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Old 02-25-2014, 05:48 PM   #5221
TobiSGD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
Working on OSS projects is always an option.
But rarely one that is well paid, especially if you are not a developer.
 
Old 02-26-2014, 12:28 AM   #5222
irneb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
In that case you are correct but, work is work. You should use the tools supported on the platform there for compliance reasons.
If you don't like the platform or tools employed there then people should feel free to leave. Working on OSS projects is always an option. GNU always needs good people.
Not everyone using PC's are programmers / UX designers / even in the IT industry at all. I'd even go so far as to say the great majority of PC users are in fact in a job where they've got little to no IT responsibilities at all, let alone programming.

So for 99% of users, they simply use the software available. If that software is written to run only on MFT then they'd be on a mainfraime of the 60's and be forced to still use that old OS. The simple fact is that these days (at least since the 90s) most general business programs are written to run on Microsoft's OS(s), and even most special case software which caters to niche businesses.

Sure there are sometimes clones and/or alternatives which "could" be used. The trouble is that this would (at the very least) necessitate a huge investment in retraining staff to use an alternative work process. E.g. (from my own experience) - yes I can use Blender instead of 3d Studio, but getting as proficient with Blender as I am in 3ds would mean at least a year's worth of being less productive.

Clones are also not as great (usually) as their MS versions. E.g. the one I have a lot of experience with is AutoCAD (Windows / Mac) and it's clone BricsCAD (Windows / Linux), only recently has BricsCAD come close to being a full clone. A couple of years ago it was still very inferior to ACad. You can see this as being similar to the difference between using Visual Studio to develop DotNet apps as compared to making the same stuff through MonoDevelop. It's possible - but you don't get all the tools available in VS, so you'll most probably be less productive (at least at first).

Edit: and then of course you do get situations where there is simply no alternative (let alone a clone). Here I've come across BIM (Building Information Modeling). There are but 2 "true" BIM systems: Revit / ArchiCAD. Both ONLY available on windows. I've been looking for close to 10 years now, and have simply not found anything remotely similar.

Last edited by irneb; 02-26-2014 at 12:35 AM.
 
Old 02-26-2014, 02:20 AM   #5223
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If I understand you correct. If people don't care about their 'PC' usage why should they bother with Linux/*nix?

I couldn't derive a point from your post. Keep it short -- there is enough to read on the Internetz
 
Old 02-27-2014, 12:48 AM   #5224
irneb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
If I understand you correct. If people don't care about their 'PC' usage why should they bother with Linux/*nix?

I couldn't derive a point from your post. Keep it short -- there is enough to read on the Internetz
OK, short: They do care, they just can't do anything about it themselves. Reasons for wanting something like Linux: cost, choice freedom, security, robustness, etc.
 
Old 02-27-2014, 01:28 AM   #5225
irneb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
I couldn't derive a point from your post.
Point is in answer to this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
If you plan to use a 'PC', be prepared to write your own software as a final and ultimate contingency.
Analogy: I want a car that does X, Y & Z. But all cars either don't have X, or Z is only partly implemented, or or or.... I'm NOT a car manufacturer, I'm a car user (driver), but you tell me I must now "be prepared to build my own car".
Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
Otherwise try and do your serious work on your iPhone or iPad.
Even less of an option for me. In this case the hardware itself won't allow me to "work".
 
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Old 02-27-2014, 09:45 AM   #5226
moisespedro
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I think people should be prepared to build:
-Their TVs
-Their radios
-Their smartphones
-Their cars
-Their planes

And everything else they might need, for god sake why are you even using Linux? Why don't you build your own kernel?
 
Old 02-27-2014, 09:54 AM   #5227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irneb View Post
Point is in answer to this.
Analogy: I want a car that does X, Y & Z. But all cars either don't have X, or Z is only partly implemented, or or or.... I'm NOT a car manufacturer, I'm a car user (driver), but you tell me I must now "be prepared to build my own car".
You can't correctly compare building a car to writing/modifying software.

1) There is a difference between hardware and software
2) There is a difference between car tools and materials, and free software tools
3) If someone gave you a free car, would you expect them to modify it for you because you complain?
 
Old 02-27-2014, 11:24 AM   #5228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moisespedro View Post
I think people should be prepared to build:
-Their TVs
-Their radios
-Their smartphones
-Their cars
-Their planes

And everything else they might need, for god sake why are you even using Linux? Why don't you build your own kernel?

Yes why not?!? Or you're too brainwashed to acknowledge how things actually work.

The form of the 'PC' (hardware and software) exists today in its present form because of a set of fundamental operating axioms defined at the outset. Think binary switches in terms of the hardware. This is known as the Principle of Computing.
Whilst unique, it's not the only way to compute.
 
Old 02-27-2014, 11:52 AM   #5229
moisespedro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxbawks View Post
Yes why not?!? Or you're too brainwashed to acknowledge how things actually work.

The form of the 'PC' (hardware and software) exists today in its present form because of a set of fundamental operating axioms defined at the outset. Think binary switches in terms of the hardware. This is known as the Principle of Computing.
Whilst unique, it's not the only way to compute.
Although I do love learning it is humanly imposible to learn all you need to build all sorts of things you use in your life. The majority of the people don't have even the slight idea of how a computer works. They do not know what source code is, program languages, kernel, etc and it is perfectly fine. To them, a PC is a tool and they have no obligation to learn everything off it, they just want to use it and that is what they do.
 
Old 02-27-2014, 12:12 PM   #5230
linuxbawks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moisespedro View Post
Although I do love learning it is humanly imposible to learn all you need to build all sorts of things you use in your life. The majority of the people don't have even the slight idea of how a computer works. They do not know what source code is, program languages, kernel, etc and it is perfectly fine. To them, a PC is a tool and they have no obligation to learn everything off it, they just want to use it and that is what they do.
That's actually true, which is why there is something very wrong here. We aren't as smart as we think.
The pinnacle of peoples' accomplishments is putting 2 and 2 together. They are allegedly the best people.

Technology is the compounding of simple ideas iterated over and over again. You lose track quickly...
 
Old 02-27-2014, 12:26 PM   #5231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moisespedro View Post
it is humanly imposible to learn all you need to build all sorts of things you use in your life.
This is wrong.

There might not be a whole lot of people that can, but it is certainly not impossible.
 
Old 02-27-2014, 12:50 PM   #5232
moisespedro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by szboardstretcher View Post
This is wrong.

There might not be a whole lot of people that can, but it is certainly not impossible.
Pick all the objects and "virtual" things (like softwares) and try to think if you could actually learn and build all of them by yourself. Even if you do I think it would be on a very poor way. Anyways, people aren't obligated to learn to program, learn how a PC works, etc. We do this because we are PC entusiasts.
 
Old 02-28-2014, 12:42 AM   #5233
irneb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by szboardstretcher View Post
This is wrong.

There might not be a whole lot of people that can, but it is certainly not impossible.
Not enough time in one life. Therefore it IS impossible, unless you're immortal and have a few centuries to "waste".
 
Old 03-01-2014, 09:41 AM   #5234
Garthhh
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tor
Quote:
Originally Posted by szboardstretcher View Post
This is wrong.

There might not be a whole lot of people that can, but it is certainly not impossible.
Becoming more possible everyday
3d printing is one example

it's much easier to manufacture custom stuff because of information technology
we work in function blocks of components more than ever
a tv lets you see & hear, but the content comes from a different device
the interconnections are standard
a car can be assembled from a crate motor installed in a old car or in combination with other after market function blocks...
building your own whatever has never been easier
 
Old 03-01-2014, 10:16 AM   #5235
moisespedro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garthhh View Post
tor

Becoming more possible everyday
3d printing is one example

it's much easier to manufacture custom stuff because of information technology
we work in function blocks of components more than ever
a tv lets you see & hear, but the content comes from a different device
the interconnections are standard
a car can be assembled from a crate motor installed in a old car or in combination with other after market function blocks...
building your own whatever has never been easier

Err, if you have to use an old car you are not exactly building it by yourself
 
  


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