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Old 07-08-2016, 07:08 AM   #181
sundialsvcs
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... but the effective penalty for not doing so is about $500.00, which is far less than a healthy person would pay for medical insurance that (he gambles ...) he doesn't need. Therefore, this toothless law didn't cause people to buy insurance.

There is a bill afoot that would relieve hospitals of the legal obligation to treat you. That would save a lot of lost profits for hospitals, who could then refuse to treat you, or to perform services (although you need them ...) which you can't pay their price for. Hospitals want to keep "those who can pay" in the hospital for as many days as Revenue Management determines their Insurance Company will pay for, and they don't want to treat anyone who hasn't got the money to let them be treated p-r-o-f-i-t-a-b-l-y.

In many ways, this thing reminds me of many things that also went wrong with the EU experiment. Suddenly, it was all about "business," not "countries." Health care (sic) in America stopped being about "people." Education, and the chance to better yourself, also became a matter of "profit." (They were going after Federal money that used to be applied to education, and they took it all.) It wasn't until "Merrie Olde Englande" did what she finally did, that anyone has raised up a loud-enough voice against these mad "necessities" of profit and globalization and the removal of both identity and control. These things aren't "necessary," and they aren't doing anyone any good anywhere.

Last edited by sundialsvcs; 07-08-2016 at 07:09 AM.
 
Old 07-08-2016, 08:33 AM   #182
ugjka
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Brexit: Sunderland voters describe why the Leave vote there was resounding

Seems like Brexit is more like a revolt against Westminster than anything to do with EU.
 
Old 07-08-2016, 11:14 AM   #183
hazel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ugjka View Post
Brexit: Sunderland voters describe why the Leave vote there was resounding

Seems like Brexit is more like a revolt against Westminster than anything to do with EU.
Yes, there was a very strong element of that. Over the last ten years or so, there has been a growing disconnect between politicians of all major parties and ordinary people. The main reason why people as different as Nigel Farage, Jeremy Corbyn and Boris Johnson* are all so popular is because none of them are perceived as being "machine politicians". With the political establishment of course went the bankers (a universally loathed group), the economic experts, the big businessmen and the bureaucrats. All of them wanted us to remain in the EU. When people said "We want our country back!", it was those people they had in mind just as much as the EU.

* Americans might like to cross-reference to Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump.
 
Old 07-08-2016, 11:14 AM   #184
ugjka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
What's sweet about a bunch of losers refusing to accept a democratic vote?
https://politicalscrapbook.net/2016/...-just-spot-on/
Quote:
After an election or a referendum, even if you lose the vote, you are entitled to go on making the argument.

When a government in this country wins an election, the opposition does not say ‘oh that’s absolutely right I’ve got nothing to say for five years‘.
 
Old 07-08-2016, 12:25 PM   #185
rokytnji
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I'm just wondering if this Brexit thing. Which I have not a clue on what long term details are entailed in leaving the EU. Being a Mexican border dweller.

Will turn out to be a Kudzu vine decision. Or just a flash in the pan type of thing that goes no where.
 
Old 07-08-2016, 01:19 PM   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sundialsvcs View Post
[i]

No, I really don't agree with you on this one, but there definitely is the question of: "What Does Europe Do, Now?"
No.
Please do some research on this.
The UK was never a "perfect" EU citizen and annoyed everyone else from day one to leave it (and the only one with extra privileges already).

Most of Europe is happy with the ways things are going.
Sure, EU sucks as well (needing huge changes), but it's simply not bothering anyone (and certainly not taking our nationality away).
 
Old 07-08-2016, 01:48 PM   #187
ugjka
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"What Does Europe Do, Now?"

We watch the sh*tshow. Let's see what dissolves first the UK or EU
 
Old 07-08-2016, 10:00 PM   #188
jefro
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The penalty went up this year in order to force those to buy insurance.
 
Old 07-09-2016, 07:32 AM   #189
sundialsvcs
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... but they're still not doing it, and a legal challenge is working its way through the Court system as we speak.

The fundamental legal problem with the law is that it collects taxes in a punitive way, and it pays the revenue collected to private companies. In effect, the US Government is being used as the strong-arm bill collector for a private corporation. And this is now being challenged, saying that Government may collect taxes for itself, and it may of course spend tax money to purchase goods and services that it provides to the public or on behalf of the public, but it cannot directly pay revenues to a corporation nor act as "the agent of" a corporation.

Ultimately, the US is going to have to confront the notion that "health care is a basic human right." That you cannot have "life and the pursuit of happiness" if you are sick, and can't be medically treated without facing bankruptcy or being in the hands of corporations that don't have your well-being in mind. Health care fundamentally cannot be done effectively "for profit." We will eventually have our own National Health Service.
 
Old 07-09-2016, 04:49 PM   #190
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Post Post-Brexit pound now worst-performing major currency… falling behind Argentine peso

" The pound has overtaken the Argentine peso to win the title of 2016’s worst performer among 31 major currencies in the wake of Britain’s decision to leave the European Union.

Experts believe the pound will continue to fall. It is predicted the British currency is heading for a third week of declines after the Brexit vote on June 23."


https://www.rt.com/uk/350200-brexit-peso-pound-worst/


So, place your bets just how low can the GBP go?

xe.com
1.00 USD = 0.772052 GBP
1.00 EUR = 0.853115 GBP

Last edited by Jeebizz; 07-09-2016 at 04:54 PM.
 
Old 07-09-2016, 08:52 PM   #191
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So, who's next to have a referendum? Netherlands?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36722915

And will they vote to leave?
 
Old 07-10-2016, 09:02 AM   #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeebizz View Post
So, who's next to have a referendum? Netherlands?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36722915

And will they vote to leave?
People like Geert Wilders are a disease for our society ("a slightly less stupid" Trump).
What scares me most is the ideology behind the party's that support an exit.

While I share some concerns about the EU, I would NEVER even consider supporting racist/populist people like Wilders (or De Winter and De Wever in Belgium).
 
Old 07-10-2016, 11:18 AM   #193
DavidMcCann
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jens View Post
The UK was never a "perfect" EU citizen and annoyed everyone else from day one to leave it (and the only one with extra privileges already).
Most of Europe is happy with the ways things are going.
Sure, EU sucks as well (needing huge changes), but it's simply not bothering anyone (and certainly not taking our nationality away).
Écoutez ce belge! Of course they're not taking your nationality away: you don't have one!

Most people in Europe are not happy with the Brussels bureaucrats and their agenda of "ever closer union". Recent opinion polls show that if they had exit votes tomorrow in Italy and Greece, both would vote to leave. Marine Le Pen has called for a "Frexit". The Czech foreign minister has blamed Juncker for Brexit and called on him to resign. The Hungarian and Polish governments have accused the EU of trying to infringe their sovereignty and one Polish minister compared them to the Nazis.
 
Old 07-10-2016, 12:43 PM   #194
Jeebizz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jens View Post
People like Geert Wilders are a disease for our society ("a slightly less stupid" Trump).
What scares me most is the ideology behind the party's that support an exit.

While I share some concerns about the EU, I would NEVER even consider supporting racist/populist people like Wilders (or De Winter and De Wever in Belgium).
I do hope I am wrong, but considering all the tensions in Europe with all the migrants, and higher crime rate etc and now the possibility of more exits from the Union I have a feeling this could strengthen his position. I am sure there are probably many that probably would lean toward supporting him, and his 'kebab removal' policies. Besides, now that the UK will be leaving, Schengen will no longer apply to the UK so if other states in the Union follow suit it will give them more control on accepting migrants if any at all, and possibly just out right kicking them out. Far-fetched? Well, would you really want to bet on that?

Last edited by Jeebizz; 07-10-2016 at 12:45 PM.
 
Old 07-10-2016, 12:45 PM   #195
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jumping into the discussion, i am recently reading history of Byzantium its fall and fall of whole Holy(not that holy) Roman Empire. I find it very interesting, up to date and similar to what is at the moment going on with EU and all Western civilization (bureaucracy, tax evasions, herds of barbarians, and etc).


according to brexit;
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...ll-party-group

as a am from Poland where we had Centrally Planned Economy for 50 years it is scary for me what is going and i understand British, but to be honest i also know from the past to newer trust the British, sorry (at least government).

you can learn from the past a lot, about the present and the future.

sincerely przemo

Last edited by przemo; 07-10-2016 at 05:22 PM.
 
  


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