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Old 06-17-2007, 03:14 PM   #16
wavesound
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ATI - Cards Drivers M$


Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmeister
If you think thats going to do anything thats fine but I never received even an acknowledgment from ATI over complaints about their MS driver.Now why would they treat Linux any better?

I basically posted here so that people on this board are warned about ATI.

They are going to try to make better drivers anyway - all of Hollywood runs on Nvidia because they use mostly Linux and those are not fx5200 cards they use there.
For sure ATI wants a piece of that.

Hi
I can still remember the frustration with ATI on Windoze!!!
If you didnt have the install CD you were sunk. also most service packs seemed to kill ATI cards.
I have never considered them for Linux, but I hope they see the light (and the bottom line) and allow FOSS drivers for there cards.
Mind you you may find the FOSS driver work better than the M$ ones!!

Just my 2p's worth

Cheers
Bob
 
Old 06-18-2007, 10:12 AM   #17
V!NCENT
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wavesound
I can still remember the frustration with ATI on Windoze!!!
What frustration? I never had a single problem with ATI on Windows.

Quote:
If you didnt have the install CD you were sunk.
What are you talking about? Did you to download them from the producer instead of the ATI website because of customizations a company can make to the cards? _ESPECIALY_ if you have a laptop.

Quote:
also most service packs seemed to kill ATI cards.
Service packs change Windows drasticaly. No wonder it broke the driver. Happens to a _lot_ of drivers and software as well.


ATI on Linux sucks. If they don't release full documentation I'll be buying nVidia products next.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 10:19 AM   #18
crashmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V!NCENT

What are you talking about? Did you to download them from the producer instead of the ATI website because of customizations a company can make to the cards? _ESPECIALY_ if you have a laptop.
Yeah - that's the other thing that prompted me to return the shiny new AMD64 laptop back to the store when they first came out.
They got a cute ATI sticker on it but nooo don't ask ATI about drivers.It's only THEIR CHIPSET.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 10:39 AM   #19
Okie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V!NCENT
ATI on Linux sucks. If they don't release full documentation I'll be buying nVidia products next.
My plans are for the next PC i build to be an Intel core 2 duo (dual core = like two CPUs in one), with a new PCI Express nVidia card, AMD has been pushing those AMD-64 CPUs a lot, and i am not ready to switch from 32 bit to 64 bit, i want to see 64 bit software mature more before i go with a 64 bit CPU...
 
Old 06-18-2007, 12:05 PM   #20
angryfirelord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okie
My plans are for the next PC i build to be an Intel core 2 duo (dual core = like two CPUs in one), with a new PCI Express nVidia card, AMD has been pushing those AMD-64 CPUs a lot, and i am not ready to switch from 32 bit to 64 bit, i want to see 64 bit software mature more before i go with a 64 bit CPU...
[off topic]
All 64-bit chips have 32-bit compatibility, so that's not an issue. While the Core 2 is faster than any AMD chip, AMD has really slashed its prices . (for comparison, the Sempron 3400+ S754 cost $99 in July 06, which is what I got. Today, a X2 4600+ costs $99)

[on topic]
I will take the time to write to ATI (or AMD if it goes that way) because while the fglrx driver is better than what it was, it still stinks compared to what nVidia has. Even if you are a diehard nvidia user, you can still explain to ATI why nvidia has the advantage on the Linux platform.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 12:07 PM   #21
V!NCENT
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmeister
Yeah - that's the other thing that prompted me to return the shiny new AMD64 laptop back to the store when they first came out.
They got a cute ATI sticker on it but nooo don't ask ATI about drivers.It's only THEIR CHIPSET.
... and customized by the company that makes the laptop. Because of the customization they offer different drivers on their website. Dell for one does that. Saphire just makes the card the same as the ATI bleuprints they got when licensing it and their cards are therefore compatible with the ATI drivers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Okie
My plans are for the next PC i build to be an Intel core 2 duo (dual core = like two CPUs in one), with a new PCI Express nVidia card, AMD has been pushing those AMD-64 CPUs a lot, and i am not ready to switch from 32 bit to 64 bit, i want to see 64 bit software mature more before i go with a 64 bit CPU...
AMD64 also runs 32bit, and it does that even faster. How else is Windows able to run on it?
EDIT:Intel core 2 duo is also 64bit...

Last edited by V!NCENT; 06-18-2007 at 12:18 PM.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 12:48 PM   #22
crashmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V!NCENT
... and customized by the company that makes the laptop. Because of the customization they offer different drivers on their website. Dell for one does that. Saphire just makes the card the same as the ATI bleuprints they got when licensing it and their cards are therefore compatible with the ATI drivers.
Those guys at Nvidia must be smart as hell then.

But thats not the point - if you put your name on the box you better support it.
I never saw 'ATI (not supported by them though)' on a laptop.
That 'customizes it' line from ATI is just a bunch of bull.

What can you customize about a graphics chipset that it requires another driver??
Are you expecting me to believe me those laptop manufacturers are basically capable of building their own chipsets and/or writing their own drivers?
It's just a way to blame someone else if things go wrong - basically tells me the company is not a 100% behind their product.

Thinking about that - it's a shame I don't live in the US.Might have a moneymaker on my hands there.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 12:51 PM   #23
JohnE1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dotancohen
The issue at stake is not who's card is better. The issue at stake is whether major hardware manufacturers will support Linux, or not, and how.
Major hardware manufacturer's already ARE supporting Linux and AMD, most notably, Sun Microsystems.

Sun's x86's servers are outstanding, as one would expect with Sun's experience in the UNIX marketplace. They make some of their competition's products look like toys in comparison (strictly my opinion, of course)... but for those only used to servers made for the Windows world, well... you'll just have to work with a Sun server to really appreciate how well engineered and designed they are.

FYI, the serial management (console and network) code used by Sun is embedded Linux.

My $.02 worth.

JohnE1
 
Old 06-18-2007, 01:07 PM   #24
Okie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by V!NCENT
EDIT:Intel core 2 duo is also 64bit...
i did not know that, i though the Intel Core2 Duo was just a 32 bit CPU with two cores (about the same as having two CPUs)

thanks for the info, my bad...
 
Old 06-18-2007, 01:09 PM   #25
ErrorBound
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okie
My plans are for the next PC i build to be an Intel core 2 duo (dual core = like two CPUs in one), with a new PCI Express nVidia card, AMD has been pushing those AMD-64 CPUs a lot, and i am not ready to switch from 32 bit to 64 bit, i want to see 64 bit software mature more before i go with a 64 bit CPU...
Core 2 duos are 64-bit just like AMD. They will both run 32-bit stuff as well though.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 01:11 PM   #26
wavesound
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Wink

Quote:
Originally Posted by V!NCENT
What frustration? I never had a single problem with ATI on Windows.


What are you talking about? Did you to download them from the producer instead of the ATI website because of customizations a company can make to the cards? _ESPECIALY_ if you have a laptop.


Service packs change Windows drasticaly. No wonder it broke the driver. Happens to a _lot_ of drivers and software as well.


ATI on Linux sucks. If they don't release full documentation I'll be buying nVidia products next.
The change over, I seem to recall was from win98 SE to Win 2000.
I never got my dvd/ATI card (was quite new at the time) to work on 2000.
I bought Nvidia then and do so now.

As I had to deal with ATI I found them and the website unhelpfull.

Unless ATI really come out with a show stopper card for Linux I can't see many people changing to ATI.
Nvidia just works on Linux.

Cheers
Bob
 
Old 06-18-2007, 01:19 PM   #27
Okie
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well anyhow, i have made up my mind to buy Intel based hardware in the future, i have liked AMD, just that i have always had problems with ATI graphics, and now that AMD & ATI merged i fear AMD will optimize their CPUs & etc... to work better with ATI graphics putting nVidia at a disadvantage and don't want be caught in the crossfire with a system that works @ sub par levels, sure Intel is more expensive but i rather pay a few bucks more for hardware that works optimally with nVidia...
 
Old 06-18-2007, 05:22 PM   #28
lambchops468
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmeister
For all I care AMD can take their ATI division and let it rot in hell - drivers and all.
They ignored Linux long enough.Even hinting by them that they need to think about `the next step` is BS.
It`s not like there are no other vendors around.

I had nothing but trouble with ATI and wont buy any of their products again.If you need good closed source drivers use Nvidia.If you need good company supported open source drivers use Nvidia or Intel.

Then what....lets say ATI video cards goes out of business...it will be a virtual monopoly in the high-end graphics business. Really, Intel can't make decent graphics cards for its life. They've tried and tried.

I wonder what Nvidia would do if ATI went out of business

that would be hell (some video card selling for $1000??)
 
Old 06-18-2007, 06:26 PM   #29
JohnE1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crashmeister
Yeah - that's the other thing that prompted me to return the shiny new AMD64 laptop back to the store when they first came out.
They got a cute ATI sticker on it but nooo don't ask ATI about drivers.It's only THEIR CHIPSET.
The boxes usually tell you the CPU and chipset. That's fairly standard packaging. You didn't know that ATI made chipsets, or you would have read the box more closely--you just assumed the ATI on the box was for the video card.

Nvidia also makes chipsets, not just video cards.

You're angry at the laptop maker because you didn't research the product BEFORE you purchased it.

Google on 'laptop linux' and you'll find plenty of info on which laptops do and don't support Linux.
 
Old 06-18-2007, 06:41 PM   #30
JohnE1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Okie
well anyhow, i have made up my mind to buy Intel based hardware in the future, i have liked AMD, just that i have always had problems with ATI graphics, and now that AMD & ATI merged i fear AMD will optimize their CPUs & etc... to work better with ATI graphics putting nVidia at a disadvantage and don't want be caught in the crossfire with a system that works @ sub par levels, sure Intel is more expensive but i rather pay a few bucks more for hardware that works optimally with nVidia...
I have wanted to see AMD sell its own motherboards for years and I suspect that's what AMD had in mind when they purchased ATI. They wouldn't have to pay licensing fees to include a graphics chipset on their motherboard, making it possible for them to compete with Intel and make some decent margin.

I'm sure Intel is optimized for PCI Express, so your argument could work just as well for NOT buying an Intel board.

Try to get a Linux driver for an Intel webcam and you'll find that your "safe" investment in Intel wasn't so safe after all, cause Intel no longer supports them and sends you back to the company they contracted with to make those webcams. I bet anyone running an old Intel coprocessor modem is probably in the same boat when it comes to Linux drivers.

Thank goodness the Apple Mac went to using Intel. That will probably give Intel more incentive to support UNIX and its derivatives than ever before, so I see that as a good thing for those of us running Linux.
 
  


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