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Old 11-13-2018, 08:15 AM   #31
mikudo
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I was referring to times past in the US, where other gaslighting, backstabbing, manipulation and thinly masked tyranny and abuse are the norm, and hoping that wouldn't happen here.

Bullys and manipulative people will *always*(ALWAYS) attempt however to make it seem like the person they are attacking is the one who started it. People on top of the power structure will always make their abusive actions seem like some sort of common good even when it is selfish.

This was their request that I do a bunch of stuff to help them with their insignificant superficial asthetic problem, and because I am nice I did it. I have moved my seat, now I in direct sunlight that is actually leaving streaks on the inside of my eyes, people who wanted their pretty view of the parking lot have what they wanted without having to do anything at all besides passive aggressively whine, and some people here on LQ are saying I'm 'playing the victim' when I am calling other people selfish manipulative assholes with priorities from some other planet. This whole thing is because people want the community shading apparatus 2 feet higher than I required to be comfortable.

I refuse to see the world in such a way that I am somehow the cause of this or that I haven't made any comprimises.

If after your 20th comprimise and outgoing effort, the other party hasnt made a single one, and they are STILL calling you difficult, well what is the point of making the 21st comprimise?

Youre just dealing with jerks, or worse.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 08:30 AM   #32
TB0ne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
I was referring to times past in the US, where other gaslighting, backstabbing, manipulation and thinly masked tyranny and abuse are the norm, and hoping that wouldn't happen here.

Bullys and manipulative people will *always*(ALWAYS) attempt however to make it seem like the person they are attacking is the one who started it. People on top of the power structure will always make their abusive actions seem like some sort of common good even when it is selfish.

This was their request that I do a bunch of stuff to help them with their insignificant superficial asthetic problem, and because I am nice I did it. I have moved my seat, now I in direct sunlight that is actually leaving streaks on the inside of my eyes, people who wanted their pretty view of the parking lot have what they wanted without having to do anything at all besides passive aggressively whine, and some people here on LQ are saying I'm 'playing the victim' when I am calling other people selfish manipulative assholes with priorities from some other planet. This whole thing is because people want the community shading apparatus 2 feet higher than I required to be comfortable.
Really?? Did you read what you posted here??? You're complaining about others "insignificant superficial asthetic problems"....then say the "shading apparatus 2 feet higher than I required to be comfortable" (bold added for emphasis only). So YOUR comfort and desires (and lets be honest here...it is a DESIRE, not a NEED) outweigh others?? But somehow everyone else in your office is wrong, and you're right? Others should move around to make YOU happy, but you having to move is somehow arduous?

How about the whole story? How long has everyone else been there, versus how long have you been there? And again...why does NO ONE ELSE seem to have a problem in the same set of offices, but you do? Why is that it's not your problem alone, when again, YOU are the only one who is 'suffering'??
Quote:
I refuse to see the world in such a way that I am somehow the cause of this or that I haven't made any comprimises. If after your 20th comprimise and outgoing effort, the other party hasnt made a single one, and they are STILL calling you difficult, well what is the point of making the 21st comprimise? Youre just dealing with jerks, or worse.
What 'compromises' have you made? Because as of yet, you haven't mentioned any, except for wanting 'scientific studies' to FORCE others to do what you want, because of your 'requirement' to be comfortable? You're not at home...you're at a shared workplace. As said, your options are:
  • Act like a grown adult, stand up for yourself, and deal with your coworkers
  • Go to HR with your 'studies', and have them deal with it (which WILL make things worse in the long run)
  • Pack your stuff and quit
 
Old 11-13-2018, 09:15 AM   #33
mikudo
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I could answer those questions with the specifics but I really doubt it will do any good at this point. The interns just put up with the air traffic control style windows by taping sheets of paper on the windows and moving them every 30 minutes. Another employee likes the shades down, just not quite so far as was required to keep open sky from being directly behind my display.

I designed modifications for the shades that would require minimal effort to simply block the shades from coming down at a desired point at each specific window, over the weekend, and provided them, I offered to talk to the building manager, I moved to a desk where I knew the problem would be worse, I drew out other ways to arrange my desk and other suggestions for curtains.

Do you have any other accusations against me personally that I will need to put to rest?

I am asking for a workplace without glare on my display and without bright daylight directly behind my display, this is a reasonable request, like a chair and desk that doesnt hurt my wrist or back.

I started this thread because the problem is more difficult than it appears, my freedom ends where yours begins and visa versa, eye damage is a part of my body I can no longer sell without risk of being unable to work at all whatsoever at some point before retirement(lol if that is still legal when the time comes), so people can look over their shoulder at a parking lot with 15 degrees than what would require to protect my eyes and make me completely normal and comfortable. They are the ones who brought it up that I shouldnt bring the shades down so much, shades which were built with this specific purpose in mind I am using them for. I can think of ten ways any of these people could get more light at their desks that they wont consider because it means them having to do something themselves rather than me.

None of you have convinced me there is something wrong with my position or that the other position is reasonable, although there has been some perspective and suggestions that are correct and useable.

Does anyone else want to personally attack me for daring to stand up for the health of my eyes and demand a basic level of comfort at the desk I am to sit at for hundreds or thousands of hours? Anyone else want to dismiss the entire discussion as pointless? Anyone else want to refuse to see a dynamic that affects probably a tens of millions of people this very second?

The last from dugan and tbone have been them repeating themselves.

But Im not answering any more 'the problem is all you dude'.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 09:26 AM   #34
dugan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
I am not the only person in the office bothered by the lighting
Quote:
Originally Posted by dugan View Post
If other people in your company had your problem, then I might have suggested collective action, but that's not the case).
This is the first time you've mentioned that there's anyone else in the office bothered by the lighting. But in that case, I've already addressed it.

Take collective action with that person.

Oh, and the "leap of logic" I thought you were referring to was: "Humans have bodies that are damaged by bright lights" (you said that), "Some of my co workers have made clear that their bodies are not damaged by bright lights", (you definitely said that). THEREFORE "some of my co-workers are not human". Sure still seems to imply that to me.

Last edited by dugan; 11-13-2018 at 09:50 AM.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 09:30 AM   #35
dugan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
I can think of ten ways any of these people could get more light at their desks that they wont consider because it means them having to do something themselves rather than me.

[snip middle of same quote]

But Im not answering any more 'the problem is all you dude'.
I know you don't see that this speaks for itself, but I'm pretty sure everyone else does.

Last edited by dugan; 11-13-2018 at 09:35 AM.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 09:43 AM   #36
dugan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
Also, I will add that it is a definite pattern I detect that whenever someone makes a specific criticism of a system, that someone always shows up and says that the problem is just with you.

And that person will always direct any attention away from systemic analysis, or any analysis of what is freedom or slavery, true or false, the problem is just you. Just lay down and let people walk all over you, that will solve all your problems. Just ignore the things that you know are real in your head, trust us, see a doctor. All of your points and arguments and evidence are categorically wrong and will never actually be addressed. They pick out two things you said, pull them out of context and reduce everything you are saying to that.

I've seen this all before many many times, a very peculiar pattern indeed....
And each time you saw it happen:, in the U.S, in the unidentified country you're in now, and now here, there was something common in the pattern. The thing common to all of those occurrences was that you were involved.

Amirite?

Last edited by dugan; 11-13-2018 at 12:37 PM.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 09:58 AM   #37
dugan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
fwiw my team and I found a good compromise, I will move to a different window bank and that bank will be allowed to be kept shaded.
Hey, wasn't that what I recommended in my first response to this thread?

Last edited by dugan; 11-13-2018 at 10:13 AM.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 10:00 AM   #38
cynwulf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
Open question to the community [etc]
I have now learnt from this very thread, to think twice before asking this "community" an "open question"...
 
Old 11-13-2018, 10:04 AM   #39
dugan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
You should check out that link above to the occupational human services office in canada where people have some rights, that proves unequivocally that desktop lighting is a health concern and not a 'personal' concern. The one you think doesnt exist, maybe you missed the purple hyperlink.
Those guidelines say what I did: that it is your own responsibility to get regular eye checkups and, if necessary, (new) glasses. You know, the recommendation to see a doctor? The one you didn't want to listen to because it implied that you were the one with the problem?

Here, you're (generally) only allowed to ask for systemic or organizational changes after you've exhausted what you can do to resolve the problem.

I know you're going to say that I took that part out of context, or that I'm ignoring some other part of it, but neither is the case. This is actually the only part that's relevant to you right now.

Last edited by dugan; 11-13-2018 at 03:25 PM.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 01:31 PM   #40
TB0ne
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikudo View Post
I could answer those questions with the specifics but I really doubt it will do any good at this point. The interns just put up with the air traffic control style windows by taping sheets of paper on the windows and moving them every 30 minutes. Another employee likes the shades down, just not quite so far as was required to keep open sky from being directly behind my display.
Again, with 'required'...'required' by WHO?? Only you, apparently. And answering those questions about seniority, etc., IS pertinent to the entire discussion. If you've been there two months, and honestly expect to move people around because you are uncomfortable....good luck with that.
Quote:
I designed modifications for the shades that would require minimal effort to simply block the shades from coming down at a desired point at each specific window, over the weekend, and provided them, I offered to talk to the building manager, I moved to a desk where I knew the problem would be worse, I drew out other ways to arrange my desk and other suggestions for curtains.
So why didn't you just rearrange your desk? And you intentionally moved to where you knew it would be worse, and are now complaining about it??
Quote:
Do you have any other accusations against me personally that I will need to put to rest? I am asking for a workplace without glare on my display and without bright daylight directly behind my display, this is a reasonable request, like a chair and desk that doesnt hurt my wrist or back.
And *AGAIN* you are asking the wrong people. Go to HR/Boss at your company...there is ZERO we can do here. If you're looking for affirmation that yes, you are being tortured by these inhumane working conditions (natural light), there isn't much we can tell you.
Quote:
I started this thread because the problem is more difficult than it appears, my freedom ends where yours begins and visa versa, eye damage is a part of my body I can no longer sell without risk of being unable to work at all whatsoever at some point before retirement(lol if that is still legal when the time comes), so people can look over their shoulder at a parking lot with 15 degrees than what would require to protect my eyes and make me completely normal and comfortable. They are the ones who brought it up that I shouldnt bring the shades down so much, shades which were built with this specific purpose in mind I am using them for. I can think of ten ways any of these people could get more light at their desks that they wont consider because it means them having to do something themselves rather than me.
So then TELL THEM THAT, and again, act like a grown up. Whining about it does zero...go and do something, or pack up and quit.
Quote:
None of you have convinced me there is something wrong with my position or that the other position is reasonable, although there has been some perspective and suggestions that are correct and useable.

Does anyone else want to personally attack me for daring to stand up for the health of my eyes and demand a basic level of comfort at the desk I am to sit at for hundreds or thousands of hours? Anyone else want to dismiss the entire discussion as pointless? Anyone else want to refuse to see a dynamic that affects probably a tens of millions of people this very second? The last from dugan and tbone have been them repeating themselves. But Im not answering any more 'the problem is all you dude'.
The problem IS yours, sorry. You seem to continue to play the victim here; statements like "where other gaslighting, backstabbing, manipulation and thinly masked tyranny and abuse are the norm, and hoping that wouldn't happen here.", say so. If no matter where you went, you were subject to all of these things, over and over....the only commonality is you. If you expect everyone around you to bend over and give you everything you want, just because you're slightly uncomfortable, you are going to be sorely disappointed with pretty much everything in your life. Again:
  • Got health issues? See a doctor and ask them.
  • Got workplace complaints? See your boss/HR
  • Got issues with your co-workers? Grow up and go talk to them like adults, rather than going on about how this is so unhealthy/etc. Ever try just going "Guys, from where I'm sitting, I can hardly see my screen most of the day. Would you mind if we close the blinds a bit more in the morning/afternoon?"

Last edited by TB0ne; 11-13-2018 at 01:34 PM.
 
Old 11-13-2018, 03:17 PM   #41
dugan
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Well, yeah, TB0ne, but you're not allowed to point out that there are any steps he could take at all. Any option that exists would imply, by its existence, that the problem is him, and that's simply not acceptable.

Last edited by dugan; 11-13-2018 at 07:27 PM.
 
  


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