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Old 09-04-2009, 11:22 AM   #1
canyonbreeze
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New forum topic: Linux - Virtualization


Virtualization issues are becoming common enough to maybe deserve their own forum? With sub forums like "Linux Host - Windows Guest", and the reverse, etc.
 
Old 09-08-2009, 09:46 AM   #2
jeremy
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With the rise of native in-kernel virtualization, I think the time for a "Linux - Virtualization" forum may be upon us. Is there anyone who would be against such a forum?

--jeremy
 
Old 09-11-2009, 08:43 AM   #3
alan_ri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
With the rise of native in-kernel virtualization, I think the time for a "Linux - Virtualization" forum may be upon us. Is there anyone who would be against such a forum?

--jeremy
Maybe Linus Torvalds,

...and I do agree with him on most of the things he said below;

Quote:
I don't doubt at all that virtualization is useful in some areas. What I doubt rather strongly is that it will ever have the kind of impact that the people invovled in virtualization want it to have.

It would appear that virtualization is the "message-passing microkernel" of this decade, and that people have a really hard time accepting that the reason operating systems still basically look 100% the same today as they did almost forty years ago, is that that is simply a very practical arrangement!

So every decade, you'll find somebody who "reinvents" the OS. Apparently just because they are bored with the fact that operating systems have really been the same-old, same-old for a long time. Guess what? Wheels have been round for a really long time, and anybody who "reinvents" the new wheel is generally considered a crackpot.

It turns out that "round" is simply a good form for a wheel to have. It may be boring, but it just tends to roll better than a square, and "hipness" has nothing what-so-ever to do with it.

Linus
Torvalds also said virtualization is “not that big of a deal” and he predicted that new ways of users interacting with operating systems will represent the key changes in the computing industry.

Virtualization has “been around for probably 50 years. I forget when IBM started offering virtualization on their big hardware. Maybe not 50 years, but it’s been all around for decades and it’s very interesting in niche markets - I think the people who expected to change things radically are just fooling themselves,” Torvalds said. “But also, I’d actually expect that new form factor is in new input and output devices. If we actually end up getting projection displays on cell phones, that might actually change how people start thinking of hardware and that, in turn, might change how we interact and how we use operating systems. But virtualization will not be it."

Last edited by alan_ri; 09-11-2009 at 02:59 PM.
 
Old 09-11-2009, 08:48 AM   #4
pwc101
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No particular objections, just seeking a clarification: would it be a forum for people trying to run a Linux virtualisation host system, or one for people running Linux under some virtualisation software, or both?
 
Old 09-11-2009, 08:59 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pwc101 View Post
No particular objections, just seeking a clarification: would it be a forum for people trying to run a Linux virtualisation host system, or one for people running Linux under some virtualisation software, or both?
My thought is that it could be BOTH combined, or, the "virtualization" forum would be divided into two sub-forums, one each for each respective host (Win or Lin).

Given the number of threads about virtualized machines, I think it's a good idea over-all, whichever way (if any) it ends up materializing.

The subject of virtualized machines is a unique situation IMO, with topical specifics possibly requiring some familiarity with BOTH OS's, plus the VM software itself.

And, there's no question there have been an increasing number of threads on this subject; but a search would quite probably show that these threads are being created in a variety of different places, because the OP isn't really sure *where* they should post it. Some probably end up in /General, because they involve Windows.


Sasha
 
Old 09-11-2009, 09:06 AM   #6
catkin
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Great idea!

How about starting with sub-forums "Linux host + Linux guest", "Non-Linux host + Linux guest" and Linux host + non-Linux guest"? That covers all the Linux-centric possibilities except "Linux host + any guest" and "Any host + Linux guest" which might be going too far?
 
Old 09-11-2009, 09:41 AM   #7
jeremy
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If we add the forum it would be for Linux as a guest or Linux as a host. While it's possible we'd need to have sub-forums in the future, to start it would be one single forum. At this point I am considering adding "Linux - Virtualization" very soon.

--jeremy
 
Old 09-11-2009, 09:48 AM   #8
GrapefruiTgirl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
If we add the forum it would be for Linux as a guest or Linux as a host. While it's possible we'd need to have sub-forums in the future, to start it would be one single forum. At this point I am considering adding "Linux - Virtualization" very soon.

--jeremy
Pure speculation at this point: something tells me that "Linux as a Host", either IS, or WILL BE, the most common scenario.

Win can barely keep itself running, let alone some guest OS's
 
Old 09-11-2009, 09:50 AM   #9
TBC Cosmo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremy View Post
If we add the forum it would be for Linux as a guest or Linux as a host.
I would offer that if there were to be sub-forums, they should be broken out by virtualization platform. (Virtual Box, KVM, Xen possibly, VMWare)

Since while conceptually the same, each one is a different animal in implementation. May be too confusing for one forum to be a catch all.

My .02
 
Old 09-11-2009, 03:30 PM   #10
alan_ri
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So, it looks to me that we will have this new forum... and basically, no matter how will you call it or what will you think of it, we will have a forum dedicated to WinShit OS.

I had a feeling that things will go this way, so I've tried to reply with something that creator of Linux himself said, in hope that it will make a difference, but obviously it doesn't.

I'm asking you to think very carefully about this topic/OP's suggestion here.

It may not be important to anyone here, but I'm really thinking about leaving LQ forever if this "new forum" is going to be implemented into LQ.

Last edited by alan_ri; 09-12-2009 at 03:01 AM. Reason: grammar
 
Old 09-11-2009, 03:38 PM   #11
TBC Cosmo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alan_ri View Post
basically, no matter how will you call it or what will you think of it, we will have a forum dedicated to WinShit OS.
I don't see how a forum called Linux Virtualization will in any way mean that it is dedicated to Windows.

It will be like any other Linux dedicate forum, where there are posts regarding interoperability with Linux. This could mean even with Solaris, not just win.
 
Old 09-11-2009, 03:49 PM   #12
jeremy
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Virtualization has absolutely nothing to do with Windows. In fact, virtualizing Linux on Linux is a huge use case (some virtualization solutions don't even support Windows).

--jeremy
 
Old 09-11-2009, 04:08 PM   #13
EricTRA
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I would agree that a forum dedicated to virtualization is a good idea but I for one would like to see it not integrating other OS from the host point and limiting support to those other OS only to connectivity level between Linux and 'the other', thus being only Linux as host and 'another' as guest. I fear that if complete interoperability and working environment are to be discussed in sed forum that it will draw in a lot of MickeySoft (or others) users who cannot get decent support anywhere else without paying for it.

And if that happens it might take away the very heart and intention of LinuxQuestions as it is now.

If other OS (read mainly Windows) is to be integrated in that forum also then I think Jeremy should expand the limits of the oven because a lot of flamewars will be launched

Kind regards,

Eric
 
Old 09-11-2009, 04:20 PM   #14
XavierP
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Luckily for you all, the mods of LQ are able to distinguish between virtualisation on/of Linux and pure Windows questions. If the question is about Windows, it will be moved to General. In exactly the same way it happens now.

As Jeremy says, having a virtualisation topic does not mean that LQ will become WindowsQuestions. Don't forget, General has been the place for Windows questions for years now and yet we've still managed to have Linux as our main focus.
 
Old 09-11-2009, 04:27 PM   #15
EricTRA
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That would do the job. Looking forward to the new forum already.

Kind regards,

Eric
 
  


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