Because Shiny Things Are Fun - The New New Windows v Linux Thread
 

Put all of your informed or uninformed opinions here. Now 10% better than kicking the cat!

Well, now that the ~400 page thread is closed, Linux sure won out in that thread -- in a landslide.

And let's hope Windoze *NEVER* gets backed by anybody (like it did by @mattvdh) in this thread as much as it was backed by people in the old thread. And fellow Linux users: Let's not feed those trolls who do! Just ignore them and pretend they didn't exist.

++(++1)

Fsck Winblow$. That's informed opinion.

Uh... aherm... I don't think Windows is all that bad.

*ducks*

EDIT: I do think Linux won in the end. It's still fun to debate though. :)

It is the Windows vs Linux Thread. What purpose should it have if nobody backs up Windows? Than it would only be the Linux Fanboys Thread.
So I make first: As I had Windows installed, at least it had run my games. Tinkering with wine can be so grueling.

Windows 7 with Aero is pretty. Works OK too. If you have the resources to run it, that is. It isn't very fast, though.

I don't trust those linux fanboys claiming that windows is crap. Yesterday I was in my office working on Windows XP for 8 hours and it didn't crash!!!

The main reason I do not use windows is the vulnerability to the malware (spyware, viruses, etc.). When my wife had it on her computer it seemed every week I was cleaning or repairing something. I finally refused to repair and put linux full dress (software loaded) on her computer and once she got used to it she does not want the trouble and worry with windows. My post maybe behind the times though because the latest version of windows I used was XP.

XavierP - Where is your opinion - you started this

I've never had any of the clichéd problems with XP Pro, but it bores me now after a few minutes on the rare occasions I boot into it.

I agree, I never had problems of Windows constantly crashing. The occasional misbehaving program sometimes crashed it, but still nothing serious or annoying.

But Linux still amazed me by not crashing even once since I switched to it. Actually once it did, but it was my fault, I accidentally deleted the entire /boot directory :redface:.

XavierP, was I the one who crossed the line? I'm guessing this post was the one that brought it down (i.e. the fact that I mentioned the "kenny's_playground" tag). And yes, I know, the joke was lame, too. :rolleyes:

It's funny, I've gotten so used to doing things the Linux/UNIX way (well maybe not strictly UNIX :rolleyes:) that I'll actually occasionally boot into XP on my desktop just for a change of pace. :D I don't seem to have any problems with it, either, and that includes the whole malware/viruses thing (and the only anti-malware tool I have for Windows is Spybot S&D). I do still have to end a few processes I don't want to run on boot-up, though.

I also messed a little with Windows 7 on my mom's laptop; not enough to really judge objectively, but from what I did, it didn't feel that much different from XP. Really the only major differences I noticed were in the Start Menu layout, the new taskbar (which works more like Mac OS X's dock now), and the Explorer window's menu bar (which is now context-sensitive). But again, really all I did was a little fiddling with Explorer (the file browser, not the web browser :p; I was testing to see if an old game project of mine would run under 7 :rolleyes:) and looking at stuff in the Device Manager (she's got a Core i7 with the same NVIDIA GPU mine has; IMO this is overkill for what she does on the thing), so I can't really say for sure how much has really changed.

I've read some good things about 7, but not enough to want to buy it and try it.

You don't need to buy it, Microsoft offers a 90-day evaluation of Windows 7 Enterprise.

Try msconfig in the Run-dialog.

As a mod, I don't have to have an opinion, merely a justification :) Seriously though, I have no axe to grind with Microsoft or Windows. I actively used every version (incl NT 3.51 and 4.0) and, for the most part, they ran without crashing and gave me few problems. I just prefer to use Linux at home - needs fewer resources and has the programs I need - but I don't have any issues with using Windows in a work environment, I use the tools that I am provided.

Windows 7 is better than Vista, but it's still Windows.

Just one standout feature that I don't like are "libraries". They are basically collections of the contents of various folders, and are designed to organize the files you have scattered across the whole drive. But I see three problems:

• They're confusing.
• You're forced to use them for your documents, pictures, etc.
• Your files should be organized in your home directory in the first place. I see Libraries as a silly workaround. Linux really beats Windows here because Windows apps often store user-created files in obscure, app-specefic folders outside of My Documents. Linux, on the other hand, forces apps to store stuff in your home dir because that's the only place where they have write permission.

I'm not even interested enough to try that.

Oh, I crash Linux fairly often.

Well, actually, it isn't ME that's responsible. It's Windows. Windows 7 Pro in particular.

You see, I run Win7Pro in a virtual machine hosted in Linux. Sometimes Win7 goes nuts...sometimes it crashes. When it crashes, and I try to restart it, sometimes it says it has to go through its startup repair procedure. When it does that, sometimes it fails to repair itself and locks itself up. And, incidentally, locks the Linux host up as well. Usually after a time or two of that, I just delete the VM and roll in the most recent backup. Nice thing about virtual machines is that they're very easy to back up.

So, naturally, it's all Windows' fault!

Why the hate against Windows? If it wasn't for my Windows I would never be able to see outside. Windows keep the cold out and the heat in during the winter and the cold in and the heat out during the summer. Next people will say how much they hate doors or refrigerators. ;)

Deleting /boot caused your system to crash? I can see how it would stop you from booting but how is it going to cause you to crash? If you delete /bin or /sbin, then you got issues. That I can see causing a crash but not /boot.

Maybe we have a different meaning of "crash"?

:D :D

If there were no Windows, there would be a lot of unemployed window-cleaners, too.

Thanks for that. Still didn't clear everything up, but maybe I just didn't look hard enough to find all the stuff that wants to run...? :scratch:

It worked fine a few hours afterwards and I was oblivious to what I've done.

Then, everything just froze and the keyboard LEDs started flashing.

Try this: http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/s.../bb963902.aspx

That's odd. On Gentoo, /boot isn't even mounted by default. The only times you need /boot is when grub/lilo is loading the kernel and when you need to put a new kernel in /boot.

Is it possible that you could have deleted more than just /boot? Maybe /bin instead? I can see /bin causing a crash. They do both start with a "b" and tab completion can be a bad thing at times. o_O

:D :D

Didn't there used to be a thread "What OS would Jesus use?" or something like that? Someone should start that thread. There's no way that thread would degenerate.

While talking about Windows, you might give me some recommendations. As some of you may have read, recently one of my hard drives had a major failure. I got myself new drives and implemented a backup solution - a rsync script to automatically backup certain directories to external HDs.
I warned my Windows friends (99% of people I know use Windows:)) and recommended taking some action to save their data. Now I got myself into trouble as I have to do it for them:)

Do you know of any (ideally open-source) program for windows that would run in the background and make daily backups of certain directories?

Cygwin has rsync.

http://www.cygwin.com/packages/

It was Fedora 11.

Anyway, it had nothing to do with wildcards/tab completion. I was blindly following a YouTube video on how to mount a flash drive, and he said to mount "/dev/sda1" (I had no clue about the naming scheme at the time). I mounted it , saw some strange files, and stupidly ran "rm -rf" in it even though I had no idea why my flash drive would have all this weird stuff in it. Turns out it was the /boot partition, not the flash drive.

I guess the guy in the video had IDE drives, so that if he pluggen in a USB storage device it showed up a /dev/sda. But I have a SATA disk, so USB devices I plug in are actually /dev/sdb here.

I'll rather die!

Did you guys even see my blog description? I was actually part of M$'s beta test program for 7! It was terrible, especially in those times. And Vi$ta was no better. Constant malware (backdoors that would disable Kaspersky and cause my Internet to be SLOOOW) and, especially in Vi$ta, doing anything in Windoze Media Center related to watching or recording TV caused constant hangs and BSODs. Proof of just how insane M$ is.

So you were a beta-tester. What did you expect other than bugs and other issues?
I ran Windows many years (95, 98, 2000, XP, Vista), before I my total change to Linux, and OK, sometimes there were crashes (especially with 95 and 98), or a virus, but in no way constantly. But I wasn't part of a beta-test, where I would expect that. In my eyes no proof for anyones insanity.
But I am glad that this times are gone.

Yes, and even in the RC (which is supposed to be more stable) there was *PLENTY* of crap related to IIS and the fact that every time I ran it (along with Remote Desktop Web) it would get infected with some sort of back door that would disable any antivirus program I had installed...

And I even had the Professional version of the final release in VirtualBox for a while and even then Aero wouldn't work ... at all.

That said, the version of Vi$ta I had on my computer was the final release ... and in that release I couldn't run Media Center other than the main menu without experiencing a hang or BSOD...

Agreed, or should I say, aGreed ... the "greed" part being a deadly sin that M$ commits. $teve Ba££mer is a malicious, market-barrier-setting robber-baron who cares about no one else but him$elf.

Yeah 8 hours work ...15 minute coffee break while windoze starts up,3 hours defragging ,2 hours running Ccleaner on the registry, 2 hours with AV,10 minutes writing a document 30 minutes saving said document, along with 5 minutes shutting down the system that sound about right?

it looks like the whole working hours are spent in maintaining the Windows box.we have Windows in our computer laboratory and maintaining it don't need those long hours.

but in my home, i only use slackware.after spending many hours climbing the learning curve,it becomes easier for me to maintain and use my box than our Windows box in school.

:doh:

I agree with MrCode.

I'd like to throw in a (:banghead:) and a (:o) in there as well.

Thanks. That might be even better.

If there's one piece of software I really hate, it's Windows Media Center.

When I used Windows 7 RC, I had a TV tuner card connected to a sattelite box in a room far away. Basically what I needed is to tune the card to channel 3 or 4 depending on the setting of the switch on the sattelite box and that's it. To change te channels, I just wanted to use the remote from the sattelite box.

So I started Windows Media Center. It had no option just to tune in and watch TV. So I went to the setup screen, and chose the "sattelite" option. It requires me to have an IR interface to the sattelite box, whether you want it or not. So I chose the "cable" option. It forced me to choose a cable provider, want it or not. So I then chose the local TV option. It scanned for channels, which took 5-10 minutes, THEN ASKED ME IF I WANTED TO CHOOSE CHANELS MANUALLY INSTEAD!!! Then it forced me to download a guide of what's on local channels, want it or not. I tried doing it a few times to see if I can bypass the guide, but I cant. And each time I had to wait for it to scan for channels just to ask me if I wanted to just choose the channels myself. Finally I gave in and downloaded the freaking guide and I could finally just wtch TV.

I can't imagine a more idiotic, poorly designed piece of software.

I agree. I had many of those same problems (tried connecting the computer to a DirecTV box and it still forced me to use an IR cable, so I had to use local channels which don't include anything I like) and therefore felt like barfing on the computer. It was a nightmare! Exactly why I have Linux: The one thing that really attracted me was MythTV.

Okay, just what is that about? It seems as though you disagree with me, is that correct? If so, why? I don't get this.

For the love of God, why are you laughing at M$'s evil empire? Just laughing at me calling them M$ is enough to get me concerned. Add to that the constant dissing of me when I use currency signs for similar letters in things I (and also all of you guys) find evil and you get the ultimate question: Linux users should treat other Linux users with respect (since there is only so many of us in the U$A and the rest of the world), so why aren't you guys? LQ is increasingly becoming like UF.

Because you're so radical. It's becoming annoying and sad and I'm beginning to think you're here to troll us and make us look bad. After everything we've said and a thread closure, you are still spewing hate and non-sense of epic proportions, and people are getting tired of it. I may unsubscribe form this thread just because of this.

Can I PLEASE, please just ask you to be sensible? Instead of spamming currency signs, can you just say you don't like their business practices and get it over with? Must you comment on everything bad about Microsoft? Must you call everyone names? You called us Linux users fake, spread malicious software, call everyone who even LIKES Microsoft a TEENY bit rude names and childishly compare Microsoft and it's CEO to things like Adolf Hitler who killed and gassed and did horrible things to so many people.

I want to have a friendly debate, but I can't do it that way.

Cut the crap, come back to Earth and let's be friends. You CAN be a pretty interesting person to talk too...

Not trying to be rude, just saying what I feel; I don't want poor XavierP to have to come and close this one too.

I think of him even worse, but I can't use the language here.

BTW, I found this quote online. It's a bit dated but still applies to Micro$oft today.

"Stop Microsoft through government antitrust enforcement now or say goodbye to new products and the openness of the Internet. Gates will own everything, and collect a fee on every imaginable product and service in cyberspace from home finance to a virtual visit to the Louvre. And forget about getting these products and services someplace else. Competitors won't exist." -Antitrust attorney Gary Reback

I totally agree with that quote. Someone has to put a leash on micro$oft, or they will continue their EVIL and diabolical business practices.

Agreed! Please, let's not turn this into a rehash of the (now closed) Window v. Linux thread(and yes, I am aware that I contributed to the problems therein a few times, myself).

Moving on, and staying on-topic... XP can be made stable and reliable, but it's old- 10 years or so(?), and hardly worth the effort. My biggest problem with all versions of Windows is the lack of useful software included... if I were to pay hundreds for an OS, I wouldn't want to pay as much again for a decent office program.

Anyway, Linux is more interesting, and more fun!

I think the second little guy was yawning, not laughing... I like the brick wall guy, very funny.

hm, using Vista since about 2.5 years, and havn't come across any of the problems many describe.
Never been virus infected (well, at least according to my AV, nor any indication of it either in other ways), no trojans yet either, etc.

Had a BSOD two times in these years, once through a DX9 problem when running VietCong using DX10, the other time don't remember anymore what the reason was.

Never used Media Center, so can't say how that is. Media Player's usually enough, and when it fails, I use the DivX player.

Havn't tried Win7 yet.
Next machine I might buy this coming year will get Win7 though.
The laptop I only use as an alarm mornings to wake me up runs XP Pro, enough for its task.

The other two machines here run Debian Testing for me local dev playbox, and the still broken box (too lazy to fix) used to run OpenBSD

Well I'm about to build a new rig. I already got the case and P.S. This is the basics:

COOLER MASTER HAF 932 RC-932-KKN1 Case

Thermaltake TR2 TRX-650M 650W ATX Power Supply

ZALMAN CNPS10X FLEX CPU Cooler. I hope it fits. lol

GIGABYTE GA-770T-USB3 AM3 Mobo

AMD Phenom II X4 945 Deneb 3.0GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor. Wish I could find the OEM version of this.

G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB 240-Pin SDRAM DDR3 1600 memory

You can bet that rig will never see windoze either.

I figure that will be better than the one I have now. My old one is about 7 or 8 years old. I think it is in my sig too.

:) :)