Litle dirty web server project !
 

Hey guys !

It`s been some time since i`ve been posting around here, guess life had taken over me for quite a while now, been through a lot of health problems, surgery and nasty stuff like that, wich in the end made me come up with this crazy idea. I was just surfing around older threads regarding 486 users or similar. Well, i have to say that did it for me ! I just managed to revive an 166Mhz CPU, 32 MB ram, 1.6 GB HDD baby in just a few hours like if it was new. I first tried out installing win98 the old fashioned way with the floppy boot disk and all that, worked as a charm. Then i installed sound and everything worked. But then I wondered, is it posible to turn this tiger in something useful? So i contacted a friend and asked him if he woul wanna help me in a new project to turn this 486 into a webserver that will host a new Linux User Group (LUG) website wich we will write from scratch in html and php. My steps in creating all this would be :

1. My first bet was to install slackware 10.1 as the main OS
2. We would want to install apache and php and maybe SQL for some database
3. Use VSFTP server for easy FTP access
4. Use OpenSSH for simple remote access

My question for you guys is, cand you see this working? I mean, will this puppy survive the ride?

I will put a 20GB new HDD tommorow for extra space, but I am still questioning the pc`s power to compute with 32 mb RAM and 166 mhz proc. What do you think, will it work?

Yeah, in the sense that horses swim and chickens fly :)

Dunno about current slack but DSL should run on anything from a 486DX with 16MB and up. 32MB RAM will always be your bottleneck so if you can get more then get more. One thing to consider is that even moderately newer HW is way more efficient in every aspect and less likely to wear out relative to this old junk hardware.

Could you detail you`re statement ? :D

Well, I will not offer an opinion on your particular case... but I can offer encouragement!

I run older hardware almost exclusively, and I still have 4 Sharp notebooks with 120Mhz CPU and 32Mb RAM that see regular use! The OS has not been updated for a long while, they are all running Mandrake 7.2.

But I long ago cloned a package repo and updated several important packages over the years - and they keep going!

I am not so sure of your own choices and intended use - but I am sure that you can keep that old box alive for as long as you need to! Good luck!

I did state I will be using Slackware as old as 10.1 or earlier, in wich i have seen stated in many posts regarding the usage of these OS`s on 486 or similar hardware and working fine without a Xwm wich i will not need at all.

This is just something i am doing for fun, and see it as a learning curve also, it isn`t something to be taken dead serious, but still, i could try at least, practice and trial and error can`t do me bad could it ?

I mean, don`t get me wrong, i am planning in hosting a bare bone raw html website with 2 or 3 pages for a start, not any fancy stuff. Just to see how it would cope.

I have run Apache/PHP from those 120Mhz notebooks without problems. In fact, one of them was my first Apache/PHP/MySQL web server! Of course, the software versions were all of that vintage and traffic level was never an issue - but it served some pretty good depth of dynamic content as well as being a development platform!

So as long as you are aware of the limits, you should be able to make something useful of it!

Are you sure you want to use Slackware 10? This is a notice Pat put on some Slackware versions that are now going to officially stop being maintained:

12.1 and above will still be supported.

I`m sure 12.1 isn`t an option for that kind of hardware, this still will be something personal, nothing public, just something we can play around and learn while we`re at it. I can`t think of a stable and familiar distro that can suite my needs right now, DSL is just old and unsupported, slack has this great community where you can get help 24/7 regardless of the version you are running, so as long as we got you guys, i`m happy :D

I think when it comes to keeping these old boxes going you have to accept that you are going to need to work with unsupported software versions. Security updates are pretty low on the list at this point.

That said, if it is web facing it does still need to be on the list - just depends on intended use and what the exposure might be.

Exactly !

If your goal is to learn how to build, run and maintain an LAMP stack why hobble yourself with such underpowered hardware when you can find Pentium boxes with a couple of hundred MiB of RAM for give-a-way prices. Or set up a free tier AWS instance on Amazon's cloud. You can run it for a year free (or nearly so) and have to deal with real world admin issues. Trying to make a 486 fly is a waste of time in my opinion. Now if you just want to be able to say "I did it!", well that's OK. Go for it. Nothing wrong with having a liltte good clean fun.

DNA
AKA mrascii

I am not sure of Bller's reasons for reviving the old box, but sometimes old hardware close at hand is the only option - I know all too well!

I see frequent references to "give away prices" on older hardware, but find such things to be far less available than that would imply when I actually try to obtain it!

And I disagree about it being a waste of time. If those old, slow CPU cycles can produce something of value for him, then let the clock run!

And if anyone has a few pieces of still useful old hardware on the way to the landfill, you know where to find me! ;)

Because you don't find quad-core boxes lying in the street, yet :)

As another aficionado of womble computing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wombles, there is a lot of fun in making old boxes do things they just should not do!

You'll get slack14 onto that box no problem, I have it installing and running in 20MB of memory so far. With sshd running

And I'm quite sure there is more room to cut.

If you start with 10.1 you have an uphill struggle to make sure all the holes are closed, especially if you plan on making it public facing. Start with something newer and it's just a matter of chopping out what you can.

Good luck and have fun!

Quad core! Are they making quad-cores now?! :eek:

Anything with more than 32 bits or more than a single core is still cutting edge for me!

@astrogeek:

LOL

Yes, and that's just your phone! :-)

DNA
AKA mrascii

Does anyone else remember the dawn of 16 bit computing with the introduction of the 'AT' PC? Or the 4-bit chips from Fairchild? Was your first terminal a genuine teletype machine? Paper tape for persistent storage?

Man, I am getting old!

I still consider myself a novice in linux, chopping off kernel modules to save ram isn`t quite my thing yet, so i want to stick with the bare essentials, and install the minimumm amount of packages from the install disk. Don`t get me wrong, i did a tons of webservers on newer hardware, this isn`t the first time i`m doing it, but it`s just not as fun as reviving an old piece of history, and put it to all the work it can take. I`m doing for the fun and learning, nothing too serious, nothing public, just a friends gather round thing to test our knowledge on things. If we`d plan to go public and dead serious, i have a 1 gb ram, 1800 mhz, 460 gb HDD box ready in no time to server, but it just ain`t fun that way.

in that case, if you're looking for a small, fast, robust web server you may want to check this one out:

http://sourceforge.net/projects/mrhttpd/

This looks interesting, i`ll give it a try when i get the system up and running, i can`t seem to be able to install that new 20 GB HDD on that thing, is it because it`s too big for it ?

Could be you are running into one of the many BIOS C/H/S walls, can you boot off your existing drive and access it from within Linux?

Edit
http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Large-Disk-HOWTO.html

It won`t even let the system start at all. I mean it powers on, but the monitors stay`s off, and the floppy doesn`t make that familiar noise when in start`up telling me it will start, but when i put the old 1.6 Gb hdd back in, it starts magically as normal. Cose I did try installing an os on it, i managed to install Slack 10.1 swaping the 20 gb hdd back on my main pc, and installing it from there, then when i tried connecting it to the .. "museum", it didn`t wanna start it. The HDD power`s on, everything seems to work, but the monitors stays off, and that floppy the same.

Strange stuff, but fun as hell !

Now i`m reinstalling win 98, and i will install smart boot manager on a floppy i buyed TODAY, first one in over 12 years [ `Shed`s a tear` ] and hopefully that will let me boot more easely off CD`s on that box and try out DSL or something light to fit that tiny HDD untill i manage to make the damn thing accept the 20 gb one !

I seems that DSL became active again, after 4 years since the last stable release.

And my guess is, that THHIS is the answer to my question, that damn 1024 cylinders bug. Thanks for the link !

Ain`t that pure luck ? Thanks for the heads up Kabamaru !

You might want to rethink this just a little. I run Slack 13.37 on an old P4 with 512MB RAM (which granted is a monster compared to your rig) and 13.37 actually runs better than older versions of Slackware did.

Beware of anything that lies to the computer about the size of the hard drive - kernel support for jumping through the hoops these create was removed quite some time ago.

Not sure from your post, have tried booting from your small HD on one ide channel with the large HD on the other?

No, i removed the small hdd, and put the bigger one in

I managed to install slack 10.1 on the small hdd, it boots, loges in, everything fine, but it can`t find my network, i tried netconfig`ing several times, it seems it can`t find my ethernet card i installed, and when i start the pc, i get a weird error stating something with non hp signed pci hardware, i`m guessing it won`t accept my realtek ethernet card maybe?

LE :

I managed to make eth0 to list, but now when i give ifconfig, i have eth0 and loopback connection, but still when i ping something it won`t find host

Obsolyte.com ran for years on an old Sparc IPX. Lots lof life left in old hardware. That machine is comparable to many home routers and some media boxes. It ahs more power than many alarm system controller/monitors.

I still have my 8MHz 8088-2 in sue with it's whopping 768KB of ram. Triple monitor too, CGA color and monochrome, and MDA monochrome. It even has LAN and voice synth capability. :)

any insight on how to make the internet to work ? i tried searching some info around and found a thing or too, but nothing to conclusive. The modprobe for the eth0 card is started, it shows up on ifconfig first, if i try to ping my router it says network is unreachable. I`m quite stuck for the moment.

Can you post the output of route and ifconfig?

You probably just need to set up /etc/resolv.conf and add a default gateway device/IP.

in ifconfig i have :

eth0 and lo configured by netconfig

sorry i can`t paste the output, it ain`t on this machine

and in route

Kernel IP routing table
Destination Gateway Genmask Flags Metric Ref Use Iface
192.168.1.1 * 255.255.255.0 UH 0 0 0 eth0
loopback * 255.0.0.0 U 0 0 0 lo
default 192.168.1.1 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 eth0

but here is the fun part, in /etc/resolv.conf i have 2 nameservers :

namserver 60.173.48.18
nameserver 94.53.12.30

these seem to me weird, i tried changing them to

namserver 127.0.0.1
nameserver 192.168.1.1

but didn`t do nothing.

LE

I managed to make it ping it`s own adress, but still can`t ping the router adress

Job done guys ! I swapped the ethernet card pci slot and it all worked, and apache works as a charm, could you believe that ! :)_ haha, i`m so proud of myself

I take it 192.168.1.1 is the router address?

What is inet addr: from ifconfig on eth0?

Did you set static IP or are you getting it by DHCP?

[EDIT]
You beat me to it!
[/EDIT]

I should have guessed it could be hardware issues with this kind of antique stuff, but not comes the fun part, configuring apache.

---------- Post added 05-08-12 at 00:53 ----------

Ah and btw, i am ssh`ing from my laptop now, and it works like a dream ! I`m so excited !

Always fun!

Apache should work out of the box if you run /etc/rc.d/rc.httpd start

Then add a virtual host or two (very easy) and add them to the hosts file (use static IP for that box).

Just read through the /etc/httpd/httpd.conf to set most things... long but the choices are simple enough.

It works ok, even on the internet, i just have to install nano first, i hate vi, and start writing some testing pages, and while i`m at it, i should configure vsfptd to work with local users, so i can edit stuff and upload them via ftp

Congratulations! It's always these little things that I get the most excited about too lol!

Litlle update:

I managed to make the 20 gb HDD work, and found a way to make it boot from CD`rom ! I`m thrilled !