[SOLVED] Sub forum idea

Right. I have seen many posts lately which are just blatant rtfm.

Do you guys reckon we can get those guys to help each other and learn in the process if those type of threads get dumped in a seperate sub forum. That way it will be a clear signal for most to stay out and encourage the noobs to do some leg work.

What are your thoughts on that?

Ironically, I think you're posting in the wrong forum yourself.

There's a dedicated forum towards the bottom for suggestions and feedback.

While I think that we need to find some way to politely but firmly tell them that they need to do some research on their own, I don't think pushing them into a different forum is the right solution.

As Maples says, there is a dedicated forum for discussions related to how the forums work and ways to improve, or just complaints, LQ Suggestions and Feedback.

May wish to check some of the more recent threads in there related to various discussions on how to more effectively help the questioners. There's also the Welcome to LQ link that can be used for the obvious questioners who start out really poorly in offering their questions.

Moved: This thread is more suitable in <LQ Suggestions and Feedback> and has been moved accordingly to help your thread/question get the exposure it deserves.

Whereever they post, just give them an honest (and tough if needs be) answer. Others will see it and folks may get the hint that researching on your own is a good and necessary thing...

Hi,

You can look at; http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...#faq_lqwelcome that can be used by you as a referral link to those type of members.

Hope this helps.
Have fun & enjoy!

Originally Posted by ericson007 Right. I have seen many posts lately which are just blatant rtfm. Do you guys reckon we can get those guys to help each other and learn in the process if those type of threads get dumped in a seperate sub forum. That way it will be a clear signal for most to stay out and encourage the noobs to do some leg work. What are your thoughts on that?

Funnily enough:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...ts-4175523397/

...from last year, and I agree with you totally. My suggestion went from that, to moderation of all new user posts up to xx (say, 10), so that such questions aren't even shown on the forums at all. I still think such posts are spam, period...they take up space, and add NOTHING of value to the site. Even if we look up and hand such folks a link, that link may not be valid in the future, whereas a Google search for that question WILL get a result.

Oh dear. Sorry about the sub forum. I understand the links etc, but there are really tons of extremely trivial questions. I agree with being firm etc, but do not wish to just make people feel they are chased away.

This is just an idea that popped in my mind, but it might be worth looking into.

Adding a whole new sub-forum and treating it like an email "Spam" folder seems like a lot of effort. What if someone made a sticky and every new "spam" message got merged into that? That way, people would see both the explanation of why their post was moved and how to fix it (the first post) as well as lots and lots of examples that clearly don't meet the LQ standards.

Originally Posted by ericson007 Oh dear. Sorry about the sub forum. I understand the links etc, but there are really tons of extremely trivial questions. I agree with being firm etc, but do not wish to just make people feel they are chased away.

Well, I voiced the same thing last year, and post #6 in that thread sums up my feelings.

I did start that with a sub-forum in mind, but after some thought, realized that it's untenable. First-post moderation up to a new users first 10 posts, however, is VERY doable. I think anyone who's posted here for a while, has seen many, MANY posters come with "plz to be giving the link to red hat". They will be handed a link, with a warning to please don't do that again/try to look it up, and most of the time, they never come back.

I honestly don't think it's 'chasing people away', but rather not enabling laziness. Chances are, such posters found THIS site with a Google search, so it boggles my mind why they can't also search for "how to download rhel", or "linux bash script to read a file" as well. Being spoon-fed links to such things isn't good for anyone. First post moderation will send folks to search, and HOPEFULLY when they do post, they'll be able to contribute to the knowledgebase, by asking a decent question, which others can learn from.

Hi,

Thankfully LQ has a openness that prevents these type of blocks for new users. Sure for seasoned members it can be worrisome or troubling that a new member may seek to be spoon fed. You as that seasoned member have the right to ignore or post the suggested link to help that new member.

To impose a 10 post moderation would create a mod nightmare. Remember we are volunteers too, just like you we want improvements but do not want to put blocks up to refuse or dismay new LQ members.

Thanks for the feedback. We realize this is an issue and that's why we put the time and effort into creating http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...#faq_lqwelcome (which does not seemed to be used as much as I'd like). After the issue was brought up I closely monitored new posts and the number of these type of posts is small, certainly a vast minority. To address some specific suggestions in this thread.

* Creating a subforum and then expecting new members to simply help each other will almost certainly not work out like you think it will. Senior members educating new members and having a culture that is helpful and welcoming while also clearly expecting some amount of work on the case of the OP is more sustainable and will have better outcomes long term.

* Having a single thread for these would turn into an absolute unmitigated mess.

* Moderating new posts is both not in the spirit of LQ and creates a terrible first impression. A very small percentage of new posters have their posts sent to moderation now and it generates multiple complaints PER DAY. Having the first 10 posts from every member go into moderation would be orders of magnitude worse. You're either over estimating how much mod time we have, under estimating how patient people are or, more likely, both.

I'd encourage senior members to either use the canned response with link that we have created, which will serve to onboard new members who really want help in a friendly and constructive way while also weeding out members who are unwilling to help themselves or simply not respond AT ALL (so that a different member can do the former). There have been multiple cases recently where a new OP with what I would consider a valid question has been treated in a way that I do not expect to see at LQ, which is something I'd like to avoid moving forward.

--jeremy

Originally Posted by jeremy I'd encourage senior members to either use the canned response with link that we have created, which will serve to onboard new members who really want help in a friendly and constructive way while also weeding out members who are unwilling to help themselves or simply not respond AT ALL (so that a different member can do the former).

Hi Jeremy...

I've been one who has been doing this and to be quite honest, I'm not seeing the results that I think we would all like to see from this approach. The vast majority of the folks I've done this either have not respond at all (they never post again) or they just seemed to ignore what I've posted and continued on with the thread. What makes it worse is when another member will come along and provide them with the answer they're looking for.

Dealing with this problem is going to require more "teeth" but, yes, done in a way that avoids, as much as possible, the problems you've mentioned. I agree there needs to be a balance here. On one hand keeping LQ a open and friendly place but at the same time, recognizing these kind of posts are undesirable and are a strain on the time and energies of the senior members and will be dealt with.

One proposal that I think I've mentioned before is that the posters who do this first receive warnings, then if that doesn't work, issue infractions. Then, if all else fails, they are banned from the site.

Regards...

Can we add a "how to utilize code tags" link or other to http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...#faq_lqwelcome ?

Sorry if that's off-topic.

Originally Posted by Habitual Can we add a "how to utilize code tags" link or other to http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...#faq_lqwelcome ?

Code tags are outside the scope of what we're trying to accomplish with the above linked/canned response.

--jeremy