Is reverse engineering illegal?
 

Is reverse engineering a binary illegal? I'd like to be able to transfer pictures to my iPod from gtkpod, but gtkpod doesn't support this fearture yet. My understanding is that iTunes does something to the pictures that you put in it, and this is what's stopping the gtkpod project. I'd llike to work on coding the picture transfer feature, and I don't know where to start. Suggestions if reverse engineering is illegal?

You need to look at the license of the product, typically if it's not open source reverse engineering is prohibited by the license. If it's open source then whats the point!

so then it would be safe to say that reverse engineering iTunes would be illegal?

Also depends on where you live. In some countries legislation gives you certain "basic rights" no matter what the license agreement says. Now I'm not sure if reverse engineering would count as such a right where you live, or if infact any such rights exist in USA. I would suspect not, it's not exactly a country known for emphasizing citizens rights over corporate ones... ;)

I am not a lawyer (I only play one on TV), but I thought that (in the US) reverse engineering was perfectly legal provided you didn't fall into certain categories, such as having been involved in the project being reverse engineered, or having seen the original source code.

I'm certainly not a lawyer so make of this what you will. The iTunes license states in section 2.

My emphasis.

However make of it what you will

graeme.

I think the point here is that while it's perfectly legal for you to go and write a script which will transfer photos from your ipod to your computer and vice versa (which is why gtkpod skims along the right side of the law if you look at it in the right light - it's *not* iTunes, it's software which copies mp3s from your computer to an mp3 player and then creates a non-iTunes-like database of them, etc).

However, I would say that very probably *cracking the encryption/DRM* that iTunes puts on those photos is illegal, yes.

My solution would be to stop using iTunes. If you're really feeling brave, put Linux on the iPod and then you've got no problems =) Not sure how feasible that is, but.. =/

Again, I provide this without any indication of being legal advice...

This is from wikipedia: "Reverse engineering software or hardware systems which is done for the purposes of interoperability (for example, to support undocumented file formats or undocumented hardware peripherals), is mostly believed to be legal, though patent owners often contest this and attempt to stifle any reverse engineering of their products for any reason."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_engineering

It is put in most EULAs nowadays that reversing the product is illegal. However, this stops almost no one, and I have never see that anyone was prosocuted for reversing alone. Worst case scenario, you write a program that works but that was written through *illegal* means.. you still have a working program and if you want to release it, do it anonymously...

And there is always the logic that "it is only illegal if you get caught"

Reminds me of the philosophers quandary, "Does a falling tree make a noise if there is no one there to hear it?" Unfortunately, the law doesn't take that view, breaking the law is still breaking the law regardless of whether you get caught or not. Also I don't think that this forum should advocate actions which shall we say are a little suspect.

That said the view on reverse engineering and file formats is interesting.

graeme.

The thing is, I don't even know where to start to copy pictures. GTKPod can't currently, and you can't just put them on the iPod HD. I'm not going to do something that may be illegal, I'll just live w/out picture functionality if it is illegal. I don't use iTunes, but I want to figure out picture functionality. I'm 17, so I can't afford a lawyer if apple decided to sue me for reverse engineering their software. I don't want to put any open source projects in jeopardy either....

My understanding is that the Digital Millinium Act destroyed any Americans ability to reverse engineer a product. If anyone has a house for me Europe, I'm ready to move!

True, and not coming to a *complete* stop at a stop sign is illegal and far more harmful. However Im sure everyone does it frequently. Though you are right graeme, this forum is not the place to support things that are suspect.

This is a respectable establishment after all. :)

Ill just leave it at this. If you are a little iffy about the legal ramifications of this, just do it for your own personal use. Do not distribute it, free or otherwise. For crying out loud you bought it, it is yours to break, tear apart, rebuild, or improve. And better yet do it before you turn 18.. :)

I'm not sure I have enough experiance in software to do anything. Are there "decompilers" or something?

Yes, I am iffy about legal ramifications, I'd rather not ruin my life before I even have one:). What I should really do is get DVDJon to do it....ok, maybe not. I don't want to do anything illegal, but I would like to contribute this feature to gtkpod. How was gtkpod figured out? What allowed the gtkpod project to get access to the iPod originally?

If you live in the United States of America, look up the Digital Millennium Act before you make your decision! Breaking ANY proprietary encryption or storage method is illegal. This includes storage devices. Europeans keep hacking while the US holds pride in false technological superiority.