LinuxQuestions.org
Latest LQ Deal: Complete CCNA, CCNP & Red Hat Certification Training Bundle
Go Back   LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Non-*NIX Forums > General
User Name
Password
General This forum is for non-technical general discussion which can include both Linux and non-Linux topics. Have fun!

Notices


Reply
  Search this Thread
Old 03-20-2018, 02:17 AM   #1
ondoho
LQ Addict
 
Registered: Dec 2013
Posts: 7,952
Blog Entries: 5

Rep: Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914
Cambridge Analytica


instead of relying on my poor editorial capabilities, just see for yourselves.

it has been a major news story both on an american populist radio station, and a rather serious german radio.
of course those are only my sources; i bet the news coverage is huge, but i mention this because these are rather opposite content providers, and if they both cover it extensively & critically, that means something in itself.

this is only the tip of the iceberg.
or wrong, the whole story is about revealing what hides underneath the tip of this particular iceberg.
so, this is only one of many icebergs of which we only see the tip.

what i remember from the report i heard:
companies like these (i don't belive that lancing this particular boil is the end of the story) influenced the outcomes of various elections.
read up on the techniques on the wikipedia article or elsewhere - that in itself is quite mindboggling and repulsive. and it isn't even illegal per se.
facebook knew about this. but now that someone blew the whistle, they're acting all surprised and disgusted.

etc. - don't take my word for it, go read/listen if you haven't already.

everybody who knows about this story and continues their "so-what-i-have-nothing-to-hide" attitude when someone criticizes social media, should be severely admonished and ridiculed.
which would be a fair share of the population i guess :-(

Last edited by ondoho; 03-21-2018 at 12:46 AM. Reason: removed agressive remark involving capital punishment
 
Old 03-20-2018, 03:16 AM   #2
Turbocapitalist
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2005
Distribution: Ubuntu, Devuan, OpenBSD
Posts: 2,969
Blog Entries: 3

Rep: Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290Reputation: 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by ondoho View Post
this is only the tip of the iceberg
Yes it is really very big but will eventually get brushed under the rug.

Fools and tools upload petabytes voluntarily about themselves, ratting on their friends and acquaintances in the process. Beyond that, Facebook buys in all kinds of additional data from anywhere it can get it. It also has a slew of webbugs and trackers, ranging from small images to embedded javascripts. Then on top of all that it does automated analysis to draw connections and conclusions, inferring additional data about its marks.

What's not yet being asked is what Facebook was doing accumulating and aggregating all that data. Data like that is normally a business liability and Zuckerberg and his minions are trying to spin the situation to look like that, lying that it was a data breach. It was not. A closer look needs to be taken at their basic business model which.

The real reason the topic will be controversial to investigate is that it is a surveillance gold mine for various agencies within the world's governments, not just large companies that pay to rent access to the data.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 03:19 AM   #3
jsbjsb001
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Somewhere on earth? Maybe I'm a figment of your imagination?
Distribution: A number of them over the years...
Posts: 1,193

Rep: Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609
And Trump goes on about Hillary's email server, when his campaign is using people's Facebook profile info for targeted ads against Hillary aka, HRC.

You just can't trust anyone. Let's "drain the swamp" hey... Which one?
 
Old 03-20-2018, 03:32 AM   #4
agillator
Member
 
Registered: Aug 2016
Posts: 122

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Why is anyone surprised? You put information about yourself out there and expect people to not see it and use it? As someone recently pointed out, the 'cloud' everyone is so enamoured of is simply someone else's computer. And of course the fox will be glad to guard the henhouse for you he says as he tries to hide the feathers in his mouth. I'm sorry, but I have little sympathy for those who are upset about all this. They have left themselves open to this sort of thing. It doesn't excuse what others have done or mean that they should not suffer the consequences, but please . . . . The fault starts with the individual. Remember a secret shared with one other person is no longer a secret.

Food for thought: when law enforcement, prospective employers or anyone else wants to know about you what is the first thing they do? And you are shocked that they don't believe that you don't drink when you posted those photos from last Saturday night? We fail to teach ourselves and our kids to not put anything in writing or 'on the net' you don't want to see made public twenty years later and then get upset when it shows up. Remember when you point your finger at someone you have three pointing back at yourself. As Pogo said, "We have met the enemy and he is us."

So get upset, rant and rave, pass more laws, even send people to jail if you want to. But if you really want to do some good treat the cause, not the symptom. Otherwise nothing changes.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 03:46 AM   #5
cynwulf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2005
Location: Walsall, England
Posts: 2,061

Rep: Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121
As ever it's back to the same old thing: You have no idea where your data goes and what it's used for and if what you "delete" actually gets deleted. People accept this, subscribe to this and ignore all the signs, so what can you do...

https://www.theguardian.com/news/201...er-data-breach
 
Old 03-20-2018, 03:57 AM   #6
jsbjsb001
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Somewhere on earth? Maybe I'm a figment of your imagination?
Distribution: A number of them over the years...
Posts: 1,193

Rep: Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609
Quote:
Originally Posted by agillator View Post
Why is anyone surprised?...
I'm not, but that's beside the point. The point is that, it just goes to show, if you have $$$$ you can do almost anything you want and in at least some places... ANYTHING you want! Therefore unless you have a big bank account, you're just a second class citizen. That's why people need to rise up and be counted. And not just a couple of people or whatever either.

But, unfortunately there are just too many people that are happy to complain but are too gutless to stand up and be counted.

I could tell a story there, but I'd probably get another Infraction if I did...
 
Old 03-20-2018, 06:31 AM   #7
enorbet
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jun 2003
Location: Virginia
Distribution: Slackware = Main OpSys for decades while testing others to keep up
Posts: 1,774

Rep: Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662Reputation: 1662
Ah cool... i'm probably not crazy paranoid for never joining Facebilk.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 07:50 AM   #8
cynwulf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2005
Location: Walsall, England
Posts: 2,061

Rep: Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsbjsb001 View Post
I'm not, but that's beside the point. The point is that, it just goes to show, if you have $$$$ you can do almost anything you want and in at least some places... ANYTHING you want! Therefore unless you have a big bank account, you're just a second class citizen.
You are absolutely right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsbjsb001 View Post
That's why people need to rise up and be counted. And not just a couple of people or whatever either.

But, unfortunately there are just too many people that are happy to complain but are too gutless to stand up and be counted.
Any uprising has to start with some discontent and murmuring... historically this is how it happened. It didn't happen with one person just going out and doing something silly. It's a domino/snowball effect.

It could be argued, that your condemnation of people as "gutless", for not standing up to be counted is also just "words" on a web forum. It's really not so different to any other kind of complaining/finger pointing (and doing nothing about it).

In this age of 1984-esque goings on, with many aspects of society very much controlled, it's very likely that "pitchforks" won't come out for this type of thing, as it's not deemed important enough. People have simply become acclimatised to having their data misappropriated and the companies involved can usually "apologise" find a scapegoat and/or lay the blame at the feet of some 3rd party. Worst case: That company goes down and the masses eagerly move onto the next Big Brother platform.

Just as they have become accustomed to and accepting of politicians who quite simply lie and repeat the same lies over and over, until they are simply accepted as truth by the vast majority. It all blows over rather quickly, buried in the next run of sensationalist news, it's forgotten and the later contradictions and revisions (or retractions) go largely unnoticed. People have simply come to accept that big business is on the whole unethical, greedy, corrupt and inept and that's "just life". And many work for such corporations - or would do if sufficient remuneration were on offer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jsbjsb001 View Post
I could tell a story there, but I'd probably get another Infraction if I did...
Somewhat ironic.

Last edited by cynwulf; 03-20-2018 at 07:54 AM.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 08:04 AM   #9
jsbjsb001
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Somewhere on earth? Maybe I'm a figment of your imagination?
Distribution: A number of them over the years...
Posts: 1,193

Rep: Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609
Quote:
Originally Posted by cynwulf View Post
...
Any uprising has to start with some discontent and murmuring... historically this is how it happened. It didn't happen with one person just going out and doing something silly. It's a domino/snowball effect.

It could be argued, that your condemnation of people as "gutless", for not standing up to be counted is also just "words" on a web forum. It's really not so different to any other kind of complaining/finger pointing (and doing nothing about it).
Don't get me wrong, to certain extent (and as you rightfully point out), I can understand it's just much easier for people to accept things the way they are, rather than stand up and be counted. But at the same time (as I'm sure you understand), if we let particularly the politicians get away with it, nothing is going to change. That's a proven fact. And this topic serves as a prime example of that - particularly post #4. That's why I pointed this out before.

Quote:
In this age of 1984-esque goings on, with many aspects of society very much controlled, it's very likely that "pitchforks" won't come out for this type of thing, as it's not deemed important enough. People have simply become acclimatised to having their data misappropriated and the companies involved can usually "apologise" find a scapegoat and/or lay the blame at the feet of some 3rd party. Worst case: That company goes down and the masses eagerly move onto the next Big Brother platform.

Just as they have become accustomed to and accepting of politicians who quite simply lie and repeat the same lies over and over, until they are simply accepted as truth by the vast majority. It all blows over rather quickly, buried in the next run of sensationalist news, it's forgotten and the later contradictions and revisions (or retractions) go largely unnoticed. People have simply come to accept that big business is on the whole unethical, greedy, corrupt and inept and that's "just life". And the majority work for such corporations - or would do if sufficient remuneration were on offer.
Absolutely nailed it cynwulf - I can see you are student of history.

Quote:
Somewhat ironic.
Yep, it's funny how things come full circle, isn't it? But seriously, while I'm sure I'm far from the only one, you would not believe the half of it - then again maybe you would. I often wonder how or why I'm even still on this earth, put it that way.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 08:28 AM   #10
sundialsvcs
LQ Guru
 
Registered: Feb 2004
Location: SE Tennessee, USA
Distribution: Gentoo, LFS
Posts: 9,077
Blog Entries: 4

Rep: Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164Reputation: 3164
The next book now being written by crypto expert Bruce Schneier (I always have to look-up how to spell that man's last name!) will be about "security in the world of things."

Every previous advance in electronic communication – telegraph, teletype, telephone – was immediately accompanied by a body of laws which defined things like "wiretapping." Communications carriers were defined as "common carriers." They carried the communications but did not examine it or keep it, except when expressly authorized to do so by court order. And yet, with regards to the Internet, there are no such laws YET.

But, mark my words – they are coming. And they will be international laws, established by world-wide treaties as well as domestic legislation in various countries. Companies like Amazon, Apple, Facebook, Google, and many others who right now collect and broker personal information will be prohibited by law from doing so. Some of them will adapt to this – others will fade out of the picture.

I desperately hope that the impetus for these laws will not be "horrible crimes." Acts of terrorism that will inflict pure-terror because they will occur "in the 'privacy' (sic) of your own home." (For instance, on one horrible night, children are murdered in their beds by criminals who know that they are "home alone." Then someone thinks to plot the locations of these crimes on a map, and they form the unmistakable shape of a scimitar.)

I don't like dreaming-up thriller plots like this one.

This will also permanently affect our "happy little cloud," and even the present practice of "importing" cheap labor under non-immigrant visas from "who cares where, as long as they work cheap." (A man forgets his jacket at airport immigration. A tiny silicon chip falls out. The coat is found to be filled with memory chips removed from "flash" drives. There are several terabytes of encrypted information in that innocent-looking and stylish jacket. Its owner has disappeared back in his home country. These things don't show up on X-ray machines. A desperate search is begun.) Suddenly, people will care "where in the world their data is," and exactly who has access to it.

- - -
I don't place much credence on the insistence about "influencing elections." To me, that's nothing more and nothing less than ##CENSORED## and perhaps the usual ##CENSORED##. Any fool can have an interest in the outcome of any election in any country, and today, any fool can comment about it. Especially when one or both of the candidates in that election are also ##CENSORED##! What the media doesn't like about it is that these are (usually) people talking directly(!) to one another, and big-money can't ##CENSORED##. (Like it or not, "Hillary ##CENSORED##!")

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 03-20-2018 at 08:36 AM.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 08:50 AM   #11
hazel
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2016
Location: Harrow, UK
Distribution: Debian, Crux, LFS, AntiX, NuTyX
Posts: 1,823
Blog Entries: 3

Rep: Reputation: 768Reputation: 768Reputation: 768Reputation: 768Reputation: 768Reputation: 768Reputation: 768
You know the saying: if you can't see what product they are selling, you're the product!

The UK Information Commissioner is applying for a warrant to search Cambridge Analytica. They can do this of course because Analytica is a British company. And the University is apparently evicting them from its property.

I suspect Parliament will have a harder task compelling Mark Zuckerberg to appear before them. He will probably just tell them to whistle. They can't just arrest an American for contempt and lock him in the clock tower.

Last edited by hazel; 03-20-2018 at 08:51 AM.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 09:58 AM   #12
cynwulf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2005
Location: Walsall, England
Posts: 2,061

Rep: Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121Reputation: 1121
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsbjsb001 View Post
Don't get me wrong, to certain extent (and as you rightfully point out), I can understand it's just much easier for people to accept things the way they are, rather than stand up and be counted. But at the same time (as I'm sure you understand), if we let particularly the politicians get away with it, nothing is going to change. That's a proven fact. And this topic serves as a prime example of that - particularly post #4. That's why I pointed this out before.
Since the word "celebrity" came to the fore, young people have very different aspirations (say compared to "militant students" of previous generations). I am continually bemused by young people who spend more time/effort on grooming, fashion, tattoos, piercings and make up and who suffer angst over the trivial things in life rather than having views about what really matters and what is going on under their very noses... but given how things have developed and how priorities have altered, it's hardly surprising to me, but probably nothing out of the ordinary to those born into these times, that things are in this current state.

These are the people who would be lost without their smartphone and who have been convinced by "popular culture" that it's perfectly acceptable to put a piece of electronics importance well above a fellow human being's. This is their "connection" to "the world" - the world they're already walking about in - and missing out on.

All of this is "driven" by the "social networking phenomenon" and for many it has replaced email as the primary means of electronic communication (and seems to be replacing actually talking to people as well...). From my perspective, as an observer only (who has never owned a smartphone or registered on a social network), aside from business people, these devices are only used as cameras and for "social networks" and games. I cannot see this latest "scandal" or any subsequent scandals for that matter, having any impact on usage.

Politics is mostly being left to representatives of a particular class - namely a mix of the middle and upper class (both vying against each other to better push their chosen agendas). The "rest of us", do not have the time or resources to take it on. We worry about where the money for the next energy bill is going to come from and the simple things in life such as choosing between heating our homes or buying food.

Data is just being left to chance, or "the cloud"...

Those who do care in some measure, "complain" (or make their voices heard). They do this on the web (that medium where the banal also flaunt their new tattoos, manicures and handbags and discuss others' private lives in great detail).
 
Old 03-20-2018, 10:54 AM   #13
jsbjsb001
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Somewhere on earth? Maybe I'm a figment of your imagination?
Distribution: A number of them over the years...
Posts: 1,193

Rep: Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609Reputation: 609
I will admit that I once had a Facebook account, but I requested that it be deleted and have not looked back since. I've never had any other "social media" accounts before - other than my gmail account that you can use with Google+ I believe - I never have used it for that tho.

Found something interesting;

Quote:
"I hadnít anticipated the level of noise," principal Pitsa Binnion said.
"There was laughter, people were actually interacting and socialising."
From https://www.theage.com.au/national/v...20-p4z0zq.html

I think the above just goes to prove your point about smartphones.
 
Old 03-20-2018, 12:20 PM   #14
DavidMcCann
Senior Member
 
Registered: Jul 2006
Location: London
Distribution: CentOS, Xubuntu
Posts: 4,866

Rep: Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597Reputation: 1597
This wasn't a case of Facebook selling their data. Professor Aleksandr Kogan designed an app to harvest data with the consent of the users who were told it was an academic research program; they believed it as Kogan was a professor at Cambridge. Facebook also believed that he had abided by their rule to transfer the data to a third party. Facebook have now banned CA and Kogan.

CA is facing an investigation which could lead to prosecution, since our data protection laws are stricter that those of the US. A video has now emerged of Alexander Nix, the head of CA, offering to organise bribery and sexual entrapment: unfortunately for him, he didn't know that he was being filmed and that the man he was talking to was a reporter. Mercer and Bannon should have stuck to working in the USA: as the old song goes, "You can do that in America, but you can't do that there here!"
 
Old 03-20-2018, 12:39 PM   #15
ondoho
LQ Addict
 
Registered: Dec 2013
Posts: 7,952
Blog Entries: 5

Original Poster
Rep: Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914Reputation: 1914
^ thank you for adding some fact to the mix.
unfortunately i'm not very good at summarizing...

thank you to many others for regurgitating the same platitudes that we - conscious and critical internet users and "nerds" - have already heard a hundred times.

but this is not about us - this is about breaking the surface of what can be dismissed as "IT news" by deliberately ignorant fb-lusers and touches on a sensitive nerve - the democratic election.
that's why i'm all over this, it strengthens my argument against social media with those friends and colleagues that don't really care about it ("yeah, i'm vaguely aware of privacy issues, but FB & gmail is for free, and all my friends are on it, so of course i'm using it, it's not like i'm posting anything sensitive").
even more, they might already have heard about it from elsewhere but me
 
  


Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cambridge Audio DAC TNTTNT Linux - Hardware 1 10-15-2014 03:47 PM
a few hiccups with Cambridge baerb8 Linux - Newbie 4 11-29-2008 11:03 AM
Cambridge Area-Physically Challenged Andavane LinuxQuestions.org Member Intro 4 04-01-2007 04:21 PM
hi all - Cambridge UK newbie here droyoliver LinuxQuestions.org Member Intro 1 03-29-2007 08:09 AM
hello from Cambridge MA jnorvell LinuxQuestions.org Member Intro 2 08-01-2005 04:29 PM

LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Non-*NIX Forums > General

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:03 AM.

Main Menu
Advertisement
My LQ
Write for LQ
LinuxQuestions.org is looking for people interested in writing Editorials, Articles, Reviews, and more. If you'd like to contribute content, let us know.
Main Menu
Syndicate
RSS1  Latest Threads
RSS1  LQ News
Twitter: @linuxquestions
Facebook: linuxquestions Google+: linuxquestions
Open Source Consulting | Domain Registration