Ideas For a Disto
 

Hello all.

I would like some advice from folks who are experienced with linux to give point out a good distro for me to start off with. Aftewr trying out Knoppix on live CD for a while now, I would like to move on to something bigger.
I would like a good, stable OS with a good selestion of software available for download, and/or included in the distro. I would prefer having the KDE be the default environment.

A summary of the system I will be installing it on is as follows:

GeForce FX 5200 Video card
Generic internal PCI modem (I have an external one I can use if internal modems are not supported)
Onboard LAN card, sound(with SPDIF), USB
AMD Athlon XP 2500
256 MB RAM
40GB IDE hard dsik. (would be cool if I could boot side-by-side with Win2k on the same disk)

I know that this is alot to ask for, and am not expecting many replies, but if anyone has ideas, I would love to hear them.

~Later

Define "good selection of software".

As for the dual-boot with win2k - you can use knoppix to re-size
windwoes and make space for linux, so that's no problem, whatever
you choose. If you want to learn fast and like to understand what's
going on in your box, if you prefer stable and swift over whizbang
and cutting-edge:

Slackware.

Has KDE as ONE of the desktops on 2 disks.


Cheers,
Tink

Like that that was included on Knoppix 5.1.1

Go with Debian, it has the most packages available to it.

Best solution always with distros is to try out some yourself and stick which ever feels the best.

Before resizing windows make sure you de-fragment it. Yes I would also agree with Zmyrgel, Debian has a very large selection of programs.

You have only 256 MB of RAM. You will want to be careful about using GNOME or KDE, as some distributions will be very slow with that amount of RAM.

If you want something for beginners you should look into Mepis, Ubuntu, Mandriva, PCLinuxOS. You might want to try the GNOME version of PCLinuxOS as that is lighter, or Xubuntu. I don't think you should need anything less than Xubuntu, but if you want something that is easy to use, has a lot of packages, and is very fast, you could consider AntiX.

I haven't used Knoppix in a while, and have no idea what
5.1 comes with, and even less which of the stuff you NEED
or will want to use.


And while it's true that debian (or gentoo, for that matter)
have large repos ... what do you need or want?


Cheers,
Tink

I think the Mepis User Guide.pdf is a worthwhile read for any newbie about to install any distribution using KDE. It's a bit dated and some details won't match (even if you install Mepis) but lots of concepts and names are introduced clearly that I (at least) found hard to dig up with Knoppix and other distributions.
http://www.mepis.org/node/6679

I found the rest of the Mepis documentation similarly better than that of other distributions. So I chose and recommend Mepis for your distribution. (Mepis uses Debian repositories for anything not available directly from Mepis).

I usually recommend trying a lot first by liveCD, but 256Mb!?

The Mepis liveCD is really lame if you don't select the aufs option at boot time. The boot prompt suggests selecting that only with 1Gb or more of ram. I selected it on a computer with 512Mb of ram (and no Linux swap partition) and had no problems, so I think the 1Gb suggestion is too conservative. But there is some underlying truth there. LiveCD with aufs is much more demanding of ram than normal install would be. I don't think 256Mb is enough for Mepis liveCD with aufs (though Knoppix manages to fit) and I don't think liveCD without aufs is worth using.

Well it surely doesn't harm, but on the other hand, it's not vital always. Or at least I have done some disk resizing operations, forgetting to de-fragment the Windows partitions, and haven't lost anything (good luck then, maybe?)

It's up to you which one you choose, but the reposity sizes don't really matter that much. Most of the time you don't install everything from there, the apps you use generally do exist in all "major" distributions' reposities, and from time to time you run into a situation where you would want to install a newer version of some app that is available in the reposities, and still have to compile it from source because no distribution maintainer has had the time to do it for you.

Slackware isn't a bad option. But if you're a fan of Windows and it's way of hiding stuff from you in order to make it look user-friendly, you might find something like Ubuntu (with KDE => Kubuntu) or Mepis better; they're Debian derivatives, but if you happen to have hardware that needs proprietary drivers or something like that, Debian might not make it as easy for you as the others. Manually it's always easy, of course (;)), but it's up to you to make the selection between knowledge & accuracy and easiness & care-no-more.

I tested the preformance of KDE on my system by installingg Knoppix to disk, and it was not sluggish at all. (a 1GB swap partition was in use along with the RAM.) Then I tried the Fedora 8 live cd (with GNOME) and it ran agonizingly slow. Does this mean GNOME will run slow on my HD? I am comfortable with KDE, so having GNOME unavailable will not be a major inconvenience.

Try the Fedora KDE live cD to compare.

Fedora does tend to load a lot of services by default that you can turn off, so perhaps try that as well

What an incredibly negative spin to put on the actual user friendliness of Mepis.

Windows really does hide things, and sometimes to make it look user-friendly, but more often to magnify the FUD keeping customers under control.

How does Mepis "hide" stuff? So far as I can see, it just gives you an easier way to do some things. It doesn't take away the other way nor make it any harder to find.

I don't get why so many people have a negative reaction to things that fit a "training wheels" analogy. Training wheels are good. Otherwise you can't learn to peddle and steer because you fall off too often because you haven't learned to balance, but you can't learn to balance because you don't yet know how to peddle and steer. Lots of Linux is like that for a newbie. So some of Mepis is sort of like training wheels that let you learn to peddle and steer before you learn to balance, then learn to balance easily because you already know how to peddle and steer. But the Mepis features are even better than training wheels because they don't ever get in the way. You can do a little balancing any time you want without removing the training wheels; Just don't use them that time.


The most common example of proprietary drivers as I understand them is the nvidia drivers so many people need to get decent behavior from their nvidia card. I installed that in Debian as an extremely lost newbie before I knew Mepis existed. It wasn't trivial, but it also wouldn't make the list of the 100 hardest things I figured out in Debian. Mepis is a Debian derivative and the method I used in Debian also works in Mepis. But Mepis includes (inside the "MEPIS X-Windows Assistant" program) a totally easy way to do the same thing. I'm sure you mean some less common kind of proprietary driver. But even there, I doubt you're correct about it being harder in Debian or Mepis.

Maybe you are somewhat correct about an element of accuracy vs. easiness. But on knowledge vs. care-no-more, I think it would be more accurately described as overwhelmed vs. focussed (learn this aspect now, care about that aspect later).

But again, unlike the training wheels, I don't see how any of those user friendly features would get in your way even when you decide to take better control of some detail for some occasion. That's the real contrast vs. Microsoft (or Apple). When you select the detail you want to dig into and take medium or complete or any level of control over, Linux (including Mepis) doesn't throw up any roadblocks.

I'm a software engineer and I think I'm super smart . But I don't see why I shouldn't choose and keep the easiest Linux distribution I can find. I would have picked an even easier one than Mepis if I had found one. I wish Mepis included several other types of training wheels. The downside really isn't there.

There is a difference between self-proclaimed smart and socially accepted smart :rolleyes:


Period....:study:

Ideas For a DistoIt should be called Distro! :P

I started using Linux a few weeks ago so I'm not too experienced but not too noobish. I found Linux Mint to be a very easy distro to start off with. You can get the KDE version of LinuxMint as well. But I must say that any distro based on Debian or Ubuntu (yes I know Ubuntu is based on Debian) then you'll be fine with regards to the repos. LinuxMint is based on Ubuntu and uses the GNOME interface. I'm personally going to change to Kubuntu (KDE version of Ubuntu) once my ISO finishes downloading.

Why expend mental energy pointing out silly typos? :tisk:

The desktop environment has something to do with it, but by far the biggest factor is the choice of distribution.

If you like KDE then stick with it. Nearly all of the big distros offer you the choice of KDE.

I always recommend to new users that they get something that works first, then start modifying to meet your preferences after a month or two.

It was a joke.

Uh, the seriousness...

try kUbuntu. Runs KDE, and Ubuntu is a very good distro. Easy as well.

After you bothered to read that far down in my post, it's strange that you decided to quote out of context.

In context, my point was about the relationship between (self-perceived) smart and choice of an easy distribution. Specifically that there is no contradiction between them, no reason that you should choose a harder distribution just because you want to think you're smarter or more computer literate.

Out of context, my statement appears to have a totally different meaning: "listen to my opinion because I'm smart". If I cared to convince you I'm smart, I wouldn't be stupid enough to try to do so by a simple unsupported claim.

There are lots of distros out there, many with good software repositories. Unlike many people above, I won't recommend my distro, Gentoo. It is probably among the faster ones, but require you to have some experience with installing and solving problems on a Linux installation first.

Most, if not all, can co-exist with windows by using a dual boot installation. Choose a distro first and then search for how to install it in a dual boot fashion. You'll need a separate partition on your hard drive for Linux.

As a newbie I think you should start one of the big distros:
-Kubuntu is the KDE version of Ubuntu, they also happen to have some good forums to help new people with problems.
-Fedora too is good, it defaults to Gnome, but it has KDE too as an install option. I saw somewhere they might change to KDE by default in the next release.
-OpenSuse. Similar to Fedora, think they already default to KDE. The Novell sponsored one.
Also worth checking is Mandriva, PCLinuxOS (have a good multimedia installation, which might save you time in looking for audio and video codecs', some distros are more nervous about being sued and don't include a lot of codecs support by default) and of course you have already tried Knoppix.

There are also a number of geographically based favourites you might want to look into. E.g. ALT Linux if you are Russian, SkoleLinux (Norwegian), Mandriva is based in France, openSuse, orignally from German Suse that was bought by Novell some years ago now. Depending on where you are, some distros might be more popular then others, which might be good for support.

There are other criteria too. Slackware is the oldest still existing distro, lots of experience and very stable, similarly Debian. In my view they can be a bit slow in getting new software into their repositories, but then again that will benefit stability if that's important for you (not that others are that unstable).

Anyway, just pick one. After a while you learn how to set it up and tweek the options to how you want them anyway. If a particular software package isn't in your chosen distros repository, its not usually that complicated to download and install it yourself.

Good luck.

If you disable the page file in Windows, then reboot, then defragment, before resizing, then you are more likely to resize it to the size you want, and less likely to screw it up.
You can learn the same amount about GNU/Linux from using any distro. Choice of distro is all about personal taste and needs.

Ay, yes, the seriousness (?)
Oh man.

It's all good.

I am pleased to announce that with my meager 256MBs of ram, I have succeeded in running the Mepis 7.0 live cd using the default settings. (the first entry in the GRUB boot screen). Also, the dual boot setup with Win2K works flawlessly. (When you remember to install GRUB in the MBR! DUH!).

Furthermore, to prevent the possibility that I would have to go through the painful process of re-imaging 65GBs of a WinXP installation on a 300GB HDD (using 15 DVDs), the entire Win2K/Mepis setup is contained on a separate 40GB HDD. To change between WinXP and Win2K/Mepis, I simply change the HDD boot order in my system BIOS.

Mind you, I am still looking for other distros.
PCLinuxOS 2007 is on deck. :D

P.S. I must admit that the Mepis live CD did run somewhat sluggish once firefox was running. It was not too bad, just a noticable decrease in preformance. (no swap space was being used)

Firefox is the monster of all monsters when it comes to eating up RAM. You might consider checking out Konqueror or Opera.

Anyway, congratulations on getting Linux working. I've been using Linux for years and just recently made another switch. Unlike the Windows world, things change pretty quickly with Linux, and with each new release there is a chance that a different distro will better fit your preferences.

I never doubted that default setting would work. And that default setting is fine for using the liveCD to install or repair Linux on a hard drive. And it is fine for running firefox.
But if you want to explore Linux features on a liveCD (to see if you like Mepis and/or to learn Linux), that default setting is not OK. A large variety of features are present that simply fail to work because of that default setting. They don't give any warning message that they won't work nor error message that they didn't. So a beginner would assume he did the wrong thing and/or Linux doesn't have a sensible feature there.
With the aufs boot option (included in the second choice on that menu) all those things work. The results are all thrown away when you reboot. But while Mepis is up it behaves like an installed Linux.
But I think aufs with no swap space and 256Mb of ram is unsound.

liveCD's tend to have strange stalls at points where an installed Linux would have instant response. I'm glad none of that really bothered you.

Mepis or PCLOS
 

I'd say Mepis and PCLinuxOS are two of the best choices for newbies with KDE desktop.
They should (just) run on 256MB, but you'd notice a real improvement with 384MB or 516MB. I'd also recommend at least 1GB for swap partition.

Yes, I gave it a little over one gig on the swap partition, and it only showed about 2MB used in swap. Interesting. Does the system go to the swap partition once the RAM starts to get full? I'm not going to change the size of the swap partition, because the more the merrier, especially in my case.
Also, the PCLinuxOS download site appears to be down. Does anyone know of some other reliable mirrors?

I get good speed when downloading it here (just tested it):
http://www.pclinuxos.com/index.php?o...load&Itemid=51