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Old 08-25-2003, 12:10 AM   #1
jarget
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Registered: Aug 2003
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Angry Man after 3 days of trying Linux I might have to go back to WinXP


Running RedHat 9 that I downloaded from the net. Man it is just so frustrating. i can't move files.(always denied) I can't seem to find any info on how to install things using the terminal. I know DOS(I know Linux is different) a little bit but if someone can just show me the commands and when to type them and what they mean i might get somewhere. I've searched the net and can't find any good explanations. It seems that everything I find only explains as if I know what I'm doing. I've tried install AfterStep(RPM's) and got to the point that I need more files, found some of them but need more that i can't find. Why can't programs to install be in an RPM with everything that is needed. I knew Linux was different from Windows and that it wasn't as user friendly but I thought I would be able to tackle this stuff since I've been computing for the last 7 years. I am so damn frustrated that i'm actually mad. No really.

I wouldn't mind paying for this OS and programs for it. But I'm not going to pay if I can't figure out how to use it efficiently. I know RedHat is only 40 bucks but I'm on a limited income at the moment.

If anybody can please point me in the right direction I'd really appreciate it.
 
Old 08-25-2003, 12:14 AM   #2
2damncommon
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This was posted a short time ago:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...linux+tutorial
 
Old 08-25-2003, 01:57 AM   #3
salparadise
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3 days?

KEEP GOING

it took me three weeks to get linux installed
and 3 hours to wreck it again
i've installed it so many times i'm surprised i havent worn holes in my hard drive

keep going
keep going
keep going

you absolutely will not regret it
 
Old 08-25-2003, 02:53 AM   #4
slakmagik
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Re: Man after 3 days of trying Linux I might have to go back to WinXP

Quote:
Originally posted by jarget
Running RedHat 9 that I downloaded from the net. Man it is just so frustrating. i can't move files.(always denied) I can't seem to find any info on how to install things using the terminal. I know DOS(I know Linux is different) a little bit but if someone can just show me the commands and when to type them and what they mean i might get somewhere. I've searched the net and can't find any good explanations. It seems that everything I find only explains as if I know what I'm doing. I've tried install AfterStep(RPM's) and got to the point that I need more files, found some of them but need more that i can't find. Why can't programs to install be in an RPM with everything that is needed. I knew Linux was different from Windows and that it wasn't as user friendly but I thought I would be able to tackle this stuff since I've been computing for the last 7 years. I am so damn frustrated that i'm actually mad. No really.

I wouldn't mind paying for this OS and programs for it. But I'm not going to pay if I can't figure out how to use it efficiently. I know RedHat is only 40 bucks but I'm on a limited income at the moment.

If anybody can please point me in the right direction I'd really appreciate it.
If you can't move files it's probably because you don't have the right permissions. If you do 'ls -al' in a terminal or xterm, you'll probably see a lot of 'root root' stuff and maybe some 'your-user-name users' stuff. You only have permission to mess with the last of those if you are logged in as user (which you should be). To move files owned by root, do 'su' or 'su -' and type in root's password and then move them - if you really think you need to. This is done for security - as user you're unlikely to damage your system and certain aspects of it are supposed to make it harder for crackers to damage your system, plus it provides privacy of files between multiple users on the same machine. You don't bang your shins on it anywhere near as much but NT has similar issues and even Windows had the rudiments of it.

As far as rpms and the dependency problems you're having, that is different from DOS - but not *all* that different from Windows. DOS apps are almost invariably static. All the code they need is contained within them. Even when it repeats code found in other programs and make the DOS binaries larger than they might be. Windows has 'dynamically linked libraries' - bits of code programs share between themselves... leading to 'dll hell'. Well, 'rpm dependency hell' is basically the same thing. To make executables smaller and lighter and reduce code redundancy, *nix excutables are dynamically linked to libraries. But if you're missing those libraries or have the wrong ones, the program won't run. As far as why they aren't packaged together, well, I'm sure there are good reasons.

It is different and not as user-friendly but you'll get it. I may not have described things accurately - maybe a guru can watch my back or expand on it but I thought some direct background might be helpful. Though it may not be these issues - you could be using the wrong commands or something else could be at issue. But those are the principles most likely to be behind your troubles.

But beyond that little bit of background, those links you've already been pointed to are good. I saw in the 'beginners' section a link to LinuxCommand.org. It's not the best site in a lot of ways but, in a few aspects, it actually is. And the Rute guide is written from someone who, in the preface, notes exactly what you're talking about - he came from a DOS world and all the docs he encountered were written assuming you already knew Unix. So that might be good for you.

http://linuxcommand.org/
http://www.icon.co.za/~psheer/book/rute.html.gz
This might be helpful, but most all of it is just as easily gotten from the man pages:
http://www.onlamp.com/linux/cmd/
This is a must:
http://www.tldp.org/
Lost in the filesystem? This is great: http://www.pathname.com/fhs/2.2/index.html#TOC

And something I find helpful is to get the Big Picture.
http://www.robotwisdom.com/linux/timeline.html
http://linux.oreillynet.com/pub/a/li...vingLinux.html
http://www.rap.ucar.edu/staff/tres/elements.html
http://cbbrowne.com/info/unix.html

And especially
http://catb.org/~esr/writings/cathed...hedral-bazaar/
http://artlung.com/smorgasborg/C_R_Y..._I_C_O_N.shtml

And now I have a new project - my links are a disastrous mess. This took forever. You better use them.
 
Old 08-25-2003, 04:07 AM   #5
bigjohn
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Tell you what jarget,

When anyone asks me, I always recommend that they try a "genuine boxed set" first.

Not tried redhat, but found out by accident that genuine mandrake discs often have a few things that aren't in the download version. I presume that this is connected with copyright and licencing.

E.G. I downloaded mandrake 9.0 and installed it. I enjoyed using it, good desktop, easy to config. So, I looked at their site and checked out their prices. After the exchange, it cost me 25 (about $40).

When it arrived, I put the disc in and did the install thing (not upgrade) and as I followed it through, realised that it was doing things slightly differently. It didn't bother asking most of the monitor/display questions and just wanted the basic ISP info, and promptly told me to remove media and rebooted.

I realised that the two obvious differences where that it had installed the nvidia drivers and the microcode for my adsl modem (both of which i had had to do manually with the download). It made it so easy, I reckoned that that had been worth the 25 for the stress free experience alone.

I don't know if it would be the same for redhat.

regards

John
 
Old 08-25-2003, 04:22 AM   #6
Trinity22
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3 days? haha, keep going. i've been running linux for about a month now and am finally entering an area where I'm half-sure of what I'm doing. if you don't like the distro you are on, try another, there are dozens of good distros, but you have to find one that suits you.

my tip would be to have patience and don't expect to have 100% of the productivity that you might have had in windows. sometimes finding subs for win programs is a teeth-gnashing experience (spoken from my own experience) but like i said before, its a matter of patience and strength of will. if you are in it for the long run, keep at it with linux, but if not maybe windows is right for you.

trinity
 
Old 08-25-2003, 05:47 AM   #7
jarget
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Registered: Aug 2003
Posts: 24

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I've calmed down now.

Thanks for the words of encouragement guys. I'll keep truckin' and will try to use patience.

What's that cliche"? Patience Is Virtue

And Big Thanks for the tips.

Glad I found this message board, lots of nice peeps here.
 
Old 08-25-2003, 09:48 AM   #8
nander
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Registered: Aug 2003
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Although everyone has their own pet distro, having tried RedHat, Suse and Mandrake, I would strongly suggest you scrapped RedHat, and installed Mandrake. Suse is good as well, but if you, (like me) will have to reinstall it a couple of times, then having downloaded the ISO's from Mandrake will be a godsend, as opposed to having to do a FTP installation each time for Suse!

Mandrake has benefits like an installation utility which makes sure all your programfiles have the right dependencies installed, and avoids conflicts. Further, Mandrake has a huge deposit of RPMS made for Mandrake!

As for moving files around, is it really such a bad thing that a user, without root permissions are refused to shift files around, outside their own home folder?

If you are also getting annoyed (as I have in the past) by not being allowed to run certain programs or devices (such as an ISDN card ) as a user, try looking at the SUDO command, it can be really useful!

good luck!
 
Old 08-25-2003, 10:04 AM   #9
dmx9595
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jarget

keep going you'll eventually get to a point where your content
read man pages/books, search google, talk on irc linux chans, post on forums, the more you put into it the faster and more you will get out of it
 
Old 08-25-2003, 10:20 AM   #10
Skyline
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Hi Jarget

Unix is a solid multiuser OS and as such needed the idea of file permissions and such - with the uptake of Linux this legacy has now moved into the area of a single user on a single computer - it is frustrating at times but you do get used to it after a while, it actually becomes interesting and rewarding - a good link for the basics of System Admin etc is the Linux Newbie Aministrator Guide - just pick out bits as you go along

http://linux-newbie.sunsite.dk/index.html

It does get easier and you might find it quite rewarding after a while.
 
Old 08-25-2003, 10:22 AM   #11
Stevetgn
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I have to agree with some of the others. Try Mandrake 9.1 or suse. Much more user friendly. Mandrake 9.2 beta is also available for download now. I'm running it with no probs. Except I've no sound at the moment, but that my problem not yours,lol! Enjoy!
 
Old 08-25-2003, 10:59 AM   #12
ksnash
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Location: Pensacola,Florida
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Mandrake sound(to steven)

try reloading alsa system to get sound going. You also need the correct entries in modules.conf .
 
Old 08-25-2003, 03:04 PM   #13
bosewicht
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i loaded mandrake 9.0 on friday (9.1 can't find my cd drive to install) which makes me a def newbie. I've had initial install probs, my scroll (scroll button on the mouse) doesn't work, and it can't find an associated prog for avi, mpeg, bmp, etc, but i will stick it out and figure something out. I took the plunge and got rid of windows all together on my pc....got tired of lock ups, crashes, and microsoft in general....so i feel you about learning to walk agin...but i think it'll pay off...if not, i saved my windows install disc!!! lol
 
Old 08-25-2003, 03:13 PM   #14
idicula
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Registered: Aug 2003
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what i don't understand what to do is how u install programs
i got red hat 9 and the mp3 player is crap
also i wanted to try out karamba (i think its called)

i'm also having problems connecting to the internet using dial-up
is there a seperate program that i could use
 
Old 08-25-2003, 03:18 PM   #15
bosewicht
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i have been having problems with installs too, but i did find that rpm -ivvh filename installs, but don't go and do that right away check out http://easylinuxguide.com/ there is a lot of stuff out there i'm going to try some more stuff tonight but real player makes a linux version with instuctions on how to load it do a google search for real player linux good luck
 
  


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