Hi all,

After installing Ubuntu 16.04 on my new dell inspiron 11 3162 (CPU = celeron 3050, RAM = 2GB), and then installing xfce4 desktop (to make it run better on small hardware), I was noticing that the GUI was not being as ¨snappy¨ as I am used to on similar hardware, Acer 720c, but with Debian/xfce4.

Specifically, when using firefox, there was a noticeable delay switching tabs and also when doing 2-finger scrolling on the touchpad I would do the action, wait, and then see the screen move.


during the Ubuntu install I had seen a warning: possible missing firmware for module i915, which I traced to the following firmware package:

kbl_dmc_ver1_01

Which seems to have something to do with graphics?, so I installed it and it SEEMS to have fixed both these problems.

But this was a qualitative problem so I could be kidding myself... especially since I did not believe that kbl could relate to an old celeron CPUs.

So... the question is:

Would installing kbl_dmc_ver1_01 on my machine affect those issues? How?

Many thanks in advance for any insights.

Regards....

Andrew.

i think you did right.

but for the sake of argument...
how did you trace it to that package?

a search led me to this - maybe relevant?

Normally things will log into dmesg when firmware is missing and what firmware is missing.

$ sudo apt-get install intel-microcode

$ strings /lib/modules/3.16.0-4-amd64/kernel/drivers/gpu/drm/i915/i915.ko | less

$ strings /usr/lib/xorg/modules/drivers/intel_drv.so | less

Not seeing much for firmware, beyond the microcode that goes into the CPU (in debian jessie). Seems like only the new CPUs have such things.

https://01.org/linuxgraphics/downloads/firmware

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/intel_graphics

Hi Ondoho,

The bug fix you found only removes the warning, it does not seem actually to do anything and it confirms there is only minimal risk of causing hardware regression.

I did see the same ask ubuntu post that you found. It was that post plus another post, also from ask ubuntu, that encouraged me to try the install. Unfortunately, after reboot I don´t have the tab for that other post anymore. The process I followed to get to there was a bit of a detour:

I was running SOFTWARE UPDATER, SETTINGS and noticed the ADDITIONAL DRIVERS tab had an option:

using processor microcode firmware for intel CPUs from intel micro-code (proprietary)

which was not selected. So, I searched for that, and decided it should do no harm to enable. That process failed, but eventually the warnings in the DETAILS text referred to the same issue that I had noticed during installation about the i915 module, so I searched for:

missing firmware for module i915 ubuntu

read a bit more, especially the 2 posts on ask ubuntu - the one you found plus one more - and then searched for:

how to install kbl_dmc_ver1_01 ubuntu 16.04

which gave the intel page with the necessary tarballs. AFter the install, I went back to Software updater >> settings and the

using processor microcode firmware for intel CPUs from intel micro-code (proprietary)

option is now enabled. Note that I never succeeded to enable it through software updater, so it was definitely the kbl_dmc_ver1_01 package that did it.

But can you tell me what this package actually did? Why is something for Kaby lake helping with a Celeron?

Cheers....

Andrew.

Hi Shadow 7,

Indeed. Your post is just what my question is about. The first of those links,

https://01.org/linuxgraphics/downloads/firmware,

is the very same page where I actually downloaded the tarball from!

It says the error warning should be ignored, but it also says ¨use the table above to determine if your platform is even supported.¨ So here is the text from that table:

Product name Product code Firmware
Kabylake kbl GuC - Ver 9.14
DMC - Ver 1.01
HuC - Ver 2.0
Skylake skl GuC - Ver 6.1
DMC - Ver 1.26
HuC - Ver 1.07
Broxton bxt GuC - Ver 8.7
DMC - Ver 1.07
HuC - Ver 1.07

The first part refers to kaby lake processors, and that is the DMC that I downloaded and installed. And my question is:

Is the Kaby lake DMC actually heping me on an intel Celeron 3050 system? It really does seems qualitatively to be much snappier now when using firefox, but these things are always so tough to judge.

Cheers....

Andrew.

Wow,

I think i found the answer here:

https://www.extremetech.com/computin...ded-processors

It seems that Kaby lake hyper threading has been back fitted, not just to core architecture but also to pentiums and Celerons and that it can signnificantly (15-20%) improve performance.

It is not 100% clear that my exact processor has kaby lake, but it is definitely possible, so I am beginning to believe my own eyes on this!!

Cheers..

Andrew.

I thought the latest Intel drivers would only affect the latest processor video (i915). Seems I read that you just ignore that warning on unsupported processors. Might be wrong on that. I've been ignoring it on Braswell for almost a year.

Hi Jefro,

If this microcode is about enabling or optimising on-chip hardware support for threading, it is not at all unreasonable to think a video module would feel the pain, although the benefits may be wider than that.

Cheers..

Andrew.

I'll agree that video impacts overall performance on gui based systems. Just saying that the newest i915 video drivers from Intel only affect the lastest two processors I think??

HI Jefro,

Your processor is Braswell, so one cannot assume how much, if any, of this applies.


Which is why I was asking the question: The table referred to above shows that the firmware is for any Kaby Lake processor and we all assumed that ¨Kaby lake¨ meant ¨latest generation of processors¨, so how could it possibly help?

But it is not so. According to the extremetech link I put up, kaby lake is a hyper-threading technology that has been retrofitted not just to i5 and i7 but all the way back to Pentiums and Celerons. I found a list of all Kaby lake processors at wikipaedia, which had 3000 series Celerons in it. Altough it does not mention my Celeron 3050 explicitly, the list is probably already out of date as they keep adding new models and my machine is brand new, so the chip would be just a couple of months old.

If i915 mmodule is reporting that the processor has kaby lake on it, and there is firmware available to help use it, I don´t think the message should just be ignored, as it seems many people are assuming.

What I can say objectively (to add to my perception that the machine runs snappier) is that when streaming video on youtube the xfce4 system load monitor was always sitting on low 70s before installing but now it is sitting on low 60s. For a small machine, that is a significant difference.



Cheers....

Andrew

what exactly do you mean by retrofitting?
surely it is something that has do be done physically in a factory, it's not like you can retrofit it at home, with soft/firmware?

also i feel the need to just mention (sorry if this offends you, but better be safe than sorry) that the pentium and celeron etc. brands have recently been re-used by intel to name new processors, they really have nothing to do with e.g. pentium processors from the late 90s / early 2000s.

Hi Ondoho,

By retrofitting I mean changing the chip´s design to include the Kaby Lake tech. Done at the factory, not a home project. Same part number, new revision number.

You mention that ¨the pentium and celeron etc. brands have recently been re-used by intel to name new processors, they really have nothing to do with e.g. pentium processors from the late 90s / early 2000s.¨

Not offensive. On the contrary, I imagine the modern Celeron has about as much to do with the original as a modern toyota corolla has to do with the 1970s Corolla.¨

The original Celeron was cheap rubbish. The modern dual core versions, built on modern processes, may share some archhitectural ancestry, but I am finding they do pretty well if the measure is computing power / battery life.

Cheers....

Andrew.

Hi Jefro,

You said your processor is ¨Braswell¨? Have a look here:

https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-....146637.0.html

Where it states that the on-chip HD graphics is Braswell. What is your processor? Is it a Celeron 3050 or something else? How old is it? and what was the exact error message? i.e. was it about missing firmware for Braswell or Kaby lake?

Cheers....

Andrew

I have a small mini computer that I like to play with. Generally I use the latest kernel and test it. I is a 3050 but that doesn't mean that my system is similar at all to your dell.

If you look at many of the posts and time stamps for the issue i915 you will find many posts on that topic. You may also see in those posts and links to specifications and programming why I say you can ignore that warning.

However, if you are happy with what you did then that is all that matter.

I was going to post a wiki link on kaby lake. I don't think anyone understands what you mean by retrofitting any features into older processors.

The best place to get information about this may be the Ubuntu forums where this has been discussed by folks who created Ubuntu along with Intel site. Intel provides a lot of open source code. They may be a bit behind in offering linux drivers in some cases. I think their latest driver documentation should provide answers to what you can install.

Hi Jefro,

I don´t understand what is hard to understand about the word ¨retrofitting¨. It seems very appropriate in the context.

Maybe you did not read it, so here is the title of the extremetech article I linked above:

¨With Kaby Lake, Intel finally brings Hyper-Threading to its Pentium-branded processors¨.

Here is some of the text:

¨The CPU giant announced multiple new Pentium-class CPUs based on Kaby Lake, including the first Pentium SKUs to feature Hyper-Threading since Intel retired the Pentium 4.

Ever since Intel transitioned to its Core architecture in 2006, the Pentium brand has been used for lower-end processors with lower clock speeds and fewer features. Hyper-Threading wasn’t initially a differentiating factor because the Core and Core 2 families didn’t use it. By 2010 Intel had introduced Westmere-derived Pentium processors and (mostly) used the following formula for its desktop processors (those wanting a more detailed breakdown on Intel’s SKUs should consult our buying guide for the Core i5/i7 families):

Core i7: Four (or more) cores. All CPUs have Hyper-Threading
Core i5: Four cores, no Hyper-Threading
Core i3: Two cores + Hyper-Threading
Pentium & Celeron: Two cores, no Hyper-Threading

With Kaby Lake, Intel is changing up its feature set.....¨

Specifically, the article is saying that Kaby lake hyper-threading has now been put in pentium and celeron class cpus. The article goes on like this:

¨.... Intel has suddenly discovered Pentium buyers might enjoy the creamy smoothness of Hyper-Threading.

Frankly, it’s a smart move for Intel to make..... Adding Hyper-Threading now gives Intel its own positive story to tell. The gains from HT should be noticeable, since it typically improves performance by 15-20% and there’s no shortage of desktop workloads with support for dual cores with Hyper-Threading, since that’s the most common laptop CPU configuration and the laptop market is significantly larger than the desktop space these days.¨

Prima facie, Intel´s release strategy for core processors is now a ¨tick tock tweak¨, where tick is new process, tock is new architecture, and tweak is optimisation. Kaby Lake is the tweak part of the current cycle, and it includes other modifications in addition to those that relate to hyper threading.

As I understand it, the talk in this article about Kaby Lake on low end processors (Celerons and Pentiums) is about retrofitting the hyper threading part of it onto those CPUs.

Cheers....

Andrew.