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View Poll Results: Ever seen a UFO?
Yes 15 36.59%
No 18 43.90%
Not sure 8 19.51%
Voters: 41. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-26-2018, 03:04 PM   #121
jsbjsb001
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Looking at some videos on YouTube there and happened to stumble across some pretty interesting vid's. I was NOT looking for these one's either, but they purport to be some classified videos from Project Blue Book, purportedly taken in 1964. They do bear the term "MAJ" which would refer to Majestic 12.

I can't say if their real or fake, but very, very interesting none-the-less:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2xXu8_2Exo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TE6frpygVY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4-KzZe9IpQ

FWIW, if they are fake, not a bad effort.
 
Old 06-26-2018, 05:01 PM   #122
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Seriously? If anyone just actually reads the wiki you linked it is obvious those videos are faked since at the very least the Military is not about to release something, anything, from an official tax-funded project that contradicts the official findings which concludes not even craft can be anything more than "unknown" let alone actual aliens. Plus there is zero indication that time travel especially to the past is even possible and these "interviewers" actually think a) scopolomine will work on another species, or b) that it is the way to elicit any useful information out of anyone or anything, which is to say nothing about the far more obvious fabrication of "the alien" which is so obviously not alive if nothing more than the sheer lack of number of musculature movements of a species capable of building a Time Machine. That thing has less movement than a slug, even when it "speaks". Sorry but this is ridiculous.

BTW don't you imagine that if there was even the slightest evidence of alien craft, let alone actual aliens on Earth that the Military would want it known so they could justify huge budget increases?
 
Old 06-27-2018, 01:13 AM   #123
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Well my friend enorbet, how did I know you were going to say that? I did explicitly say "I can't say if their real or fake, but very, very interesting none-the-less". I can't see why myself why the Military would disclose such things, this of course doesn't mean it's not true or that for whatever reason they wouldn't in the future, although I also have some doubts about that myself.

And yes, it would be so easy to say they are fake, it would be real easy to say that and dismiss them. I think that could be the problem.

I did also find this video afterwards too (maybe I should have posted that one as well).

Based on that video, the guy being interviewed does NOT state that he himself ever had any contact with any ET's, but does seem to confirm what a number of others have said in the past. The key there seems to be "Project Blue Book", which I think it IS safe to say WAS a real "project" of the US Government. What's also interesting to me is that it seems to me that there has indeed (or was in the past) an intent on their part to try and cover up and dismiss UFO's as nothing but fakes, or just pure fiction.

While it's hard to know exactly where the real truth lies and we may never know either, I for one WILL be keeping an open mind, regardless of what that "truth" may be.

I did search on Brigadier General Stephen Lovekin and in the interests of full disclosure, I found this:

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2006...neral-but.html
 
Old 06-27-2018, 06:42 AM   #124
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It is my regarded opinion that UFO reports are scientifically interesting when the emphasis remains on "unidentified" but when people jump to conclusions about "alien interstellar craft" or worse, Time Travel, it is only interesting in what it reveals about human nature. The degree of technology required for either is so far advanced from us it is highly unlikely any such creatures would be seen unless they wanted to be and that couldn't be kept secret. So I find it extremely unlikely that any alien visiting us (and whatever for?) would or even could be captured let alone questioned.

Project Bluebook was certainly real and admittedly so (it was official after all) but I have sincere doubts it was ever designed to be a cover up. Was there bias? Of course. Was that skeptical bias unreasonable or unfounded? A resounding NO!

I've heard people try to compare this to the gap between European invaders/explorers and primitive native populations and that gap isn't anywhere near the same by orders of magnitude. It is more like the gap between bacteria and primates. Interstellar travel may actually be physically impossible in any kind of time frame or economy to ever be practical excepting a last ditch effort to the very nearest star systems in "Hail Mary" hopes of escaping extinction. The Universe is all but unimaginably huge and mostly 'empty" Space.

Please do take a look at this graphic of how far radio transmissions traveling at the speed of light for almost 100 years have reached. It is quite sobering and humbling to put the concept into perspective -----

--- Human Sphere of Galactic Contact Since 1920 ---

Last edited by enorbet; 06-27-2018 at 06:46 AM.
 
Old 06-27-2018, 07:19 AM   #125
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Well for the most part, I do actually agree with a lot of what you say. But I've gotta say that a number of people saying the same (or very, very similar) things regarding what we are talking about here, I find to be quite odd if it's all nothing short of pure fiction.

Now of course, I can't profess to know whether it's true or not, I can't even profess to know that I even understand "Time Travel" - I'm not sure anyone on the face of the Earth could either. But you really have to admit that when we put it altogether, if it were about any other subject, people would be saying something to the effect of, "how much more proof do you need". I have no doubts about that, now you're of course very welcome to disagree and that's fine by me - each to their own. But I have to say that there certainly would be a good reason for the US Government to be both interested in such things, as well as, to want to cover up such things.

Regarding the 3 videos I linked before, there is one name who is in high office now, who would have been around 18 years old in 1964, who does fit the bill regarding what the purported "alien" in those same videos was talking about. I think you can guess who, look at the "fake news" phenomena, and the I quote "lack of objective facts". Now I can't say that those videos are once again real or fake, but I can say that either they are pure fiction or they are very real. Or more to the point: those videos are either very fake, sheer coincidence, or once again very real. Listen to what the "alien" is saying in them and you'll hear what I'm talking about.

I should also say that for whatever reason (and I was both surprised and dumbfounded myself by it) the US Department of Defense DID release a UFO video being the one I linked in post #111, which once again clearly IS from a US fighter jet AND clearly shows a solid object under some kind under intelligent control, and not "Flying Rods". I can't say that is ET anymore than I can say it isn't, but you have to admit, not a bad piece of evidence - and that IS evidence regardless of whether you (or anyone else) accepts it or not. I wasn't trying to be rude to you in saying that BTW, I was just making the point; that just because we don't understand something, it doesn't mean it's not real - it just means that we don't possess the knowledge to be able to understand it yet. It also doesn't mean we never will.
 
Old 06-27-2018, 09:47 AM   #126
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Quote:
I can't say if their real or fake, but very, very interesting none-the-less:
That is interesting considering It is now just past a half century, the politics going on now. As stated before, I'm one who has seen a UfO, heard it before I saw it, wasn't even looking at the sky when I first heard it, not only me but my two brothers and aunt saw it. The interesting part is the talk about time travel and the ones I saw, as I watched them seem to come and go in relationship to heat lighting that night. Still don't know if what I saw was man made or not, but this does give something to ponder.
 
Old 06-27-2018, 11:11 AM   #127
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Hey colorpurple!

I too have seen a UFO and no, I was not looking for one either and never expected to see it. I can still remember exactly what it was like to this very day. Still the same feelings as I had then... just completely dumbfounded in every way. Shocked, confused, amazed, you name it - I probably thought it that night. I'll never forgot it as long as I live.

I guess if the nukes start going off, then those videos are very real. That's all I can say about that really. FWIW, I can't see anything that jumps out making me believe they are fake. But once again, I can't say they are real either, I just don't know either way. I do know that my mind is still open either way. I think once people start closing their mind, they start closing it off to what could well be the truth (what ever that may be).

I'll be watching those videos again to see if anything does jump out at me tho.

Last edited by jsbjsb001; 06-27-2018 at 11:16 AM. Reason: typo
 
Old 06-28-2018, 12:26 AM   #128
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Somewhere around 1999-2000 my nephew who was around 23 at the time was asking me "Have you seen this guy David Blaine? He goes up to people on the street in broad daylight and turns around and LEVITATES!! His feet leave the ground. You can SEE it!". When I said "Wow! I can't wait to find out how he managed that illusion under those conditions" my nephew was a bit crestfallen and responded, "Maybe it is an illusion but I hope not because I want to believe it's true".

These are almost his exact words and later when it was found to be an illusion, a "magic trick", he was really bummed out about it, although years later I once heard him say about some altogether different event "Perception is reality" and I had to remind him of the difference between "subjective perception" and "objective evidence" by asking him if he should go to jail or be executed if someone "saw" him commit some crime at 5PM on Friday when he was in another state visiting his Mother and several friends and had receipts, photos, etc. to prove it.

This applies for example to the video in post #111 where one pilot saw a single object on radar while another saw a "whole fleet". Even if both reported, shoot! recorded the exact same thing that wouldn't rule out simpler conclusions than "alien craft" since artifacts, false positives and anomalies are not at all uncommon in radar especially at higher altitudes where spurious electromagnetic phenomenon are more common.

Now, you know that link I posted of how far radio waves have traveled in 100 years of continuous travel at light speed? For perspective, even disregarding the huge effect of mass increasing with velocity that results in your vehicle growing ever "heavier" and far more difficult to add speed to, light travels at 186,000 miles per second. Just recently resulting from a gravity assist slingshot trajectory around Jupiter, the Juno craft achieved the highest speed of any man-made object ever of 25 miles per second.... 186,000 vs/ 25.

That is 0.0001 (one ten thousandth or one hundredth of one percent - 0.01%) of the speed of light so take that picture of radio waves and shrink that blue dot to one ten thousandth of it's size in that picture and realize that would represent 100 years of continuous travel at the fastest speed mankind has ever achieved so far. THAT's a glimpse of how big Space is and how difficult it is to travel to other star systems. THAT is a wake up call at just how advanced a civilization that can achieve even near light speed would be from us. For such travel to become trivial enough to visit some "backwater planet" on a whim is another order of magnitude away since we would be about as interesting as algae is to us.... AND it may very well be impossible for any living thing with any technology to achieve even a small percentage of light speed.

Factor this is when considering the likelihood of any observation short of a vehicle landing on the White House lawn and aliens stepping off it with 100 cameras rolling actually being 'alien craft".

Last edited by enorbet; 06-28-2018 at 12:33 AM.
 
Old 06-28-2018, 06:46 AM   #129
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enorbet, I don't honestly doubt a lot of what you say above and I do absolutely agree that it's "objective evidence" that is paramount to finding the truth about anything - regardless of what subject matter it is we are talking about. I think we can both agree on that point. I have little doubt about that. But I think you have touched on the point I having been trying to make all along, which is the following: "...fastest speed mankind has ever achieved so far." I purposefully highlighted what I've been trying to say to you all along. The key words there are "so far", as in: what you say above (to my way of thinking - if that makes sense) is what we CURRENTLY THINK we know, now I'm not trying to imply that it's incorrect either. The point is: what we think we CURRENTLY KNOW and what else there might be to it, are NOT necessarily one of the same thing. If we pretend otherwise, then how do we ever come to learn new things? Make new discoveries? I don't believe that would be possible. Do you?

I once again maintain:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsbjsb001 View Post
...I was just making the point; that just because we don't understand something, it doesn't mean it's not real - it just means that we don't possess the knowledge to be able to understand it yet. It also doesn't mean we never will.
I'm sorry enorbet, but in order to be able to learn new things (about anything), we MUST keep our minds open to any new ideas. Now I can't claim to have ever seen an alien myself (apart from what are purportedly aliens in videos), I can't say that I've ever been abducted by any either. I can't say anything even remotely like that. Once again: it doesn't mean that it's never happened to someone else, I can't say it has or indeed that it hasn't. But once again; that is only what I know, doesn't mean it's never happened, just means I'VE never SEEN it happen.

So in conclusion to what I'm saying above; I don't think hiding behind what we CURRENTLY THINK we KNOW is conducive to finding truth in anything - regardless of the subject matter being discussed. Hopefully you can understand the point I'm making above - **not** trying to imply that you're dumb or even remotely stupid - I KNOW even trying to suggest that would be totally and utterly incorrect.

FWIW, I actually have a very healthy respect for your intelligence and knowledge (be it ICT or other knowledge), and I do enjoy discussing such matters with you. I would not even bother replying to you at all (or anyone else for that matter), if I thought you were less than smart.

Anyhow, I've also found another video, while it doesn't show what I'd describe as an "alien spaceship"; it does show something rather strange over Area 51. I think it also provides quite a fascinating perspective of Area 51 (or being near it). The "orb" in the following video is about 7:53 mins into it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8x-aL3x5Fk

Hopefully you find the above video as fascinating as I did.
 
Old 06-28-2018, 09:34 AM   #130
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Thank you jsbjsb001 for your kind and measured response. You demonstrate a cool head in that you obviously think before you "speak" and try to keep emotion out of your assessments. At the same time you display a level of open-mindedness that like you say, and I wholeheartedly agree, we risk stagnation if we ever assume we know it all.

One of the interesting tenets most scientists agree upon is that "the more we know, the more we are aware of what we don't know" so only an uneducated, foolishly arrogant person assumes that everything we think we know now will always stand. There are also other very specific issues about our understanding of some of the most basic applications in areas of knowledge that have withstood millennia of investigation. One example is the Stradivarius violin which at it's most fundamental is simply a wooden box that creates a resonant cavity and examples still exist that were constructed roughly 300 years ago. Regardless of the manner of investigation, following the most detailed historical analysis of where the components came from and how they were put together to deep microscopic analysis of not only the components but of the results in an attempt to duplicate the amazing vibrant sound of a Stradivarius. All we have accomplished so far is to "get close", really close actually but the problem is made more nebulous by "which Stradivarius do we try to copy?" since each one has slightly different characteristics that can be felt and heard.

Let's take that phenomenon and expand it to something a bit more complex. I watch a lot of shows and read a lot of books about Flight and I was interested by the comments from a pilot who got to fly a Messerschmidt ME-262 one of the very first jet fighters. The pilot was struck by how smooth it's flight and handling was. For whatever reason(s) I suppose his expectation was that being old and primitive by today's standards it would be "rickety" and he was surprised and impressed that was not so. Even decades later some jets were a bit "rickety". It's even possible that some designs yet to take place may, at least at one point during their development, result in a 'rickety" flight experience, that can be unhappy accident of systems design or just a matter of refinement and calibration BUT nobody should ever doubt that the engine will ignite and deliver thrust just as designed anymore than no musician should assume that any attempt at a Stradivarius copy will be awful sounding, let alone utterly silent. If you jump in the air you WILL fall back to earth despite David Blaine's "sleight of hand".

It is important as we agree to maintain an open mind but that cannot be a "blank check" or we risk behaving as if we know absolutely nothing (chaos) and that is just as arrogant and untrustworthy as assuming we know everything (stagnation). Open-mindedness needs to be constrained by the limits of the things we do know that seem incontrovertible. We may recognize that even some of those things may change given certain conditions but until we face those conditions we have to behave as if they will always seem incontrovertible or we lose any possibility of accuracy and effectiveness.

Regarding interstellar flight it may come to pass that the world of Star Trek ("Warp 5 - Engage!") may come to pass but, barring apocalypse, it is very unlikely that can occur for hundreds if not thousands of years and for one mind-numbing reason known since before humans were even human - to go faster takes more energy and more recently, to warp space takes even more. It is known with an amazing degree of accuracy how much energy can be extracted and utilized chemically from burning things. Only slightly less accurate is the amount of energy contained and released in nuclear fission and fusion. No change in technology can extract something that isn't there. The most condensed form of energy of which we have even the faintest of awareness is antimatter and so far we have only been able to create a few atoms of it because the energy required to make and contain it is astronomical, not to mention how important that containment is since a matter/antimatter annihilation yields from hundreds to thousands of times more energy than even nuclear fusion.

For perspective this means the awesome and terrifying power of Tsar Bomba (equivalent to 50 million tons of TNT) weighing in at 27 metric tons with somewhere around 500 pounds of "fuel" would be recreated with just a few ounces of anti-matter and because no massive propulsive force is required to initiate the reaction (a fission bomb propels the fusion portion in thermonuclear devices) the danger and consequences of any accidents is obviously ummm shall we say a heavy deterrent. This is why hundreds, thousands possibly even tens of thousands of years of technology development is likely necessary before mankind can harness antimatter power YET it would require tons of it just to get to even 10% of light speed !!!

Now certainly it is at least possible that some method of travel is so far removed from us that we don't even have the faintest of a first clue but that should be seen for what it is - even further down the road than antimatter power. It is likely my comparison to the relationship between humans and algae is way too liberal. Aliens traveling interstellar distances to visit us are more likely so far advanced from us that we have absolutely nothing to compare that to. No amount of current open-mindedness can overcome that difference. Imagination is hugely important but just because we can imagine a thing has little to no bearing on whether that thing is actually possible, let alone probable.

As for that latest video I was more interested in the comment section since the video carries zero meaning for me beyond that our military has facilities it thinks requires secrecy. There is no frame of reference whatsoever to gain anything from the "orb" beyond appearing as a point of light. Not even speculation let alone any conclusion can be drawn from that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carl Sagan
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence
PS: FWIW I do hate to "burst bubbles" and I recall how disappointed I was to find out how far away interstellar travel even at the most optimistic actually is, but I am not some stodgy old math professor. Among my family and friends I am labelled "A Dreamer".

Last edited by enorbet; 06-28-2018 at 09:37 AM.
 
Old 06-28-2018, 03:42 PM   #131
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enorbet, what are your thoughts on the many cave paintings, carvings etc... from around the world that have very similar depictions of "UFO's, aliens etc..." and that predate the influence that modern media could have played?
 
Old 06-28-2018, 09:01 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by ChuangTzu View Post
enorbet, what are your thoughts on the many cave paintings, carvings etc... from around the world that have very similar depictions of "UFO's, aliens etc..." and that predate the influence that modern media could have played?
I think some modern men interpret as a form of projection those paintings as UFOs and aliens since it is doubtful cave dwellers even realized "the lights in the sky" were other worlds. The level of superstition in early man is impossible for modern man to comprehend. I suspect people in modern times even those actually believing in demonic possession doesn't begin to scratch the surface of how primitive man viewed the world. BTW if you're referencing anything by von Daniken, that man is a nut case or a fraud... or both.
 
Old 06-29-2018, 11:49 AM   #133
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Thanks enorbet, I appreciate your comments.

Once again, you do honestly have some good and very valid points there, I do to a large extent agree once again. It certainly isn't progress that can be made overnight, and yes, I don't think we are particularly close to such developments yet myself. But I don't think we are as far away as your above post makes it sound either, I'm not expert enough to be able to say with any certainty to what degree though.

I'll give you an example of what I'm trying to say;

I remember when I was in high school in the late 1990's (I don't remember exactly which year it was) and I remember talking with one of the other kids about DVD burners. They where very new back then from what I can remember (nobody I knew actually had one), but I do distinctly remember the other kid saying something to the effect "you have a DVD burner!" (as in: wow you're the king!). I know that's a very simple example, but the point is: it was leaps and bounds beyond almost anything that has been in existence beforehand. We could also look at current processors (why not, it's a tech site right?), think about an i7 (8th generation) compared to say a 286 processor - a far faster and multi-core processor compared to the humble 286. My smartphone has at least a 1000 times more power than a 286 processor EVER had! The point: it hasn't been a long time historically speaking since the 286 was the best you could get, and by today's standards, it's an absolute joke! You can imagination saying to someone today "I've still got the 286", you know what the other person would say... "WHAT rock are you living under!!!".

I think the above example just goes to prove that technology has come a VERY long way in what's really once again a short space of time historically speaking. And it's not exactly going backwards anytime soon either. If we think about what people would have said before they put a man on the moon, "are you serious, you're going to fly into space and land a craft on the moon???", well guess what? They did just that!

The point is that, nobody would have even considered that to be even remotely possible at the time, and would have thought such an idea was just s*** nuts (for lack of better words). With the knowledge and technology we have today, it not just possible, it's a reality. But who would have thought that even possible let alone doable back then? Nobody!

Anyhow, thinking back to my own UFO experience, I can once again still remember it almost crystal clear today from start to finish. Particularly how I felt at the very time it happened. I can't tell you exactly WHAT it actually was for certainty, but I can tell you that seeing a UFO in a video is one thing, seeing one right before your very eyes is quite another. There is almost no comparison, almost none. And while I can't tell you exactly WHAT it was, I can tell you what it wasn't; it was not a plane, it was not a helicopter, it was not swamp gas, it was not a weather balloon, it was not my imagination, it was not anything even just similar, it did not behave in any way consistent with any aircraft I have ever seen in my life. I can also say that it was most certainly under some form of intelligent control. How does that kind of technology work? I can't say, have no freaking idea.

I can tell you and I've probably thought about this hundreds of times now, it was either something very, very advanced that has not been disclosed to the public or it was something out of this world. If you asked me to guess, and based solely on what I DID see and nothing else, yes, the only explanation I can think of that WOULD go anyway what-so-ever to explaining it would be some kind of ET craft not from this world. I CAN say that I know I'm not the only one who has seen it, as I have seen one of those compilation YouTube videos that clearly depicts what I saw that night in 2013. I can also tell you that hand on heart, I saw this video AFTER the fact and NOT before the fact. I'm referring to my post #17 for the details of what I saw that night.

As far as the three videos are concerned that I linked before in post #121; I have watched them all again to see if I could spot any defects that might debunk the idea of them being real, and I still cannot see anything in them that makes me have doubts about their authenticity. Although, once again I still can't say they are real either, I'm still just not sure either way. I will say that. But I do once again have to say that, they are either very fake or very real, but I still don't know which way to jump just yet. I can say that I'll be doing some more research on them though.

Maybe colorpurple21859 can relate when I say that seeing something like that (a UFO that is) in person rather than just in some video, are two very different things, maybe you can too, I don't know...
 
Old 06-29-2018, 08:07 PM   #134
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Apparently I have failed to impress upon you the scale of what we are talking about here. We are not talking about improving something we already have as in the example of DVD Burners. I will try one more time.

OK I just mentioned the Juno craft as the fastest moving man made object ever but bringing up a fairly close second is the Pioneer I craft launched in 1977 which, traveling at 12 miles per seccond in 2013 became the first man made object to leave the heliosphere, the magnetic influence of our star, the Sun. At that speed it, or anything moving at that speed, could reach the very nearest star to us in approximately 40,000 years. Don't just blow by that term. 40,000 years. It is reality at least at Pioneer 1 speed. At Juno speed it is still 20,000 years. Try to imagine how long it might take for mankind to achieve 10 times that speed and we are still talking 2,000 years.

If that wasn't daunting enough here's the kicker. These speeds of both Pioneer and Juno were not achieved by amazing engine design but by gravity assist or the "slingshot effect" and Juno at 25 miles per second has reached nearly the upper limit of what is possible from within our solar system. So you see it isn't a matter of extending existing technology it's entirely new because Chemical rockets are marginal even for manned flights to Mars. Nuclear rockets could reduce that time roughly in half but we are talking about 7-8 miles per second, less that a third of what Juno achieved via Jupiter slingshot.

To have an engine that can leave anytime and not have to wait possibly decades for proper planetary alignment and exceed 25 miles per second we are in antimatter territory where literally none of the technologies exist for any amounts larger than a few atoms worth but let's say for the sake of discussion we manage to crack that problem and can safely manage a few pounds of antimatter and let's go really crazy into fantasy land and assume we can accomplish that in under 200 years and further that somehow we discover how to increase efficiency so greatly that a few pounds is then capable of propelling us to 10% Light Speed. We gain a huge improvement over 40,000 years to reach the nearest star but it is still 40-50 years one way.

Tell me what one's lifespan would have to be to consider a 40 year trip routine and practical? and that's leaning on unimaginable breakthroughs of completely new technology even assuming those are actually even physically possible.

FWIW I am saddened to have to relate these realities. I truly wish it were not so. I want interstellar travel to be not only possible but as routine as Science Fiction makes it all seem. That, is unfortunately a very very long way off if even possible at all. That possibility is by no means a given.

Last edited by enorbet; 06-29-2018 at 08:12 PM.
 
Old 06-30-2018, 05:28 AM   #135
jsbjsb001
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I did say that was a simple example, I wasn't trying to say it's the same thing. It also wasn't the only example I gave either. The second example is a good one - about the development of processors.

But I did find something that I think is right up your alley. While it's not necessarily about UFO's per se, it's kinda related. I think it could exlpain at least *some* things; I would be very interested in your thoughts on the matter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fVF4T0OXHkU

It seems to me that Nature might hold at least some of the answers, it seems to have something to do with magnetism.

I also done some more research into Scopolamine; it seems that if enough is administered, it can cause a overdose and if you watch the third video I linked in post #121, they flash the "being" with bright light. They also say before that (in the second video) "If you don't answer, I'll administer another round of Scopolamine", which imply's that they are deliberately and knowingly overdosing it, knowing that this will cause an overdose, and more precisely a bad reaction. The "being" clearly finds it uncomfortable, it also says in the Wikipedia page the following for scopolamine;

Quote:
The symptoms of overdose include:[20][21]

Tachycardia
Arrhythmia
Blurred vision
Photophobia
Urinary retention
Drowsiness or paradoxical reaction which can present with hallucinations
Cheyne-Stokes respiration
Dry mouth
Skin reddening
Inhibition of gastrointestinal motility
What I've highlighted above would explain the reaction to the light. Could those videos still be fakes, possibly, but that also adds weight to the idea they could be real too. Once again, I'm not trying to say the above does make them real beyond a reasonable doubt, but interesting none-the-less.
 
  


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