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Old 01-12-2003, 11:48 PM   #16
Half_Elf
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well will YOU pay big price for a useful but not essential software? As example, I will take Partition Magic... This software is WONDERFUL but very expensive (80$ for a software you will use just few time). People will use a cracked version of this software or will not use it (fdisk and others similar progs can do the same). Only a big business doing a tons of install/uninstall will buy this software.

People here can talk about "how much work it takes to build a good software" but I'm sure that if you are running a Windoze box, you have at least 1 cracked/illegal software. Sometime the price is just to high, the trial just too dumb or the software just no so essential, so YOU take the cracked one.

I'm an university student, I don't have a lot of money to waste. And I'm suppose to pay 750$ (or just 450$ if I show my student id) for M$ Visual Basic .net ??? Man it's the price of a new computer!!! It's over all the money I can gain in a month! Sorry, but my vb .net version is cracked.
I have a great respect of people coding these software, I know it's bad and it kills the business to use warez but... sometime...
 
Old 01-12-2003, 11:58 PM   #17
webfiend
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Quote:
Originally posted by Half_Elf
I'm an university student, I don't have a lot of money to waste. And I'm suppose to pay 750$ (or just 450$ if I show my student id) for M$ Visual Basic .net ???
450 for VB.net? With a student I.D? Are you crazy? Go to journeyed.com and find Visual Studio .NET for $100. Jeez, I've heard of lame excuses, but that's just pathetic!
 
Old 01-13-2003, 11:01 AM   #18
NSKL
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Yeah but take this into consideration:
I lived 12 years in Yugoslavia, people there can't afford to pay $300 for windows, plus $50-$100 for every program and game. Hell, the average salary at the moment is below $100, how can you expect someone to waste it? Companies should consider the "environment" they sell their software into, and adjust the prices. This will surely cause some ppl to go to other countries and get the software they need for a lower price, but it won't hurt as much as warez.
-NSKL
 
Old 01-13-2003, 12:09 PM   #19
unSpawn
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Hell, the average salary at the moment is below $100, how can you expect someone to waste it?
So you think it's a waste of money, but OTOH still good enuff for you to want to have it, and so you approve of gettin' it for free.

Warm like a pebble,
brilliant like a mountain fog,
this vulcan logic...

Last edited by unSpawn; 01-13-2003 at 12:11 PM.
 
Old 01-13-2003, 03:13 PM   #20
Half_Elf
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Quote:
450 for VB.net? With a student I.D? Are you crazy? Go to journeyed.com and find Visual Studio .NET for $100. Jeez, I've heard of lame excuses, but that's just pathetic!
Thanks for the lame...
I'm in Canada and our money value is half the American Dollar (so everything we buy from you cost us more, eh!). And if NOW the price for vb.net goes down, 6 month ago (I'm now in Christmas break!!), when I started my vb course, vb.net was REALLY at 450$ (remember it's CANADIAN dollar not US one).

And even if I only have to pay 200$ (100$ US is around 175$ in Canadian money, plus shipping I will pay around 200$ maybe little more) it's a lot of money and I'm not sure I can't afford it. Especially if I know that the company building the software have a LOT of money and still sell his software at that price.
 
Old 01-13-2003, 03:25 PM   #21
MasterC
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This has certainly turned into an interesting debate...

It's the "I'm in X situation, does it make it right for me to steal?" age old debate. If you feel you need something bad enough, and are VERY aware of the consequences, well then you are able to make the decision on how to acquire such things.

It's a decision each person must make, and there are those who would completely say it's wrong. Those people are speaking for themselves, saying "If I were in that situation, I would not do as you are doing". That is all. They are saying how they'd make the decision, and then you must make your own.

This debate is always gonna bring good people from both sides to argue their points, but in the end, I highly doubt anyone will change anyone's mind.

Cool
 
Old 01-13-2003, 03:39 PM   #22
Ciccio
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returning to the first posts.

Warez... is there need for warez? Hackers should hack windows, not linux. There is plenty of open source free software and there is always something to replace all paid software.

it's a wrong concept. Warez are only WINDOWS software... since linux is open source (there is very little chance to create a full multi platform software precompiled!!!)
 
Old 01-13-2003, 04:29 PM   #23
NSKL
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Theres another thing UnSpawn. Two years ago in that country it was perfectly legal to walk into any computer shop and tell them what you need, pass by an hour later and pick up the, still warm cracked software CDs AKA wares, and pay but a fraction of what they are really worth. Then they rightly introduced the "anti-piracy" law, in the meanwhile thanks to mofo president we suffered another war which pretty much destroyed little economy we had. People were used to buying cheap wares when they had money, now they don't have money, but they are forced to pay for full worth of the software. They simply can't afford it, but still want to have it, naturally. What im saying might not make sense, but things ARE this way.
What i also said, and here say it again, is that big companies should lower the prices of their software in these countries. This way they will lower the pirated software (which at the moment hurts them more than to lower the price).
-NSKL

PS. By software, i mean windows software (microsoft, adobe, macromedia to name a few companies). Lately Linux is becoming more popular, because it is free, no need for wares. If people are caught owning wares they have to pay a big fine, so people choose Linux if possible. In the end, aren't the programmers who work for aforementioned big companies payed a lot anyway? It's not the programmers that are getting hurt, at least not directly, it's the company since the programmers are paid once they finished the job. Or am i wrong regarding this issue?

Last edited by NSKL; 01-13-2003 at 04:34 PM.
 
Old 01-13-2003, 05:10 PM   #24
macewan
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The only thing that I've come across that's needed is a good wysiwyg html editor for linux. Screem & bluefish aren't what I'm mean either. Not something as heavy duty as IBM's either. A gedit weight, basic html specific editor.

When I'm good enough at programming, it's the first thing I'll be tackling.
 
Old 01-13-2003, 06:03 PM   #25
Ciccio
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Edit it wit VI!!!! HTML is a language that doesn't need compilation, therefore you can write it in anytext editor. Then, write it with VI or VIM or PICO or even EMACS... I hate those big programs specificaly dedicated to HTML edition (by that I mean Frontpage AND Dreamweaver).

BTW, if you install the slow openoffice you'll get a good HTML editor.

Besides... need doesn't justify pirating software... I mean, if that software is created by a programmer and he wants to charge a reasonable price for it... I'd love to pay him. But if a big monopoly company wants to charge me for a damned bad software... then they can go to hell and I'll always support pirating their software!
 
Old 01-13-2003, 06:30 PM   #26
macewan
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hrm. you have much passion for vi. yeah i use vi to edit. big deal. but this isn't for me. this is people like my wife. she's been on the internet since early 90's. she's a writer. probably doesn't want to fuck with vi for simple edits. and the others like her that want a simple visual html editor like frontpage. that way they can concentrate on the content of the site/page instead of worrying that they didn't close a fucking /> tag.

oo does have a nice html editor but its' so damn heavy. dreamweaver, too heavy also. but something like a ghtml (gedit) program would rock. it's just what the doctor order for the linewbies to be able to dotcom with ease.
 
Old 01-13-2003, 07:16 PM   #27
Ciccio
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I see. For that you can use oo's... it's good enough. If you want you can surf a little bit... try a search in www.google.com/linux that should return a few things.

Excuse my spelling but I've just burned a finger and I cant write that goood any more... so.. Sorry.
 
Old 01-13-2003, 08:09 PM   #28
macewan
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agreed

oo's the best html editor that's wysiwyg at the moment. to bad it's so freaking heavy. shame. it's ok. i'm going to start a project to create a light weight wizy html'er
 
Old 01-13-2003, 10:55 PM   #29
webfiend
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Quote:
Originally posted by Half_Elf
Thanks for the lame...
I'm in Canada and our money value is half the American Dollar (so everything we buy from you cost us more, eh!). And if NOW the price for vb.net goes down, 6 month ago (I'm now in Christmas break!!), when I started my vb course, vb.net was REALLY at 450$ (remember it's CANADIAN dollar not US one).

And even if I only have to pay 200$ (100$ US is around 175$ in Canadian money, plus shipping I will pay around 200$ maybe little more) it's a lot of money and I'm not sure I can't afford it. Especially if I know that the company building the software have a LOT of money and still sell his software at that price.
My apologies for overreacting. Actually, I think that MS charges too much for a rather mundane collection of software. Your instructor should teach everyone to use open source programming tools. Then we could have avoided this whole misunderstanding
 
Old 01-13-2003, 11:04 PM   #30
neo77777
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I don't want to touch warez topic, but here I saw an intersting point - prices must be adjusted for the market the product is sold for. Take the movies for an example - Harry Poter II is number one hit in Russia right now grossing $5.7 milllion (this is in american dollars not rubles) here in U.S. the movie makes it in one day, but there do you expect people whose average monthly income is framed in $100 to pay $10 a ticket to see the f...ing movie? I don't think so, I spoke to my friend who lives in Kiev the ticket price in openning was equivalent to 2 bucks and he told me it was freaking expensive so he went to see it a week later when the price was cut in half, the same should be applied to the software, but I really never heard of anybody back in former USSR shelling out a buck for Windows software, well the were shelling out a penny for a blank CD and make copy from a burnt copy, which in its turn was probably originating from here (United States), so unless the adjustment is justified I don't think the "intellectual property" right will weight an once more in such markets like former USSR block.
 
  


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