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Old 10-17-2005, 11:17 PM   #1
KimVette
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Hit several major snags in SuSE 10


Well the SuSE DVDs came in last week, Saturday I backed up most of my stuff (all the stuff I cared about) and wiped the drive.

Installed SuSE 10, and found several major problems, which I have replicated on other systems with different chipsets and different processors:

1. Evolution WILL NOT connect to exchange via the Exchange connector. After a few google searches I found that this is a confirmed bug and a fix has already been checked in - it was checked in prior to the release of SuSE 10 actually! No update is available via YaST so I had to resort to using IMAP/SMTP for email and Kontact for calendaring (or go back to SuSE 9.3, or Windows). I am very disappointed in that, especially since Ximian Evolution is now a Novell product and they should have caught this problem prior to putting out release candidates, let alone calling it a gold build. Basic smoketesting of the functionality would have caught this defect.

2. kdar will hard lock the system. dar from the command line works fine.

3. As usual, xine is crippled. I am currently trying to sort that out but one update I applied results in hard cashes.

4. Recompiling the kernel to optimize it results in 842,278,281 warnings. OK, slight exaggeration, but there is a confirmed building bug in the 2.6.13-15 kernel source which results in the repeated warnings, and likewise a fix was checked in even prior to release of the release candidate builds, let alone gold. This should have been caught during the build process, way before smoketesting. Hell, that should not have even made it to smoketesting - the build should have been rejected outright. Never in my career have I ever let any project with more than 9 warnings go to QA, let alone to a customer. Warnings aren't usually fatal (very rarely are they) but they're a good indication of missing code, incomplete or incorrect code version checkin, reliance on deprecated calls, or simply sloppiness.

{edit} I'm not ranting, by the way. I am just venting. Likewise, I have now learned that there is a definite pattern with SuSE - skip the even-numbered releases and buy only the odd-numbered releases - or wait a month or two for fixes to be released on YaST. I hated 9.0 (my first experience with SuSE), loved 9.1 (samba issues aside), hated 9.2 and loved 9.3, and so far am hating 10.0. Also I noticed many media programs are missing. I could have sworn audacity was bundled in 9.1 and 9.3 but it is nowhere to be found in 10.0{/edit}

Last edited by KimVette; 10-18-2005 at 02:57 PM.
 
Old 10-18-2005, 03:08 PM   #2
KimVette
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Update:

1. Evolution: So far I have not heard from Novell after sending them an email (believe me it was not as harsh as my post here). They're a big company so hearing back from them could take weeks. I am pissed about this though - there is no excuse that their very own project should be so broken with such a critical defect. In a larger corporate environment this would definitely be a showstopper for a Linux rollout. *censors self*

2. kdar - I have not re-tested it yet. I am still searching for packages I [i]use to have[/u] in previous versions (e.g., Audacity, webmin, and others) but are no longer included with SuSE. I'm also recompiling for better hardware support, particularly the correct processor. I will be re-testing kdar tomorrow.

3. I fixed xine by installing a build from last December - same build I've been running since SuSE 9.1. {edit} As far as the hard locking of the machines were concerned, when I installed I had inadvertantly selected libxine1-dxr3 without reading closely enough. {/edit}

4. Compiler warnings seemed to go away when selecting the correct, specific processor type (previously the generic 586/686/etc. definition was selected). Still, with the default settings I should never have seen those thousands of compiler warnings. Also, when reviewing menuconfig and the Makefile I may have discovered why SMT never seemed to work right for me in the past. Recompiling SMP with SMT support to see if I can get it working properly this time around.

I have other complaints - mostly about some changes in KDE, but that's not Novell's doing.

Last edited by KimVette; 10-18-2005 at 03:26 PM.
 
Old 10-18-2005, 06:35 PM   #3
paul_e_t
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Wishing you the best of luck.
Just standing by and watching
while listening to "On The Beautiful Danube" a Classical
doesn't hurt me head at all, is calming.

 
Old 10-19-2005, 08:09 PM   #4
KimVette
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paul_e_t>

Funny.

Well everything is fixed except for Evolution. Also: SMP/SMT are working correctly now. SMT is a poor substitute for SMP though. I am really looking forward to the dual-core Xeons, then I'll go with what will effectively be a four-way box (8-way hyperthreading)
 
Old 10-20-2005, 03:19 PM   #5
paul_e_t
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Re your last.
If you read back in your posts and think a bit, you will be able to understand how it is that Linux in general is going down a difficult road as far as being able to compete with $S Win's in the general marketplace. What we really need us a Commercial Linux that is plug and play :>)
Keep up the good works.
Paul
 
Old 10-20-2005, 04:58 PM   #6
KimVette
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SuSE is actually very close but only just misses the mark. You can't blame Novell for having difficulty in implementing an open source Exchange-compatible email client, but you can blame them for shipping one that is broken when a previous release worked flawlessly.

Novell posted an update for it on YOU today - I downloaded it and it partially worked. I think I need to delete all traces of Evolution config files from ~ and start over.
 
Old 10-21-2005, 02:12 PM   #7
paul_e_t
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You seem to be well versed in running Linux. Just think how a $S user feels. After being used to popping in a new program CD, select install, and then enjoying the new program to the fullest. The new user, who knows little about Linux, who doesn't know what command line means, who is expecting great things, trys out Linux wanting a dual boot system then finds out that his original $S XP program no longer exists and the Linux he is hopefully running needs an associate degree in DP in order to operate somewhat. And help ? He needs a running system before one gets on line help. Linux is not listed in the phone book so who does one call? As I said we need a commercial, stable, reliable, Linux version that can offer support for new users. Commercial here does NOT mean make lots of profit. Just Linux centers where users can go and get help from a paid staff who want Linux for everyone. Heck. . . . . .$S has help for it's group of tech's why not Linux ! I think I'll look see what Linspire offers in the way of continued support.
I do hope everything goes well with you and your system does you good.
Lurking
Paul

Last edited by paul_e_t; 10-21-2005 at 02:18 PM.
 
Old 10-21-2005, 03:30 PM   #8
broch
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I realised, reading all these complaints that this is not worth switching to 10.0 from 9.3.
The only thing I am missing from 10.0 is gcc4. But I suspect that real power of this new version will be revealed later. So in fact I don't think that I am missing anything.

I will wait for 10.1. The real argument is that version 10.0 does not add anything really new. Bumping from version to version only to be up to date makes no sense to me.
 
Old 10-21-2005, 08:08 PM   #9
fragos
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When discussing installing on MS vs Linux, one has to consider that Linux comes with so much, many won't need to install anything. With MS its pretty useless until you spent a lot of many on a large number of commercial packages just to make a usable system. Adding hardware into a Linux system less frequently requires you to install new software.
 
Old 10-23-2005, 09:08 PM   #10
paul_e_t
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Re: FRAGOS post #9

I agree with you. However, do you think it would be best to have a basic operating system install w/o all the super supporting software and just include basic small packages similiar to $S's Works that do a small job, and can be an easier, broader (in sense of HW) install? After all, how many people can use the full capabalities of Office.org or MySQL ? Most people are using just word processing and once in a while a DB or drawing application for photo touch-up (a mini Gimp).
What's ya think ?

and we need to more than just thank a Vet.; we need to provide more hugs, jobs, better med, life insurance, again better (not more money) medical support and better pay increases. Gosh ya got me going here, I'd better tone down a bit :>)

Should we start a new thread on Linux attributes ?

Paul
 
Old 10-23-2005, 09:14 PM   #11
paul_e_t
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Re: BROCH post #8

I'll be doing the same an wait for 10.1. I had bad luck with 9.3 so I'll sit by for another 7 months without SuSE or could switch versions.
 
Old 10-24-2005, 02:48 PM   #12
unionjak
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win xp

hello,
i think if you add up the time it takes you(and really add it up) to do the following, you will relise just how amazingly easy linux is to install AND then maintain :-
first off you have to remove adware from the (XP) system...almost everyday.
then, you have to cross your fingers that a virus does`nt take the system out, just before you complete MISSION CRITICAL work.
It is at this point, after a few days that you wounder if your shiney sli based athlon system has had tar spilled into it because its sooooo slow.(clogged up with "addware" you never asked for).
Then when you have lost most of your hair sorting out the above, but never really acumplishing anything because you know it will all start again....unexplained crashes and zany behaviour become the norm.....UNTILL...WAIT FOR IT......you have to format the hardrive because the whole thing is borked. Tell me you have not had to do this, a few times on a xp system ?
 
Old 10-24-2005, 03:06 PM   #13
KimVette
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One great feature Windows has is spellcheck practically everywhere. *J/K*
 
Old 10-24-2005, 03:31 PM   #14
paul_e_t
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Re: unionjak post #12
I haven't had any of those XP problems at all - nada. I don't run IE except when I'm forced to, where, for instance, a web system checks browsers and I can't use Firefox. "SunTrust Bank" is an example. As a matter of fact the only time I had problems with $S XP was when I installed SuSE 9.3 and had boot problems where I couldn't bring up XP. I lost a bunch of documents and photo's that I had backed up on another system using wind ME but when I went to load 9.3 on that system I lost everything ( got caught with the bad parted prog bug I didn't know about). Customer continued support is nonexsistant and ends 6 months after product cycle. I haven't had one email teling me of any OS problems or updates from the package owners. One can get automatic system updates but who knows what the updates are doing? At least $S send out a notice via email. The $S XP updates were just about as long as the SuSE updates if I recall about five hours or more on an ISDN connection. Lots of hard creative work lost . . .lost. The lesson here is that if one is to dual boot then make a 4 way back up once in a while, be very careful with the new issues of Linux (but, this could apply to any OS).
Anyway it seems that $S is finally trying to get its' act together but I'm not going to buy their application packages any more if I can help it. I'd rather donate money to the FSF. The XP on this Unit came OEM installed. Those are my opinions and I'm sticking to'em.
 
Old 10-24-2005, 04:32 PM   #15
unionjak
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soz aboooot smelling checher....lol

hello,
soz about spalling check but am abit blasted, so there...lol.
I respect you for your views, and as an ex win xp beta tester i can tell you that i am not too sure which was the more secure...the sp2 or beta.
 
  


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