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Old 06-02-2013, 03:04 PM   #106
ryanpcmcquen
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I have noticed a regression in WiFi stability in the recent kernels for my Ralink RT5390. I'm not sure what changed in the RT2800pci module to cause that though.

---
Quoting 'romberg'
Quote:
For drivers that use the rt2800lib module someone messed around with the tx power. It causes the rt2800pci (and probably other) drivers to revert to the bandwidth of smoke signals on a cloudy day. The patch here fixes it:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug...iple&id=950735

Mike
---

Guess that explains the issue, it has not been fixed upstream yet. I think we should return to the 3.4.x series (I'll be filing a bug on kernel.org's bugzilla). This is affecting many cards, not just Ralink. While on the ##slackware irc others reported issues with Broadcom cards as well.

Last edited by ryanpcmcquen; 06-03-2013 at 12:35 PM. Reason: Added explanation for cause of issue & formatting. Updated status of fix.
 
Old 06-06-2013, 10:53 AM   #107
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I have submitted the TX power bug upstream: https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=59261

On the 3.9.4 kernel things seem to be working better. Overall the 3.9.x branch would be great to switch to, especially considering all the added Chromebook support. So far it feels a lot more stable than the 3.8.x series. And given all the issues we just had with the 3.2.x series, maybe LTS kernels aren't the best idea.

Like Pat said: (paraphrase) {If it was EOL we would have known the CVE's and patched them.}
 
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Old 06-11-2013, 04:53 AM   #108
TobiSGD
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With going to kernel 3.9.5 users with AMD graphics card are out of the race again. I think I will go back to 14.0 until I have enough money to change my video card with an Nvidia card, where such problems simply don't exist.
 
Old 06-11-2013, 05:19 AM   #109
willysr
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It seems that Linux Kernel 3.9 is working fine with GCC 4.8.1 and Linux Kernel 3.9.x as well
VMWare Workstation is broken when i upgraded gtkmm to 2.24.3, but works fine again after i downgraded to 2.24.2

Last edited by willysr; 06-11-2013 at 05:24 AM.
 
Old 06-11-2013, 05:55 AM   #110
GazL
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From the changelog:
Quote:
After the last experience with upgrading 14.0 to a newer LTS kernel, I can't say that I have too much faith in the idea that LTS kernels can be upgraded
without causing any regressions.
I'm inclined to agree. I've pretty much lost faith in the concept of LTS kernel releases: the amount of stuff that gets back-ported from the Mainline Release Candidates simply makes a mockery of the entire concept of a 'stable' kernel branch, long-term or otherwise.
 
Old 06-11-2013, 07:33 AM   #111
H_TeXMeX_H
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GazL View Post
I'm inclined to agree. I've pretty much lost faith in the concept of LTS kernel releases: the amount of stuff that gets back-ported from the Mainline Release Candidates simply makes a mockery of the entire concept of a 'stable' kernel branch, long-term or otherwise.
So you would say that using the latest stable kernel is better than using LTS ?

I don't like using the latest stable kernel, because a lot of breakage happens between major versions. Lots of things change and too quickly. It's like using Chrome or regular Firefox. That's why I use firefox ESR, and also why I use a LTS kernel.
 
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:51 AM   #112
GazL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H_TeXMeX_H View Post
So you would say that using the latest stable kernel is better than using LTS ?
Short answer: I don't think it's any worse.

Long answer:

The stable branches (both normal and LTS varieties) are updated by cherry-picking and retro fitting patches going into the mainline merge and Release Candidates. We've seen in the past that bugs that are introduced in one release candidate, and then fixed in a later release candidate have made it into the stable branches despite never being introduced into a mainline .0 release. The raid corruption bug that made the headlines a while back was a prime example of this and if I remember rightly it was included in approx 3 consecutive point releases across a number of stable branches.

Also, given that these back-ported patches are likely to have had more exposure running on the latest kernel version than they will have had on older kernel versions there's more chance that any compatibility issues will have been found/fixed on the latest version.

So, while avoiding new features may mitigate some risk, there is also an aspect of risk involved in using the older LTS branch.


I think my view is that; given the way upstream release management is done, it doesn't matter which branch you follow: you're going to encounter breakage at some point, and if that is the case one may as well stick with the more recent release. Upstream QA is simply lacking; it's no wonder that Enterprise vendors like Redhat feel it necessary to maintain their own in-house kernel branches.

I can't help but wonder if there were no stable branches whether there would be some impetus on upstream to make better quality releases, but maybe that's just naive and wishful thinking.
 
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:06 AM   #113
ponce
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probably if there were no stable branches, Greg would have more time for skating, snowboarding and to stay with the family so, personally (and considering also your thoughts, GazL), I hope there will be less LTS kernels in the future...
 
Old 06-11-2013, 09:31 AM   #114
H_TeXMeX_H
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponce View Post
probably if there were no stable branches, Greg would have more time for skating, snowboarding and to stay with the family so, personally (and considering also your thoughts, GazL), I hope there will be less LTS kernels in the future...
So, you know Greg personally ?
 
Old 06-11-2013, 10:26 AM   #115
jtsn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H_TeXMeX_H View Post
So you would say that using the latest stable kernel is better than using LTS ?
It depends on who is maintaining these "LTS" kernels. The 3.2 branch is AFAIK maintained by Debian and they may try to backport stuff to make their stable distribution work on newer hardware, because they don't release often enough.

Nobody cares, if Slackware 13.37 doesn't boot on recent hardware, because we have 14.0 now, but Debian had Linux 2.6.32 till May 2013 and is now staying with 3.2 for the next years to come. Wheezy isn't even at 3.2.45 yet, but at 3.2.41. So happy testing with this so-called long-term "stable" kernel branch.

Quote:
I don't like using the latest stable kernel, because a lot of breakage happens between major versions. Lots of things change and too quickly. It's like using Chrome or regular Firefox. That's why I use firefox ESR, and also why I use a LTS kernel.
Linux LTS is not comparable to Firefox ESR, because ESR updates are just for security bug-fixes, nothing more.
 
Old 06-11-2013, 10:49 AM   #116
ponce
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H_TeXMeX_H View Post
So, you know Greg personally ?
not personally, but from the commits he does I can see how much time he dedicates to his work.
 
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Old 06-11-2013, 10:54 AM   #117
H_TeXMeX_H
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtsn View Post
Linux LTS is not comparable to Firefox ESR, because ESR updates are just for security bug-fixes, nothing more.
Well, if a Linux ESR existed, I would be using it. I care only about security fixes.
 
Old 06-11-2013, 10:56 AM   #118
H_TeXMeX_H
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ponce View Post
not personally, but from the commits he does I can see how much time he dedicates to his work.
He first proposed the idea, so I don't see how you can say that he doesn't want to do it unless you know him personally.
 
Old 06-11-2013, 11:01 AM   #119
BroX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobiSGD View Post
With going to kernel 3.9.5 users with AMD graphics card are out of the race again. I think I will go back to 14.0 until I have enough money to change my video card with an Nvidia card, where such problems simply don't exist.
No problems here with the latest AMD beta driver (13.6) and custom kernel-3.9.4

 
Old 06-11-2013, 11:01 AM   #120
GazL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H_TeXMeX_H View Post
Well, if a Linux ESR existed, I would be using it. I care only about security fixes.
And if that were the case I would be interested in it too, but that's not what the 'stable' and 'lts' branches are.

Personally, I'd love it if Linux had an errata page like OpenBSD uses, but the linux devs simply don't work that way.
 
  


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