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Old 05-05-2010, 08:15 PM   #91
pixellany
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Just having XFCE on the disk will not cause any slowdown. The main thing is to know what processes are getting started. As long as you boot directly into LXDE, the presence of any other DE or WM should not matter.

How do you boot into LXDE? eg do you select it in the login manager? If so, which login manager are you using.

If in doubt, post the output of "cat /etc/inittab"
 
Old 05-05-2010, 08:17 PM   #92
MTK358
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pixellany View Post
Arch IS simple....
http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beginners'_Guide

If you can handle that, then great.
 
Old 05-05-2010, 08:19 PM   #93
mark_alfred
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Okay, I looked it up, and "%id" means percent idle. So, from mine, I have the following numbers:
6.3%us, 2.0%sy, 0.0%ni, 0.0%wa, 0.3%hi, 0.0%si, 0.0%st which in total equals 8.6. One hundred minus 8.6 equals 91.4, which is my percent idle reading.

By contrast, Parallaxis has 34.8%us, 6.8%sy, 0.0%ni, 0.8%wa, 0.4%hi, 0.2%si, 0.0%st, which, when added, equals 43. This subtracted from 100 gives 57, which is Parallaxis' idle percentage. So, the one out of whack is the 34.8%us figure.

"man top" gives the following explanation of the %us figure:
Code:
us  --	User CPU time
	  The  time  the  CPU  has spent running users processes that are not
	  niced.
I'm not sure what this means, exactly. "niced"? ... hmm, time for another internet search.

Okay, from a search, I got the following:
Quote:
A process "niceness" is an internal numeric value that essentially defines how nice a process is being to the CPU. A low priority process, that sleeps and takes very few processing power (cycles) when active is a "nice" process.
I'm not sure exactly what this means. I also found an incomprehensible description at wikipedia, and a surreal description on the linuxquestions.org wiki from someone who obviously watches too much science fiction. But I digress.

I'm guessing there's just too many processes going on in your machine, for reasons that I still can't figure out. I think these processes are within your Xubuntu system, though, and not the MBA or whatever that you earlier referred to.
 
Old 05-05-2010, 08:30 PM   #94
Parallaxis
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Go Mark Go!

pixellany, I've been login in through the Xubuntu menu that comes up with the computer boots up. I mean I guess it's the Xubuntu menu. It has the Xubuntu wallpaper behind it.

The options from there are.... well I can't remember....

Xubuntu Session
Openbox
Something about Gnome
LXDE

and one more I can't remember.
 
Old 05-05-2010, 08:43 PM   #95
craigevil
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Debian sid in LXDE using gdm, and with iceweasel, parcelite, lxterminal, pcmanfn and okular running, 30 second boot time and most apps start instantly including iceweasel/firefox, gimp, openoffice

top
Code:
top - 20:31:00 up 13:16,  2 users,  load average: 0.19, 0.13, 0.09
Tasks:  91 total,   1 running,  90 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
Cpu(s):  2.9%us,  0.2%sy,  0.0%ni, 96.9%id,  0.0%wa,  0.0%hi,  0.0%si,  0.0%st
Mem:   2064804k total,  1334748k used,   730056k free,   185688k buffers
Swap:  5124724k total,        0k used,  5124724k free,   906784k cached
free
Code:
free
             total       used       free     shared    buffers     cached
Mem:       2064804    1346048     718756          0     185928     906828
-/+ buffers/cache:     253292    1811512
Swap:      5124724          0    5124724
inxi
Code:
System:    Host craigevil Kernel 2.6.33-3.dmz.2-liquorix-686 i686 (32 bit) Distro Debian GNU/Linux squeeze/sid
CPU:       Single core Intel Pentium 4 (UP) cache 1024 KB flags (lm nx sse sse2 sse3) bmips 5586.49 
           Clock Speeds: (1) 2793.245 MHz (2) 2793.245 MHz
Graphics:  Card nVidia G96 [GeForce 9400 GT] X.Org 1.7.7 Res: 1280x1024@50.0hz 
           GLX Renderer GeForce 9400 GT/PCI/SSE2 GLX Version 3.2.0 NVIDIA 195.36.24 Direct Rendering Yes
Audio:     Card Intel 82801FB/FBM/FR/FW/FRW (ICH6 Family) High Definition Audio Controller driver HDA Intel BusID: 00:1b.0
           Sound: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture Version 1.0.21
Network:   Card Intel 82562ET/EZ/GT/GZ - PRO/100 VE (LOM) Ethernet Controller driver e100 v: 3.5.24-k2-NAPI at port dcc0 BusID: 03:08.0
Disks:     HDD Total Size: 160.0GB (16.6% used) 1: /dev/sda WDC_WD1600JS 160.0GB 
Partition: ID:/ size: 103G used: 25G (26%) fs: ext3 ID:swap-1 size: 5.25GB used: 0.00GB (0%) fs: swap 
Info:      Processes 94 Uptime 13:25 Memory 237.8/2016.4MB Runlevel 5 Client Shell inxi 1.4.9
The biggest thing I have seen with the various *buntus is all the processes that start at boot. Turn off any that you do not actually need.
 
Old 05-05-2010, 08:45 PM   #96
mark_alfred
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Try rebooting back into lxde, and see if that makes any difference. Once you've done that, run top again and see. I suggest rebooting because sometimes processes continue to run if you merely change your desktop environment via gui commands within your current desktop.
 
Old 05-05-2010, 09:07 PM   #97
Parallaxis
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Well I just want to make sure we're on the same page....

I'm not sure I'm 'rebooting into Lxde', I'm logging into lxde via the Xubuntu interface thingy. The Xubuntu splash screen comes up then I'm presented with various log in options including lxde. Is that what we're talking about?

Quote:
The biggest thing I have seen with the various *buntus is all the processes that start at boot. Turn off any that you do not actually need.
Great! Uh.. which process would those be exactly?
 
Old 05-05-2010, 09:26 PM   #98
Parallaxis
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Top via reboot and Lxde
Code:
top - 21:24:06 up 3 min,  2 users,  load average: 0.43, 0.57, 0.25
Tasks: 109 total,   1 running, 108 sleeping,   0 stopped,   0 zombie
Cpu(s): 23.8%us, 15.6%sy,  0.0%ni, 53.8%id,  6.0%wa,  0.4%hi,  0.4%si,  0.0%st
Mem:    250728k total,   186544k used,    64184k free,    25252k buffers
Swap:   731128k total,        0k used,   731128k free,    97560k cached

  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND            
 1088 wayne     20   0  2556 1052  792 R  3.6  0.4   0:00.09 top                
 1064 wayne     20   0 64320 9884 7664 S  1.8  3.9   0:01.18 lxterminal         
    1 root      20   0  2792 1604 1160 S  0.0  0.6   0:01.55 init               
    2 root      20   0     0    0    0 S  0.0  0.0   0:00.01 kthreadd           
    3 root      RT   0     0    0    0 S  0.0  0.0   0:00.00 migration/0        
    4 root      20   0     0    0    0 S  0.0  0.0   0:00.00 ksoftirqd/0        
    5 root      RT   0     0    0    0 S  0.0  0.0   0:00.00 watchdog/0         
    6 root      20   0     0    0    0 S  0.0  0.0   0:00.02 events/0
 
Old 05-05-2010, 09:41 PM   #99
mark_alfred
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Do you find lxde to be any faster?
 
Old 05-05-2010, 09:52 PM   #100
Parallaxis
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no, It's not really the OS that has the slow down, it's the applications.
Midori seemed about the same in Lxde and Xfce.
In fact, I want to say that Xfce Midori might have been a tad bit less laggy. But that could be my imagination.

HOWEVER, we HAVE made progress. It is faster than when I started this thread.

If we could just make a tad bit more.
 
Old 05-05-2010, 10:24 PM   #101
craigevil
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You might take look at:
sidux.com :: debian based live cd development - http://www.sidux.com/index.php?modul...ag=SiduxTweaks
LinuxSpeedup - Debian Wiki - http://wiki.debian.org/LinuxSpeedup?...ht=%28tweak%29
Improve performance in Ubuntu - Ubuntu Forums - http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=189192
 
Old 05-05-2010, 11:03 PM   #102
mark_alfred
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Here's a site about how to show all running processes. It's kind of interesting. For my system, I ran the pstree command:
Code:
mark@debian:~$ pstree
init─┬─apmd
     ├─atd
     ├─atop
     ├─avahi-daemon───avahi-daemon
     ├─blinkd───3*[{blinkd}]
     ├─chipcardd4───chipcardd4
     ├─cron
     ├─cupsd
     ├─2*[dbus-daemon]
     ├─dbus-launch
     ├─dcopserver
     ├─dictd
     ├─exim4
     ├─gam_server
     ├─gconfd-2
     ├─5*[getty]
     ├─gpm
     ├─hald───hald-runner─┬─hald-addon-inpu
     │                    └─2*[hald-addon-stor]
     ├─inetd
     ├─kded
     ├─kdeinit───klauncher
     ├─klogd
     ├─kmix
     ├─login───bash───startx───xinit─┬─Xorg
     │                               └─fluxbox─┬─wmdate
     │                                         └─wmdrawer─┬─firefox-bin───6*[{firefox-bin}]
     │                                                    ├─kppp───kppp───pppd
     │                                                    ├─xterm───bash───su───bash
     │                                                    └─xterm───bash───pstree
     ├─sshd
     ├─syslogd
     ├─system-tools-ba
     └─xfs
mark@debian:~$
So, of all the processes running on my system, it's really only those stemming from the "login" that I've now been actively using. For instance, I'm running fluxbox, and have used wmdrawer to open firefox, kppp, and two xterms. It would be interesting to see what processes are running on your system.
 
Old 05-06-2010, 08:26 AM   #103
craigevil
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pstree on Debian sid lxde
Code:
 pstree
init─┬─atd
     ├─console-kit-dae───63*[{console-kit-da}]
     ├─cron
     ├─cupsd
     ├─2*[dbus-daemon]
     ├─dbus-launch
     ├─dhclient3
     ├─dirmngr
     ├─firefox───run-mozilla.sh───firefox-bin───13*[{firefox-bin}]
     ├─gam_server
     ├─gconfd-2
     ├─gdm───gdm─┬─Xorg
     │           └─lxsession─┬─lxpanel
     │                       ├─openbox
     │                       └─pcmanfm
     ├─6*[getty]
     ├─hald─┬─hald-runner─┬─hald-addon-acpi
     │      │             ├─hald-addon-inpu
     │      │             └─2*[hald-addon-stor]
     │      └─{hald}
     ├─klogd
     ├─lxterminal─┬─bash───pstree
     │            ├─gnome-pty-helpe
     │            └─{lxterminal}
     ├─menu-cached
     ├─parcellite
     ├─preload
     ├─syslogd
     └─udevd───2*[udevd]
Here is a list of services and what they do. Should give you a good idea about what you can disable.
http://www.domain-logic.com/linux_services.php
 
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Old 05-06-2010, 09:01 AM   #104
MrCode
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark_alfred
<info about nice>

I'm not sure exactly what this means. I also found an incomprehensible description at wikipedia, and a surreal description on the linuxquestions.org wiki from someone who obviously watches too much science fiction.
Any modern multitasking OS kernel (Unix-like ones especially) uses what's called "pre-emptive multitasking", which essentially means that it gives each "task" (process) a certain amount of CPU time to execute before moving on to the next process. The amount of CPU time a process has to execute is typically determined by the process priority, or "importance". The higher the priority, the more CPU time the process gets. A "nice" process is simply a process running at a lower priority and therefore has less CPU time, thus being "nice" to other, possibly more important processes.

SMP convolutes this greatly, as you can literally have more than one process using the same CPU cycles (as you have more than one processing core), but I won't go into details there, mostly because I don't know much about SMP multitasking to begin with.

In other words, one can have tons of processes running, but they're being given very little CPU time (or virtually none at all, as in "sleeping" processes), and so they wouldn't interfere too much with other running processes. It's the active processes that are important. Something's running on the OP's machine that's taking a lot of CPU time, and it's not being "nice" to other processes.

Last edited by MrCode; 05-06-2010 at 09:06 AM.
 
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Old 05-06-2010, 09:12 AM   #105
pixellany
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parallaxis View Post
HOWEVER, we HAVE made progress. It is faster than when I started this thread.

If we could just make a tad bit more.
We can---install something like Arch (or any of various other "lean and mean" distros) with a window manager and not a DE.

You mentioned setting up as a "guest machine". that implies that it would only run a few applications. These could be auto-started, so that the user might not need **any** of the convenience features and graphical gimmicks that come the the various DEs.

PS: As someone already observed, Ubuntu is Ubuntu, even if it has an X in front. Ubuntu is designed to be user-coddling, not hardware-friendly

Last edited by pixellany; 05-06-2010 at 09:13 AM.
 
  


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