Linux is one of the most customizable operating systems out there.
 

Linux is so customizable you can strip down a Linux operating system down to 50 Megabytes and still be fully functional. My example DSL("Dang Small Linux" is what I like to call it.) Gentoo is a fully customizable distribution you can edit the provided Python scripts to install any package you want.

For anyone who doesn't want to learn a new operating system stick them with Ubuntu and make it look like windows they have a script out there for that. If you want help with your Linux machine there are at least 50,000 people willing to help you. If you don't like viruses Linux is for you.(Considering you don't download random junk off the Internet and like to play with the file permissions.)

When I was researching Linux for the first time I found a list of reasons why to switch. A few reasons were if you want something you can customize, keep your porn safe(I am not a fan myself of it.), or etc. (I put porn in bold to get your attention, well it worked.)

Ever since I switched to Linux windows for me has been like :banghead:. Linux is as simple as you make it. If you are a C or C++ programmer looking for code Linux is your gateway not mentioning Unix and Unix based operating systems are the programmers operating systems.

All I have to say is :twocents: for your thought.

Nice, but there are a lot more than 50,000 people willing to help. :cool:

Exactly why I changed to Linux: The "I can customize it exactly to my needs"-thing. So I could get rid of Windows on all my systems, because I just don't need it anymore, only thing that runs Microsoft here is my XBox360.

It just works - everyday, all day, 24/7. I rarely reboot.

This is dumb. How about, if the user wants to use Windows, let them use Windows. Linux is not Windows, I think it is idiocracy to try to make it look like Windows.

I've had way way more problems with linux than windows or mac. Updates break things way too often, they require constant maintenance, nothing "just works".

I think maybe if you use ubuntu or one of the really user-friendly distros and are careful not to do anything out of the ordinary, if you "customize" it only in a few ways, then maybe its not so bad. But even with that, I imagine people have trouble using flash and opengl still, etc., etc..

That said, its true that people are pretty helpful in the community.

Here is my Windows experience. I install Windows, there are very few drivers installed out of the box. I have to look at the labels on all of my hardware to figure out what brand each piece of hardware is, then search the web for suitable windows drivers. (I haven't installed Windows since XP, so I'm not sure how much this has improved).

Once the drivers are installed, Windows seems to run fine for a while. After a while, it gets slow, my computer freezes from time-to-time, I get blue screens etc...

With Linux, a lot of drivers are built into the kernel, so I normally don't have to worry about searching everywhere for drivers.

I am wondering if you are talking about Windows machines that you bought with Windows pre-installed. If this is the case, of course there was virtually no setup, everything would work out of the box. The same is true for Linux, if you buy a computer with a Linux distro pre-installed on it, then everything will work out of the box also.

You must be joking. There's no comparison between linux and an officially supported OS. Downloading and running a couple drivers off of company websites versus guessing which of several open source drivers works best and how to add just the right configuration lines to xorg.conf or whatever else and which libraries work well with that version and which software does and doesn't work. And then there's an update and it all breaks.

If anything its the price of the "freedom" of open source, but let's not go making linux out like its good for an everyday desktop.

I don't know what you are doing with your systems, but my systems run, regarding to drivers, out of the box, only exception here are the graphics drivers, but these are in the repositories and configure themselves, so no guessing the driver and fiddling with configuration files. I am running Debian unstable on all my systems, except my fileserver, and it never "broke". Even better, my drivers are updated by my system, I don't have to look at the manufacturers website all the times, if there are bugfixes.

The only fiddling and tinkering with my systems is that fiddling and tinkering that I want to do, to learn and to try new things.

By the way, what do you mean with an officially supported OS? An OS that gets security updates once a month, instead of when the fixes are available? Or is the official support that from third party vendors, from whom I have to buy antivirus/-malware software, because otherwise my system will be rendered unusable?

I'm not saying those other OSes are great either, I'm just saying the hardware companies actually support them and the drivers work better and always will than on linux or BSD or whatever.

If you've had an easier time setting up a linux system than a windows or a mac than you're lucky. Right now, I've got occasional graphics glitches, occasionally the usb driver crashes, sound was working but stopped with a library update. On a debian testing system I have, things have been pretty stable and that's definitely improved in terms of ease-of-install. But its never going to work as well as an officially supported OS. And even on that debian system that's been pretty solid, there's all kinds of stuff that just works out of the box on another OS that linux is spotty with.

I'm not criticizing linux, it has some strong points and some real advantages over other OSes, but its not a walk in the park to use or maintain.

I asked you what an officially supported OS is, but you gave no answer.

Linux is a OS that was made to work out of the box 24/7 as a everyday desktop. . Especially Ubuntu, Debian, Mandriva, Redhat, etc... I don't know what you do to your system, but I have a old worn out System, and it's Ubuntu works faster that Windows on a New computer

I would say that you are joking + you don't know what you're talking. Will not bother to explain.

And I agree with lewisforlife. I guess I missed it in my first post.

Um, Linux IS an officially supported OS. Do you know how many people are behind it's development? It's not just one guy in his basement.

Do ATI and nVidia offer linux drivers side by side with their Windows and Mac drivers on their website? No? Then its not officially supported. That's what I mean. Obviously.

As for virus protection, yeah, linux viruses and worms are rare. But I've never used anti-virus software on windows or mac and I've gotten one virus that I accidentally installed myself in many many years. So I could just as easily ask what are you doing to your windows and macs systems to cause them to be so unstable.

The number of bugs and issues I have to deal with for a linux desktop far exceeds the number I have to deal with on windows or a mac. And far far less software is supported. That's just how it is. It doesn't mean linux doesn't have some real strengths, but user-friendly desktops aren't one of them.

Ehm, what? May be you should have a look at their websites, they offer Linux drivers there "side-by-side" with Windows-drivers. And we go even one step more, we don't have to download Intel drivers for Intel graphics chips, because they are already included by Intel. That is official support.
How can you know that without using antivirus software? It is not so that the virus says "Hello World!! Here I am!".
I don't have to deal with bugs, that does my update function, it gives me an update for the all my apps, at that time a patch is available. On Windows I have a "patch day" once a month, so that it can be that Microsoft leaves you unpatched for 30 days, but there were already cases that bugs and security holes were not patched for years. And I have to update every installed application itself, no centralized updates. That is what I call "I have to deal with bugs and issues".
There are more than 30.000 packages in the main repository of my distro, and there are a lot of unofficial repos. I think what you mean is "My proprietary Windows app is not supported on Linux." (maybe it will even run with wine), but that is definitely not the fault of Linux, but of the developers of this apps that there is no Linux port.
My Linux desktops do work exactly like I want, look like I want, and I know how they work. At first, you are simply not able to achieve this with Windows, and second, how can they be more user-friendly?

I came into the world of linux less than 2 months ago... I had no clue how to do ANYTHING. I didn't even know what the file system was :( . A week into I could do alot of powerful stuff I never would've thought could be done by someone like me... Now, if I had never EVER used Windows and was just switching, It would take me ALONG time to do what I did in Linux. And most MAJOR companies support Linux, (Google anyone?) and make hardware for it. Even Broadcom is getting better about it, and they're pretty darn stubborn.

Exactly! You could probably change Linux around and make it Look EXACTLY like Windows (Thank you open source) then throw a random person in front of them, and they will think it is the exact same thing, IF YOU WANTED TO. But little would they know the box their sitting at has tenfold the power of Windows.

You know what we can say? We can say The Future is Open! M$ can't say that, if you understand me. That's the power of Linux. And here's the video from IBM that shows that. A great video; Prodigy.

Whatever.

Nice comeback. I reckon the discussion just ended.

The threads that you posted into are not appropriate in the areas of this forum except the general.

Just so you know ATI open source many of there drivers. Some distributions you don't even need to download them.

No, I wrote a bunch of stuff and deleted it. I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you people.

AMD does not. Xorg writes drivers their own drivers for AMD graphics which they are open sourced while AMD makes their own drivers which are proprietary. AMD does not own the open source drivers that Xorg is writing. You can say that there is an Xorg developer working in house of AMD to help write the open source drivers or Xorg drivers for AMD graphics.

Not to make you look stupid, but actually nVidia and AMD graphics does provide support for Linux and they provide you option to pick Linux drivers if the web server or your browser did not bring up the correct page for your operating system. Some manufactures that supply graphic cards does in fact have Linux drivers stored on the driver disc.

Windows registry is where all programs write to, so the inconsistency and improper writes to the registry gets corrupted over time. There is no way to fix this. Sure there is gazillion programs to help fix the registry, but all of them does not clean up all the crap. Just on usage Windows screws it self up because it does not double check it self to write to memory.

I have experience a lot of bugs in several operating systems. IMHO, Windows is the most buggiest operating system in my life. Linux is not created to be user friendly. Sure there are distributions that try to do that like Ubuntu and Sabayon, but they are far to be friendly. Windows and Mac OS are not friendly either. I wish that Windows 7 is as friendly like it is in its commercials, but it does not work that way. I had issues with Windows 7 trying to setup a network printer. My Linux system running CUPS easily setup the network printer. The network printer is behind Windows XP. Please do not tell me or others that Windows is friendly.

There is a problem with your statement. Who saids that you have to be lucky to have an easier time to use operating system like Linux or an easier time to use computers. From experience pre-compile distributions are the worst to use if you want to learn Linux. They are OK to setup a computer for a specialized task like a HTPC, a server, or a dumb terminal, but not for someone that wants their setup to be updated every week or month. The best way for keeping up with updates is use Linux distributions that have rolling releases like Arch Linux and Gentoo.

Using GUI installs for Linux is the worst way to install Linux. There is no sure way it will work all the time. Also Linux is a fixed system, so any updates will ruin the setup. Compiling programs is the only way for Linux. Windows and Mac OS are variable systems. Linux is all about doing thing manually, but Windows and Mac OS is about doing thing by GUI. Doing things by GUI does not always work, so you have to resort doing things manually. Mac OS X does provides an option to configure manually while Windows still have to be configured by GUI.

Gentoo has made the compile process easy. Also it makes it easy to fix any breaks when updating programs. I use Gentoo and I am not lucky for it being stable. I got in the habit of updating the package manager, running revdep-rebuild to check for any breaks, and updating separate areas in the installation instead of doing a world update. The graphics that I use is nVidia and it runs fine. Gentoo makes it easier to install nVidia drivers even though installing nVidia drivers is easy to do. I have to worry about what firmware or microcode version to use for the driver version that I am using or else the WiFi NIC or PVR card does not work. If you do not like manual configuring, tough that is how Linux works. Also it is the same as other operating systems like Windows and Mac OS.

Wrong!! They said that for the 3d drivers. They own the 2D drivers.

You are misinformed and confused. There is open source drivers for AMD graphics cards which are written by Xorg developers. The proprietary drivers is completely written by AMD graphics developers. The two drivers are completely different in code. The 3D in Xorg is own by Silicon Graphics which created OpenGL. Both AMD and nVidia includes pre-compile 3D libraries for their proprietary drivers. Xorg developers have to create their own 3D libraries which is mainly based on Mesa3D. Xorg developers are also using Gallium3D which is the future 3D framework for Xorg.

AMD does not write open source drivers. There is an Xorg developer working for AMD. AMD just provides the microcode documentation to give the open source community a helping hand to develop graphic drivers for AMD graphic cards.

I started with Ubuntu then switched over to knoppix. I would say that installing and configuring linux was horrifying and _very_ long. Had it not been for some guys (and girls too) I would have never got the display configured.
Then came debian 4 - inspite of me clowing around with the os it has _never_ let me down. It never fails to boot up. It has never ceased working. I sometimes think my life would have been incomplete without linux. I would have never understood technology without having linux. For 3 years after installing debian it still works. I update it - only security updates - and it still runs like day one.
Vector is one of the beautiful os out there. I am amazed to see what these guys pack in one cd that the others cannot pack in a dvd. This is more about slackware philosophy 'simplicity is divine'. Simple tools like sed grep find are _very_ powerful once you read the man pages.
It is an abomination to compare winduhs and linux here - unless you have some real issues or you have any experience with linux.

Are you referring to source code of some sorts or is every one doing the _ thing.(Linus Tovalds does it a lot in his emails.)

I know! What is with _the_ thing, I've seen several refrances to it. Sorry to go off topic.

Well I started getting us off topic, but I really want to know.

Sorry, in this context I meant a long time. I had to pass the screen resolution options to kernel and I could not figure out how to tell the kerel how to set the resolution to 800x600. Took me more than a week to find out how to pass the kernel parameters :).
And yes '_' is something that comes from reading a lot of source code. I love the way Linus uses it.

The _ before a word and after is a way to underline or give an emphasis of a something in plain text. Plain text is a _great_ for emails before HTML came and _screwed_ emails up.

Anyone have thoughts on Gentoo.

Gentoo is a lot of fun. I only stopped using it because of its unconventional system configuration, particularly in the system startup. If it used the normal system configuration I'd be using it to this day.

Gentoo is very well developed. The documentation is the best available. I often miss using it.

I'm currently stuck using Windows only on my desktop system after getting internet access from a company that offer wimax wifi and proprietary drivers. I do normally setup a dual boot system on most of my systems and use Linux as my main OS. I also have two G4 Mac machines but only have OSX Tiger on those. My netbook dual boot with mandriva & XP, I need windows for work purposes. For all the OSes have their own issues, I would rather use a free version with problems then buy a version and have constant problems. You make the call which would you prefer!

There is no need to argue. Your points are well taken.

It's true: desktop Linux is (mostly) geared toward computer "enthusiasts."

I'm a long time computer hobbiest. I built my first 386 system when I was 11. I have never purchased a computer "in a box," they've all been built out of hand-selected, well-researched components. I'm a "control freak" . . . back in the days of DOS I was always tweaking my AUTOEXEC.BAT and CONFIG.SYS files. When I run a 'ps' command on my desktop and see a process that I don't recognize, I investigate.

I am not just any user. I would imagine that lots of desktop Linux users are like me. Even if they aren't, I don't care at all.

I run the right desktop operating system for me. Many of the things which you describe as "advantages" of commercial operating systems on the desktop seem like big turn-offs to me. The idea of being force-fed updates or needing to run anti-virus software because the underlying operating system is so shoddy that it is fundamentally unsound makes my skin crawl.

But that's just me. In my opinion (and that's all it is), Linux is not for "the masses." They should all keep running Windows and Mac OS, shopping at Walmart, and drinking Budweiser. That's what makes them happy, and there's nothing wrong with that, for them. It is not for me, however.

Then again, I'm an American and I believe in freedom.

Of course, many enthusiasts believe that desktop Linux is "the answer" to the computer woes of everyone. Maybe they're right; who am I to say? I've encountered many "casual" users here on LQ, way more than I ever thought that I would. For them, Linux is an easy, free, alternative OS, that they are able to use quite happily and easily. Good for them.

I must admit, though, that some of what you say strikes me as odd, and makes me wonder what year you are living in. "No centralized updates," and "having to manage bugs yourself?" That sounds neat, but I haven't had to do any of that since like 199x, unless I've chosen to.

Also, the thing about inferior hardware support smacks a bit of stretching the truth. I'll grant you that, since I started running Linux, I've made sure that the Linux kernel supports any components I buy before I buy them, so my experience might not be typical. Nonetheless, I've been shocked at just how many hardware vendors are offering Linux drivers these days. It's almost creepy.

But, yes, based on what you say, and the perceptions that you share, a commercial desktop OS is almost definitely the right choice for you. There's nothing wrong with that. I don't want to drive around in a 1960s muscle car like my friend Marty does. For him, keeping the carburetor clean and tweaking the timing are a joy. For me, those things would simply be a pain in the ass.

If I might ask, though, why do you feel like discussing this on a Linux discussion board? Is there some closure that you need on this topic? Is it perhaps a reaction to the much-maligned (and unfortunately real) "Linux user's superiority complex?" If so, please stop worrying. I can't strip down and rebuild an engine in less than a day, but guys who can aren't "better" than me; we're just different. The same applies here.

For all we know, you're a professional UNIX system administrator who is just trying to make the point that Linux on the desktop is overly complicated for its application. For most, this is undoubtedly true. For me, it's awesomely true. I wouldn't have it any other way.

Cheers!

First, Foodown that was deep.

Do you hate centralized updates?

Your using slackware.(vanilla everything)

I love slackware in the way that it doesn't brand anything. Gentoo is very fast, but very slow to compile things. Slackware didn't catch my eye as much as Gentoo. Sure Gentoo is fast when everything works, but when it doesn't, is when I learn more about Linux.

Ok I got into an argument on one of my forums about Linux embedded devices not being compatible to Linux systems.(MP3's,etc.) They in there argument stated there argument they stated that just because a device is running a striped down version of the Linux kernel doesn't mean it's Linux.

Personally I think what defines a Linux operating system is the kernel.

Got no idea why this poll was started. We all use linux/unix dont we? But then I would go with linux anyday. At the risk of being called crazy I would say that I even dream of linux. Even if someone has a computer that has a different OS I carry a boot cd (knoppix or even bt3) to do anything. I consider linux to be _far_ superior to anything that can be ever produced for computing. I am waiting for thee day when we would have linux (not android) based phones and that will give me one more reason to boast about linux :).
I am happy with the linux principle of 'do it yourself' because it teaches me to dig a bit deeper and understand or ask around for more information.
Linux can be compared to the Mir space station where people all around the world contributed to make somethinf worthwhile. Well the thing here is the Mir space station (IMHO) came down while linux will stay forever. Someone please say amen to that.

You can put stripped down OS's on some android phones.

Agreed,i work for a hollywood based VFX studio and everything here is done on linux workstations.From animation to rendering e.t.c.

No.

Strictly speaking, I agree with you. I suppose that any kernel could get "bastardized," though, if the rest of the OS had been changed enough.

Now this is interesting. I was under the impression that the film industry was almost 100% Mac.

What pieces of software are you guys using?

Mostly in house softwares running on a custom made linux distribution.The renderfarms runs linux too

Nice.

Since we seem to be talking about clusters. How would you cluster two different machines with 32 and 64 bit architectures.

People are still comparing Ubuntu to Windows?

I utilize several distro's routinely, including Ubuntu, and I find that there are none which are more "Windows-like" than the others.

At any rate, I have found Linux to be the most customizable OS. Even the BSD's can't hold a candle to it, but perhaps that is due to the relative lack of BSD-based distro's.

Yeah . . . If "Windows-like" is a selling point for someone, then I think that the right OS for them might be something that starts with a 'W' and ends with a "dows."

Is Linux the most customizable OS out there? Well, I suppose that it's at least tied for first with all of the other open source operating systems, since all of them could be built from scratch with any changes you wanted right in there . . .

If Linux beats out FreeBSD and crew, it's only because of the work done by the people at LFS. With their nice, easy tutorials, most of the work of building a completely customized Linux system is already done for you.