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Old 06-25-2017, 11:48 AM   #1
un1x
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UNIX timeline...


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...ine.en.svg.png
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Old 06-25-2017, 12:23 PM   #2
wpeckham
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Most unlikely. Certain packages develop in BSD of some flavor first and are ported to Linux, but generally changes needed for new hardware and environments are taking place in Linux first. As long as some development is going forward at multiple levels in each kernel environment there is unlikely to be a thinning. Each of those that now exist do so because there is something that they support better than the others.

If you looked, instead, at the Unix variants that have gone extinct you can see the pattern. Either the hardware that they ran on vanished, or they ran out of developers and support and were replaced by a more vibrant product and COMMUNITY!

Understanding the PEOPLE and politics in the support communities and supporting companies is key to prediction in this space. I lack enough information to make secure predictions, but have enough for some general ones that seem obvious. While support and demand are present, the product will continue.
 
Old 06-26-2017, 04:53 AM   #3
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I'm not sure what the point of this thread is and wpeckham, I believe you may be replying to the OP's signature?

Regardless, your assessment of hardware driver development isn't entirely correct. With the exception of Linux KMS/DRM video drivers/X.org drivers, the *BSD projects develop their own hardware drivers independently. There is porting of these between the individual projects, but in order to be used in said projects they usually have to be licence compatible. With the notable exception of DragonFly BSD, I'm not aware of any BSD derived project which permits GPL'd code in the base system - OpenBSD certainly does not. While Linux certainly supports "more hardware" and probably supports some newer hardware sooner than e.g. FreeBSD, it's not to say that support is simply "better" or more current across the board. All have different objectives and focus on different areas. I have come across devices which were "supported" in Linux, but poorly, but which work flawlessly in FreeBSD or OpenBSD and vice versa of course. But when all is said and done it's if your hardware is supported or not which matters most - and not if the kernel has a gazillion (most likely unmaintained) drivers for hardware you don't use and won't ever use.

Last edited by cynwulf; 06-26-2017 at 05:10 AM. Reason: typo
 
Old 06-26-2017, 06:13 AM   #4
jggimi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cynwulf View Post
...OpenBSD certainly does not.
A small correction. OpenBSD does not accept GPL, "...when adding new code." [1] There are existing GPL-licensed modules in the source tree under /usr/src/gnu, which contains both GPL-licensed tools (such as gcc) and other software which is "Gigantic and Nasty but Unavoidable" [2] (such as llvm).

---

[1] http://www.openbsd.org/goals.html
[2] http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cv...ype=text/plain

Last edited by jggimi; 06-26-2017 at 06:17 AM.
 
Old 06-26-2017, 06:36 AM   #5
cynwulf
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Yes, that is indeed correct and apologies for the omission/lack of clarity there, but I understand that LLVM/clang is/was UIUC licensed?
 
Old 06-26-2017, 06:39 AM   #6
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University of Illinois/NCSA Open Source License, per /usr/src/gnu/llvm/LICENSE.TXT
 
Old 06-26-2017, 07:00 AM   #7
cynwulf
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Which is the same as the UIUC licence? I wasn't aware that was incompatible.

https://opensource.org/licenses/NCSA
 
Old 06-26-2017, 07:05 AM   #8
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The LICENSE.TXT file I cited contains additional clauses governing third party software, disclaimer of warranty, and a list of additional licenses.

Linky: http://cvsweb.openbsd.org/cgi-bin/cv...ype=text/plain

But it isn't solely the license alone that the Project uses to determine if software should be in the src/gnu tree. It began that way, historically, but other software can be found there. See the [2] link in my first reply.

Last edited by jggimi; 06-26-2017 at 07:10 AM.
 
Old 06-26-2017, 09:33 AM   #9
cynwulf
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Ok, that makes sense, thanks for the clarification.
 
Old 06-26-2017, 06:26 PM   #10
frankbell
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I've always rather liked this chart for its overwhelming-ness.
 
Old 06-26-2017, 06:39 PM   #11
un1x
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbell View Post
Totally OBSOLETE ! >>> 2012

 
Old 06-26-2017, 08:14 PM   #12
frankbell
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It's good up till that time.

As Faulkner said, "The past is always with us. In fact, it's not even past."
 
Old 06-27-2017, 06:25 AM   #13
cynwulf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbell View Post
I've always rather liked this chart for its overwhelming-ness.
While it seems detailed, it's not relevant to Research UNIX or it's descendants such as the Berkeley Software Distribution and System V, etc.

This simplified one one has been around for quite a few years: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/F...ory-simple.svg

(not sure exactly how accurate it is)
 
Old 06-29-2017, 03:08 PM   #14
un1x
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just for info

openbsd is a fork of NETBSD

 
Old 06-30-2017, 06:26 PM   #15
un1x
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https://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~reinho.../3reasons.html



3 Reasons to use FreeBSD...

Quote:
FreeBSD v. Windows: In spite of the dominance of Microsoft Windows on the desktop, we really feel that there is no contest between FreeBSD and Windows. FreeBSD is incredibly stable, and boasts good security to boot. Windows, on the other hand, has been constantly plagued by security flaws, and is a frequent target for viruses, worms, and hacker attacks. Windows used to be so unstable that until Windows 2000 was released, Microsoft reputedly used FreeBSD as the server for microsoft.com! Obviously the one major advantage Windows has to offer over FreeBSD is applications--no OS can compare to Windows in terms of the sheer number of applications written for it. However, we believe that the vast majority of the applications used by the average Windows user can be replaced with equivalents or replacements on FreeBSD. Browse through the Applications for FreeBSD we've chosen to highlight in this Guide and see what we mean. The other advantage boasted by Windows is hardware drivers--Windows can use a lot of hardware that FreeBSD simply cannot. However, FreeBSD employs a number of very good generic hardware drivers and supports a lot of useful and modern devices (with the exception of most winmodems). This is not due to any superior architecture or development of Windows, but due to the choice made by many third-party hardware vendors to only write drivers for Windows, and to jealously guard the secrets of those drivers by keeping them closed-source. We applaud those hardware-vendors that support open-source by releasing enough information about their hardware to allow community developers to write drivers for it, and still more those vendors that take the time to write drivers themselves.

FreeBSD v. Linux: This is a closer call. We really have nothing against Linux. In fact, we like it. We just happen to like FreeBSD more. Although both are similar on the surface, under the hood they are two very different operating systems. FreeBSD is based on UNIX--it was born out of BSD UNIX. Proprietary AT&T code has been removed, but FreeBSD can trace its roots back into the 1970s. The Linux kernel, on the other hand, was written by Linus Torvalds as a UNIX-clone or UNIX-like system at the beginning of the 1990s. Lineage isn't everything, however. The main reason why we prefer FreeBSD over Linux is performance. FreeBSD feels significantly faster and more responsive than the several major Linux distros (including Red Hat Fedora, Gentoo, Debian, and Ubuntu) we've tested on the same hardware. (We're not claiming to have performed professional benchmarking tests--however, running the same versions of the same applications on each system demonstrated a considerable performance advantage of FreeBSD over the Linux distros we tried). Added to the performance advantage FreeBSD has over Linux is its stability advantage. Those are enough to make us choose FreeBSD over Linux. There are also usage variations--FreeBSD just "feels" nicer than Linux when we use and administer it. On the other hand, the majority of popular graphical applications for FreeBSD are originally written for Linux, and some are slower than others in being ported to FreeBSD. If you want the latest version of your favorite app and you want it yesterday, Linux allows you to live life on the bleeding edge moreso than FreeBSD. Still, most major applications make their way to FreeBSD in very little extra time, and most of us using FreeBSD prefer stability over getting the latest new feature immediately.

FreeBSD v. Mac OS X: Again, we have nothing against Mac OS X. I (Kevin) have 2 systems in my home--my ThinkPad running FreeBSD and my Mac OS X Panther system. Mac OS X is a great (and very easy to use) Operating System. It is also not free, and will only run on Apple hardware (which is more expensive than comparable PC hardware). It is difficult to criticize Mac OS X itself, since it is based on FreeBSD! The UNIX-like base of Mac OS X (called "Darwin") is based on FreeBSD and Mach. Apple even incorporates improvements from recent versions of FreeBSD back into Mac OS X. Of course, why pay for the Apple hardware and Operating System when you can get FreeBSD for free? Granted, some really like the look of Mac OS X and all of its graphical tools (I do), but others (like Dan) prefer the simplicity, small size, and elegance of a window manager like Fluxbox on FreeBSD.

Last edited by un1x; 06-30-2017 at 09:44 PM.
 
  


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