can you use a console as a window manager
 

i mean one that can run X based applications, im not talking about failsafe
if so. how

A console login only runs console apps. To run X apps you have to have X running and it requies a window manager.

damnit!
 

are there any X window managers that are actually just a console?

Take a look here
http://www.plig.org/xwinman/

There aren't any that are "just a console". But there are some that are just a background and the only program you have to start is a console.

twm should already be on your system.
aewm++ is a very simple window manager.

i don't get what you mean by "console as a window manager". if you're trying to run X apps w/o actually running a graphical X-server, then try looking up Xfvb. XFvb simulates a dummy framebuffer but using this obviously means you won't see a thing on screen.

strictly speaking, a window manager isn't a prerequisite for X, although without a window manager to draw windows around X programs you can't really do much, there are gui programs tha use the framebuffer console, not X, but i'm not sure what programs do this.

well, thanks for all you guy's help. i have one question though
Is there anyway i could get twm to start with the a full maximized window with the following command?

If your using the .xinitrc file for your X startup config, put in it the line

rxvt -bg black -fg white -geometry [whatever you resolution is] &

If you want a console-like X, get ratpoison.
If you want an X-like console, get screen.

Take a look at this thread

http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...hreadid=131306

it seems to have an answer to your problem

Screen is an awesome console window manager.