit as significant (hmm? "most sigificant bits?" ) as public-key cryptography, and far more useful. Our present methods for electronic funds transfer are used to settle billions of dollars' worth of accounts every day, and those methods can be abused and so are abused. If the tokens used to represent money in those systems were block-chain tokens, that would dramatically improve security and reliability.

As far as "legal tender" is concerned, the present-day practices of (specifically) the United States are probably the biggest single problem. The US Government literally generates money, not to maintain liquidity of the financial system but to buy things. Those dollars don't appear as a result of trading activity: they just appear. And this is why nations like China and Russia are moving away from "petro-Dollars" and the energy-trading bourses run by US concerns. This is going to be some very unpleasant medicine for the US to finally swallow – but I submit that it's long overdue and very badly needed, because I consider the practice to be abusive, even dishonest.

The "Mr. Mustache Money" article quoted previously said it very well when it said that money, and trade, and wealth, is really based on human trust.

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 01-25-2018 at 08:07 AM.
 
Old 01-25-2018, 09:44 AM   #8
dogpatch
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sundialsvcs View Post
The "Mr. Mustache Money" article quoted previously said it very well when it said that money, and trade, and wealth, is really based on human trust.
Exactly. The US dollar is currently (ahem) powerful and valuable simply because most people still believe it to be reliable and trustworthy. If sufficient numbers of people believe in BitCoin (for example), it will be worth something. If not, not. Likewise, when the dollar loses peoples' trust, it will lose its value as well.
 
Old 01-28-2018, 04:57 AM   #9
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two crooks arrested. cryptocurrency called My Big Coin :P

https://www.techspot.com/news/72941-...ency-scam.html
 
Old 01-29-2018, 12:10 PM   #10
sundialsvcs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dogpatch View Post
Exactly. The US dollar is currently (ahem) powerful and valuable simply because most people still believe it to be reliable and trustworthy. If sufficient numbers of people believe in BitCoin (for example), it will be worth something. If not, not. Likewise, when the dollar loses peoples' trust, it will lose its value as well.
Barter tokens will never take the place of legal tender. The reason why "legal tender" status exists is to guarantee that the currency-unit will always be accepted somewhere, that its value will be regulated, and (by mutual consent) it will be exchangeable with other legal-tender currency.

The "crypto" characteristic of these tokens, in their present implementation, is their Achilles Heel. The purposeful limit on the number of tokens that can be generated – and the prodigious computational cost of doing so – is what renders them useless. We must not run out of, or even run short of, "money." (But, no doubt, "stay tuned." There will be a breakthrough.)

What I do expect to continue to see is an elimination of the notion of "pegging" one currency against another, and of using a particular currency as a required-intermediate, e.g. the "petro-dollar." Not only are these things now technically unnecessary, but they are the source of deliberate abuses by the government in question. There's absolutely no anymore reason why, when China decides to buy more oil, the transaction should have to pass-through US Dollars® on its way from China to the dockside tank. The US Government has taken unfair(!) advantage of this for much, much too long. Yes, this will impose much more volatility on the US Dollar, but it's a volatility that this currency ought to have had anyway: why should an oil producer (for example) "have to take it in the shorts?" And, why should the US have a money printing-press?

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 01-29-2018 at 12:13 PM.
 
  


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