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kikinovak 11-10-2013 10:55 AM

A message to all the MLWS/MLED users out there
 
I'm currently considering a big reorganisation of my ML** repos. The current layout has way too much duplicate packages (and effort). Here's what I thought best.

For the desktop, make a 'desktop-common' repo, with all the stuff that goes into the Xfce-based desktop as well as in the KDE-based desktop. Then, create two separate repos with the KDE- and Xfce-specific packages.

So let's say until now you used MLWS-14.0. In the new scheme, you'd have to configure two repos:
  • desktop-common-14.0
  • desktop-kde-14.0

MLED users would have to configure these two repos:
  • desktop-common-14.0
  • desktop-xfce-14.0

There would be some huge benefits in that.

1. New software (except if desktop-specific) can be built much easier, and only once, regardless of the desktop environment.

2. Installing the whole desktop of your choice boils down to configure the respective repository and then issue a simple 'slackpkg install microlinux'.

3. Users of different desktop environments like Mate, Fluxbox, E17 or WindowMaker could still benefit from the 'desktop-common' repository to install all the multimedia stuff and extra apps like Inkscape, Openshot, Scribus, Open Office, etc. without being forced to adopt the respective desktops that ship with MLWS or MLED.

4. Additional benefit: switching desktops on a whim can be done as simply as changing a line in slackpkgplus.conf, 'slackpkg clean-system' and 'slackpkg install microlinux'. For those of us who like to work with Xfce one week and KDE the next.

5. Last but not least, 'desktop-xfce', 'desktop-kde' or 'server' are more descriptive than MLED, MLWS and MLES. ;)

Now I'd be interested to know what you think about that idea. Of course, I'll try to make the transition as painless as possible, which means I'm leaving the existing repos in place for a while, until the transition is complete.

Cheers,

Niki

a4z 11-10-2013 11:08 AM

I have not uses anything from Microlinux so far, but I had a look at the homepage and some of the documents.
I think this is a really amazing project and I find a lot of interesting stuff there, thanks for all the work you do and sharing it.
back on topic:
what you suggest here sounds very reasonable.

gegechris99 11-10-2013 11:25 AM

Hello kikinovak,

I'm not a full microlinux user. I just use the XFCE customization packages. Anyway.

Generally speaking, I would believe that any effort to optimize the work to maintain package repositories should first be a decision by the maintainer of the repository. So if you feel that such reorganization of the microlinux repository is needed, who am I to object :)

But since you asked, I would suggest to rename desktop-common to desktop-extra or desktop-additional as I understand that the desktop-common repository would be additional applications to complement the desktop-{kde,xfce} repositories rather than a repository of dependencies that should be installed before desktop-{kde,xfce}.

Granted, the microlinux experience would not be complete without those additional applications.

kikinovak 11-10-2013 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gegechris99 (Post 5061956)
But since you asked, I would suggest to rename desktop-common to desktop-extra or desktop-additional as I understand that the desktop-common repository would be additional applications to complement the desktop-{kde,xfce} repositories rather than a repository of dependencies that should be installed before desktop-{kde,xfce}.

Granted, the microlinux experience would not be complete without those additional applications.

Well, desktop-common is supposed to contain not only all the applications, but the whole bunch of libraries, multimedia stuff, Java, TrueType fonts, translations for Firefox and Thunderbird, Flash, etc. for a full desktop experience. So maybe I should rename it to something like 'desktop-base' to be more explicit?

gegechris99 11-10-2013 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kikinovak (Post 5061960)
So maybe I should rename it to something like 'desktop-base' to be more explicit?

Yes, it would be more to the point: desktop-base must be installed prior to desktop-{kde,xfce} (this is just a concept as the order of installation is not important as long as you install packages in both repositories).

kikinovak 11-10-2013 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gegechris99 (Post 5061969)
Yes, it would be more to the point: desktop-base must be installed prior to desktop-{kde,xfce} (this is just a concept as the order of installation is not important as long as you install packages in both repositories).

Well, "desktop-base" it is then. And I'm also thinking about splitting this one into two repos:
  • desktop-base: multimedia libs, beefed-up versions of Audacious and MPlayer, common desktop apps used by all desktops, TTF fonts, Flash, Java, etc.
  • desktop-extra: additional applications like VirtualBox, Blender, Scribus, Google Earth, etc. which a user won't necessarily want to install on his machine, but which can come in handy.

Don't know if this still follows the KICK principle (Keep It Clean Kiki). ;)

willysr 11-10-2013 12:31 PM

The same naming is used in MSB project :)
We used base and extra as the directory naming and it sounds to work even though most users will install from both directories

slimkid 11-10-2013 12:32 PM

The differences between MLED and MLWS have confused me. It seemed like MLED contained a lot more multimedia/codec packages than MLWS. I don't know if that is true, but that's what it looked like. It's what's been holding me back from Microlinux, because I would want all those extra packages with MLED, but I use KDE. The solution you propose is perfect, especially if you split desktop-common into desktop-base and desktop-extra. Still keeps everything simple (including from a system maintenance perspective) while maximizing flexibility. :D

kikinovak 11-10-2013 01:18 PM

Well, I'm starting to be convinced that this is indeed the way to go. As a side effect, this could potentially become the ideal 'extra' repo for Chess' and Willy's MATE repo. Meaning a user who wants a MATE desktop with bells and whistles and extra apps galore would only have to configure the MSB repo, 'desktop-base' and eventually 'desktop-extra'.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea.

Bertman123 11-10-2013 01:19 PM

These sound like good changes. Having the base applications and desktop specific packages split up might make it easier for you to maintain and easier for users to install.

kikinovak 11-10-2013 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slimkid (Post 5061987)
The differences between MLED and MLWS have confused me. It seemed like MLED contained a lot more multimedia/codec packages than MLWS. I don't know if that is true, but that's what it looked like. It's what's been holding me back from Microlinux, because I would want all those extra packages with MLED, but I use KDE. The solution you propose is perfect, especially if you split desktop-common into desktop-base and desktop-extra. Still keeps everything simple (including from a system maintenance perspective) while maximizing flexibility. :D

I understand this. The reason for this is that I only built the various multimedia libs as I needed them. K3B is happy with ffmpeg, while Brasero has runtime dependencies galore, among which the whole gst-plugins-{awful,horrible,disgusting} collection, not to mention build deps like libisofs, libisoburn, etc.

The new repo organization will bring much more clarity here, as it looks.

chess 11-10-2013 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kikinovak (Post 5062003)
Well, I'm starting to be convinced that this is indeed the way to go. As a side effect, this could potentially become the ideal 'extra' repo for Chess' and Willy's MATE repo. Meaning a user who wants a MATE desktop with bells and whistles and extra apps galore would only have to configure the MSB repo, 'desktop-base' and eventually 'desktop-extra'.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea.

This would be awesome. Thanks for all your great work on MLED @kikinovak. I really like how you are customizing and improving XFCE on Slackware and having a way for an MSB user to use your repo for other stuff would be fantastic -- I know I'd take advantage of it! :-)

Bertman123 11-10-2013 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chess (Post 5062104)
This would be awesome. Thanks for all your great work on MLED @kikinovak. I really like how you are customizing and improving XFCE on Slackware and having a way for an MSB user to use your repo for other stuff would be fantastic -- I know I'd take advantage of it! :-)

As a user of both his MLED and MLWS I have to agree that he does indeed do great work. His hard word is appreciated!

Bertman123 11-10-2013 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chess (Post 5062104)
This would be awesome. Thanks for all your great work on MLED @kikinovak. I really like how you are customizing and improving XFCE on Slackware and having a way for an MSB user to use your repo for other stuff would be fantastic -- I know I'd take advantage of it! :-)

As a user of both his MLED and MLWS I have to agree that he does indeed do great work. His hard word is appreciated!

kikinovak 11-10-2013 11:30 PM

OK then. Expect some downtime for at least a few days, until I get this whole thing rebuilt and reorganized.

Sorry for the inconvenience, but I think it'll be worth it.

EDIT: I'll see if there's a possibility to leave things in place while putting up the new repos in parallel.

Niki


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