New Slacker Installation Questions

brianL · 11-04-2008, 04:19 AM

It would have been better to leave the space as unallocated after resizing your Ubuntu partition. Then, during the Slackware install, after login as root, use cfdisk to create the Slackware partition.

bgeddy · 11-04-2008, 05:44 AM

Quote:

On slackware setup, it complained about it couldn't find any Linux partition on the disk. Why didn't it look for /dev/sda3?

That's odd - try typing running cfdisk /dev/sda on the install and see what partitions it reports. Some people have reported fdisk recognizing their disks when cfdisk doesn't so if cfdisk doesn't work try fdisk /dev/sda.

Quote:

It would have been better to leave the space as unallocated after resizing your Ubuntu partition. Then, during the Slackware install, after login as root, use cfdisk to create the Slackware partition.

Personally I have never seen the difference between partitioning inside or outside of the install.

Now I look more closely I see your partition table looks odd - this is it ordered by location:

Quote:

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 * 1 3947 31704246 83 Linux
/dev/sda3 3948 6499 20498940 83 Linux
/dev/sda2 13996 14593 4803435 5 Extended
/dev/sda5 13996 14593 4803403+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris

- obviously you have created a new primary (sda3) from the space freed up from the old primary (sda1). However there seems to be a gap between the end of sda3 and the start of the extended partition sda2 containing the logical partition sda5. Notice the gap between cylinder 6499 sd3 end and cylinder 8113996 sda2 start. Is this intentional ? If not then you're wasting a lot of disk space - looks like about 60GB if my maths is right.

wdli · 11-05-2008, 01:58 PM

Yes I intentionally left about 60GB unpartitioned so it might be used in the future.

I tried "fdisk /dev/sda" inside the install. But it couldn't open the device. I didn't try cfdisk. I will do that next.

Someone in the "gparted forum" pointed out that my partition order in the partition table is not the same as in the MBR. I needed to run expert fdisk to straighten that out. I am not very familiar with that.

I guess what I would like to try is to delete the new partition and then try to partition the unallocated space inside the install. Maybe Slackware knows how to properly do this by itself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bgeddy

That's odd - try typing running cfdisk /dev/sda on the install and see what partitions it reports. Some people have reported fdisk recognizing their disks when cfdisk doesn't so if cfdisk doesn't work try fdisk /dev/sda.

Personally I have never seen the difference between partitioning inside or outside of the install.

Now I look more closely I see your partition table looks odd - this is it ordered by location:
- obviously you have created a new primary (sda3) from the space freed up from the old primary (sda1). However there seems to be a gap between the end of sda3 and the start of the extended partition sda2 containing the logical partition sda5. Notice the gap between cylinder 6499 sd3 end and cylinder 8113996 sda2 start. Is this intentional ? If not then you're wasting a lot of disk space - looks like about 60GB if my maths is right.

bgeddy · 11-05-2008, 02:47 PM

Quote:

I guess what I would like to try is to delete the new partition and then try to partition the unallocated space inside the install. Maybe Slackware knows how to properly do this by itself.

Whenever I've ran the install (I've just tried this in a VM) the Slackware install just tells me to run fdisk/cfdisk to create partitions when I have no partitions created and unallocated space. It doesn't automatically do this for you. That is why I said I have never seen the difference in partitioning in the install or outside of it.

Have a look at the help in the setup - it tells you this.

bgeddy · 11-05-2008, 03:12 PM

This is the relevant bit from the setup help :

Code:

PARTITIONING YOUR DRIVE

Now lets take a look at how you progress through a typical Linux
installation with the Slackware distribution.  First, you'll have
to make sure your hard drive has been partitioned to accept Linux.
The setup program does not do this for you.

You will need at least one type Linux partition, and optionally a
swap partition.  In my opinion, (if you have a fair amount of drive
space) it's easiest to manage a system that's partitioned along these
lines (ignoring any Windows or other partitions for the purposes
of this illustration):

    [ 6 gig or more for / ] 
    [ whatever space users need for /home ]
    [ swap space (match the size of your RAM) ]

Some people like a separate partition for /usr/local, but I find that
I usually regret dividing my free space when I don't have to... the
partition I want to add to is always full that way. :^)  Besides, when
the time comes for an operating system upgrade you can always back up
/usr/local regardless of whether it occupies its own partition.  In
fact, having a separate /home partition is also optional.  Probably the
simplest way to approach things initially is with just a single root
Linux partition, and a swap partition of about 1-2 gigabytes.

The amount of drive space you'll want to give Linux depends on what 
software you plan to install, and how much space you have to spare. 
My primary Linux partition is 10 gigabytes.  If you've got that
kind of room to spare, it will make it easier to compile and try out
large pieces of software, or to work with large files such as might be
used in desktop publishing or CD-ROM mastering applications.

The entire Slackware system (everything -- all the X servers, Emacs,
the works) will use about 5 gigabytes of hard drive space,
so 5 - 10 gigs is sufficient for a complete installation.

In the past, I've actually done development work on a single / 
partition of 110 MB.  (Of course, that was back in the days of Linux
version 0.99p11 or so...)  Still, with careful selection you can still
squeeze a small Linux system onto a system, but this is not recommended
for beginners.  It's more useful when utilizing Slackware as a base for
an embedded system.  Most people should be going a full installation.
It's faster and easier, and less error-prone.

Partitioning is done with a partitioning tool such as fdisk.  There are
two versions of Linux fdisk available now.  'fdisk' is the standard
version, and 'cfdisk' is a friendlier full screen version.  Most
people will probably want to use 'cfdisk' now, unless they're used
to the older version (like me).  Either one will get the job done.

Make sure you use Linux fdisk to tag partitions as type 83 (Linux, the
default) or type 82 (Linux swap) so the Slackware setup program will 
recognize them.  Use the 't' command for that, and 'w' to write out the
changes.

If you prefer an easy to use graphical partitioning tool, you can make
all your Linux partitions directly from Linux 'cfdisk'.  Or you can
make them with the older 'fdisk' using the 'n' command to create a
partition and the 'w' command to write out the changes when you're done. 

By default, 'fdisk' and 'cfdisk' will partition the first hard drive in
your machine.  On machines with IDE, this will be /dev/hda.  On machines
with only SCSI, it will be /dev/sda.  To partition other drives, you'll
have to specify the drive to partition when you start 'cfdisk'.  For
example, to partition the second IDE drive:

  # cfdisk /dev/hdb

If it's any use to you.

wdli · 11-05-2008, 06:45 PM

The problem in my case is fdisk/cfdisk "couldn't open the device" inside the install. This happened even if I deleted the previous partition from gparted. So I have no way to run fdisk within the install now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bgeddy

This is the relevant bit from the setup help :

Code:

PARTITIONING YOUR DRIVE

Now lets take a look at how you progress through a typical Linux
installation with the Slackware distribution.  First, you'll have
to make sure your hard drive has been partitioned to accept Linux.
The setup program does not do this for you.

You will need at least one type Linux partition, and optionally a
swap partition.  In my opinion, (if you have a fair amount of drive
space) it's easiest to manage a system that's partitioned along these
lines (ignoring any Windows or other partitions for the purposes
of this illustration):

    [ 6 gig or more for / ] 
    [ whatever space users need for /home ]
    [ swap space (match the size of your RAM) ]

Some people like a separate partition for /usr/local, but I find that
I usually regret dividing my free space when I don't have to... the
partition I want to add to is always full that way. :^)  Besides, when
the time comes for an operating system upgrade you can always back up
/usr/local regardless of whether it occupies its own partition.  In
fact, having a separate /home partition is also optional.  Probably the
simplest way to approach things initially is with just a single root
Linux partition, and a swap partition of about 1-2 gigabytes.

The amount of drive space you'll want to give Linux depends on what 
software you plan to install, and how much space you have to spare. 
My primary Linux partition is 10 gigabytes.  If you've got that
kind of room to spare, it will make it easier to compile and try out
large pieces of software, or to work with large files such as might be
used in desktop publishing or CD-ROM mastering applications.

The entire Slackware system (everything -- all the X servers, Emacs,
the works) will use about 5 gigabytes of hard drive space,
so 5 - 10 gigs is sufficient for a complete installation.

In the past, I've actually done development work on a single / 
partition of 110 MB.  (Of course, that was back in the days of Linux
version 0.99p11 or so...)  Still, with careful selection you can still
squeeze a small Linux system onto a system, but this is not recommended
for beginners.  It's more useful when utilizing Slackware as a base for
an embedded system.  Most people should be going a full installation.
It's faster and easier, and less error-prone.

Partitioning is done with a partitioning tool such as fdisk.  There are
two versions of Linux fdisk available now.  'fdisk' is the standard
version, and 'cfdisk' is a friendlier full screen version.  Most
people will probably want to use 'cfdisk' now, unless they're used
to the older version (like me).  Either one will get the job done.

Make sure you use Linux fdisk to tag partitions as type 83 (Linux, the
default) or type 82 (Linux swap) so the Slackware setup program will 
recognize them.  Use the 't' command for that, and 'w' to write out the
changes.

If you prefer an easy to use graphical partitioning tool, you can make
all your Linux partitions directly from Linux 'cfdisk'.  Or you can
make them with the older 'fdisk' using the 'n' command to create a
partition and the 'w' command to write out the changes when you're done. 

By default, 'fdisk' and 'cfdisk' will partition the first hard drive in
your machine.  On machines with IDE, this will be /dev/hda.  On machines
with only SCSI, it will be /dev/sda.  To partition other drives, you'll
have to specify the drive to partition when you start 'cfdisk'.  For
example, to partition the second IDE drive:

  # cfdisk /dev/hdb

If it's any use to you.

T3slider · 11-05-2008, 07:33 PM

If `fdisk /dev/sda` returns "couldn't open the device", it is possible that your hard drive is not being detected as /dev/sda. You should check the output of the following command:

Code:

# ls /dev/[sh]d*

That will show all of the storage devices (like a hard drive or a CD/DVD drive). Your hard drive may be detected as /dev/hd* even if it is an SATA drive if the incorrect controller module is being loaded. From CHANGES_AND_HINTS.TXT:

Code:

If you notice extremely long wait times when formatting partitions in the 
  installer, and you're installing on a Thinkpad that has a SATA drive, it's
  possible that the wrong driver is being used, which disables DMA on the drive
  (and could happen on other machines). A bit more detail about it is here:
    http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Problems_with_SATA_and_Linux#No_DMA_on_system_hard_disk
  Try passing "hda=noprobe" to the kernel when booting the installer, and it
  should use the correct libata driver.

If you are sure your drive is an SATA drive and it is being detected as hd*, try booting with the hda=noprobe option. Search the forums for noprobe for more information (there was a recent thread that went into more detail).

onebuck · 11-05-2008, 07:33 PM

Hi,

You should prepare your partitions before the install. That way you can insure that the hdd partition integrity is proper. I always prepare my partition(s) for the system then reboot to insure that the kernel partition table is updated. I then create the filesystem(s) for the partition(s).

My question is why do you have the discrepancies with your partitions? Why did you create your logical as '/dev/sda2' and then create a primary for '/dev/sda3'? I also noticed block problems. Why don't you create the partitions with the logical as the last partition '/dev/sda4'. That way you will not have the problem that you are experiencing.

bgeddy · 11-05-2008, 07:46 PM

Quote:

The problem in my case is fdisk/cfdisk "couldn't open the device" inside the install. This happened even if I deleted the previous partition from gparted. So I have no way to run fdisk within the install now.

It looks like your disk is not being picked up correcttly - try this:

Code:

dmesg | grep "^[s|h]d"

and look to see what your hard disk is being detected as. I may be that is is incorrectly being identified as hda or such like in which case we should fix this first.

edit : Took to long typing that one .. onbuck and t3slider beat me to it !!

wdli · 11-06-2008, 08:50 AM

Hi Guys,

Thanks all for the responses. I really learned something here.

To address onebuck's question:

My laptop originally had only a single partition for Ubuntu 7.1. That's why /dev/sda1 was for Ubuntu root mount and /dev/sda2 was for Ubuntu swap.

Then I used gparted to resize /dev/sda1 and added a third /dev/sda3 but also left a large chunk unpartitioned (for the future use). So you see the "discrepancies".

My problem hence started from here. Slackware install couldn't see any Linux partition in "setup" and was unable to find /dev/sda in fdisk or cfdisk. But Ubuntu has no problem to recognize the new partition.

I don't have any real data on this machine so I am open to any suggestion to reinstall/repartition/resize the hard disk.

Quote:

Originally Posted by onebuck

Hi,

You should prepare your partitions before the install. That way you can insure that the hdd partition integrity is proper. I always prepare my partition(s) for the system then reboot to insure that the kernel partition table is updated. I then create the filesystem(s) for the partition(s).

My question is why do you have the discrepancies with your partitions? Why did you create your logical as '/dev/sda2' and then create a primary for '/dev/sda3'? I also noticed block problems. Why don't you create the partitions with the logical as the last partition '/dev/sda4'. That way you will not have the problem that you are experiencing.

bgeddy · 11-06-2008, 08:56 AM

Quote:

I don't have any real data on this machine so I am open to any suggestion to reinstall/repartition/resize the hard disk.

This isn't really the point - if the disk is not being recognized properly by the install kernel then you will have problems. First try one of the methods given by myself or T3slider, (or both even !), to see what type of disk is being picked up. Then we can try and fix this.

wdli · 11-06-2008, 12:43 PM

You guys are correct. Here are the outputs from slackware install:

Quote:

ls /dev/[sh]d* shows /dev/hd*, where * is from a to t. dmesg | grep "^[s|h]d" shows:

hda: TSSTcopr DVD+/- RW...
hda: attached ide-cdrom driver
hda: ATAPI 24x DVD-ROM..

So it didn't see the SCSI hard drive.

Any suggestions what to do next? Should I choose a different image to boot up? I think the default is sata.i.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bgeddy

This isn't really the point - if the disk is not being recognized properly by the install kernel then you will have problems. First try one of the methods given by myself or T3slider, (or both even !), to see what type of disk is being picked up. Then we can try and fix this.

bgeddy · 11-06-2008, 01:22 PM

Quote:

dmesg | grep "^[s|h]d" shows:

hda: TSSTcopr DVD+/- RW...
hda: attached ide-cdrom driver
hda: ATAPI 24x DVD-ROM..

This looks like your hard disk is not being detected at all. This may have ben a lot easier trying Slackware 12.1 or even 12 but I'll try with your OS choice for now.

Sorry - as your running Slackware 11 I can't really remember what bootup kernels where available. In general the ones ending in .s were built with SCSI support and the ones ending in .i were built with IDE if I remember correctly.

There should be a help screen telling you what key to hit for different kernel options - possibly F2 or something. You may find a huge26.s which you could try or a scsi.s or something. This is from memory so it's a little sketchy.

If none of these work then we'll try passing kernel parameters but for now try the above and repeat the kernel hard disk detection routine to try and get the disk recognised.

wdli · 11-06-2008, 06:34 PM

So far I have tried scsi.s, scsi2.s, scsi3.s, adptec.s but none worked. I suspect 11.0 doesn't have driver for my new disk controller. Mine is a Intel 82801HBM/HEM. I can't find it in the 11.0 howto.

Does this mean I won't install 11.0 on this laptop?

Quote:

Originally Posted by bgeddy

This looks like your hard disk is not being detected at all. This may have ben a lot easier trying Slackware 12.1 or even 12 but I'll try with your OS choice for now.

Sorry - as your running Slackware 11 I can't really remember what bootup kernels where available. In general the ones ending in .s were built with SCSI support and the ones ending in .i were built with IDE if I remember correctly.

There should be a help screen telling you what key to hit for different kernel options - possibly F2 or something. You may find a huge26.s which you could try or a scsi.s or something. This is from memory so it's a little sketchy.

If none of these work then we'll try passing kernel parameters but for now try the above and repeat the kernel hard disk detection routine to try and get the disk recognised.

T3slider · 11-06-2008, 07:05 PM

Sorry, I wasn't paying attention earlier and quoted from the Slackware 12.1 CHANGES_AND_HINTS, which isn't too relevant. There are quite a few possible kernels to use with 11.0. See this file. There are TONS of (SCSI) kernels to try. If all else fails, you could try booting with the huge26.s kernel and install 11.0 with a 2.6 kernel (you shouldn't have to make any major changes since 11.0 is already set up for a 2.6 kernel if you want to try it).