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Old 05-12-2011, 08:25 PM   #1
smturner1
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How do I load Ubuntu on a machine w/o OS


I have a HP tx 1000 that a friend of mine gave me. The only problem is that he formatted the HD without a back up or recovery CD.

The machine is a HP tx 1000. On start up it asks for the Windows installation disk.....blah, blah, blah. When I try to load the Live Disk it gives me an error about recently added software.

The problem is that I cannot boot to the disk because the Windows firmware is in the way. Is there a way to get around the Gatesware via a directory or am I screwed?
 
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Old 05-12-2011, 09:10 PM   #2
paulsm4
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AFAIK, there's no such thing as "Windows firmware".

It sounds like you have a working CD or DVD. Good.

You SHOULD be able to boot from it.

A DVD player will let you boot a CD or a DVD. A CD player will only let you boot from a CD.

It sounds like the BIOS is trying to boot from the hard drive first, instead of the CD. This could be the entire problem.

SUGGESTION:
1. Start your PC.
2. Go into the BIOS and make sure you CD/DVD is the *FIRST* boot device.
3. Try to determine if your player is a CD or a DVD.
4. If you're not sure, then try to make sure your "Live CD" is actually a CD (and not a DVD)
5. Let us know what happens!

PS:
I believe the BIOS setup key for your HP is "F10".

PPS:
If you're still having problems, be sure to post back the EXACT error message.

Last edited by paulsm4; 05-12-2011 at 09:12 PM.
 
Old 05-12-2011, 09:21 PM   #3
PhoenixAndThor
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Ah, sounds to me like the computer is trying to boot into a damaged M$ Windows install. Are you trying to install a GNU/Linux distribution on the computer? If not, then you are in the wrong place. To get the machine to actually boot from something other than the internal hard drive, you have to first get to the BIOS setup screen.

When you first hit the power button, it should flash a screen telling you what keys to press to get to the setup screen (look towards the bottom of the screen). It may take a few tries to get it (it usually goes by pretty quick). Once you make it to the setup screen, look for something called "Boot Device Order", or something similar. Set the CD drive as the first boot device, then exit the setup screen saving the changes.

After that, the machine should try to boot from the CD drive first, so all you have to do is put the CD in the drive and restart the machine. In case you are trying to boot from a USB flash drive, there should also be one or more keys to make it pull up a menu asking which device to boot from.

Post again if you need more help. Good luck!
 
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Old 05-12-2011, 09:23 PM   #4
smturner1
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Not that obvious

My boot record has been edited so that the cd/dvd is first. It is a DVD, the drive is both a dvd/cd reader.

There is such a thing as firmware on an HP product. The reason I know that is because the HD has been completely formatted (all sd's). So, the only place for the window that points me to the MS installation disk would have to be in the BIOS, making it firmware.
 
Old 05-12-2011, 10:10 PM   #5
jefro
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Doesn't HP offer like F10 to select boot device? Did you try that? Bios shouldn't care after you tell it what boot device you want.

Does the CD reader work?

Do you have a known good CD? Some CD's may or may not work on all computers.

Can it boot to usb, if so try a live usb.
 
Old 05-12-2011, 10:20 PM   #6
smturner1
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Jefro,

I will try and download another version of Ubuntu 10.10. That is the only thing I have not done.

To reiterate, the cd/dvd devise is at the top of the list. Meaning, that would be the first devise to boot to.
 
Old 05-12-2011, 10:23 PM   #7
EDDY1
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Are you sure the cd drive is seen in bios? I just worked on Hp a1720n & had to update bios after virus.
 
Old 05-12-2011, 11:20 PM   #8
TobiSGD
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I have a HP laptop and can assure that there is no such thing like a "Windows firmware" on it. On my laptop the key to choose the boot device is F9, maybe you want to try that.
I can only second the opinion that there are rests of the bootloader of the previous Windows install on the harddisk. But even then you should be able to boot from CD/DVD.
So I would think that there are only two possible culprits (if the boot order is correct): Either the CD is faulty/not burned correct (try it on a different machine with known good CD-drive), or it is the CD/DVD-drive that is faulty.
 
Old 05-13-2011, 03:17 AM   #9
paulsm4
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smturner1 -
Quote:
Ah, sounds to me like the computer is trying to boot into a damaged M$ Windows install.
Yup. Specifically - your hard drive. Like I said above, you need to configure the BIOS boot order to configure your BIOS to boot from the CD/DVD first.

Quote:
My boot record has been edited so that the cd/dvd is first.
Huh? What are you smoking ?

Quote:
There is such a thing as firmware on an HP product.
Of course there is. It's called your "BIOS". And it has nothing directly to do with your abortive Windows startup.

Quote:
I have a HP laptop and can assure that there is no such thing like a "Windows firmware" on it. On my laptop the key to choose the boot device is F9, maybe you want to try that.
Excellent point. You should be able to press F10 (to reconfigure the boot order in the BIOS) or F9 (to select a different device this particular boot).
 
Old 05-13-2011, 03:47 PM   #10
smturner1
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ok, I am obviously not getting through to most of you. I will clarify;

A. I am not smoking anything!!! I "edited" the Master boot Record to boot from the cd/dvd!!! I realize I am not a "Guru", but do me a favor and do not condescend. I may not have your knowledge in Linux/UNIX, but I am a System Admin and am trying to learn as much as possible from "kind, knowledgeable people", the nuances of this OS.

B. I have already changed the boot order, see A.

C. Ok, it is not "Windows Firmware", but the BIOS in the firmware is pointing to a Windows directory. I realize my wording was confusing, sorry.

D. I will check the cd/dvd copy to make sure I have a good image. If that is ok, I will check to make sure the hardware is working properly.

I do appreciate your input and will continue to seek it out, so long as a respectful tone is present.
 
Old 05-13-2011, 04:13 PM   #11
jefro
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OK, lets work together to fix this.

I know you changed boot order, but I did want you to try the boot option that most HP's have to select boot at post.

The windows deal really is unknown to us. Never heard of it.

I'd test the computer with a known working pressed cd like a windows xp cd. It is the best choice to help prove the thing can boot.
 
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Old 05-13-2011, 04:46 PM   #12
GVrooman
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With all due respect, you did not edit your Master Boot Record. You used the BIOS setup utility to edit your CMOS memory where the boot order of your drives is stored. The Master Boot Record is the first sector of your hard drive, and there are probably remnants of an old Windows boot loader there. jefro's suggestion is a good one, and you should go ahead and try it.
 
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Old 05-13-2011, 05:16 PM   #13
johnsfine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smturner1 View Post
ok, I am obviously not getting through to most of you.
Or the other way around.

Quote:
I "edited" the Master boot Record to boot from the cd/dvd!!!
That is not correct. I expect/hope you edited BIOS settings to boot cd/dvd first. (That is not something in the MBR).

Quote:
I have already changed the boot order, see A.

Assuming the boot order is correct, and the CD still doesn't boot, the usual reason is that you burned the CD incorrectly.


You downloaded a .iso file. Most CD burning programs give you an obvious, but totally wrong, method to burn a .iso file to a CD as an ordinary data file. The result is worthless.

You need to burn the .iso to CD as an image, which is an entirely different operation within your CD burning software.

I always use ImgBurn, which is free and easier to use and works better than most bundled or purchased CD burning software. If you were using ImgBurn, there are many previous posts at LQ where I or others point out exactly where the correct option is within the program UI.

If you are using some other CD burning software, I can't tell you where the correct option is nor what it is named. I can just tell you the default way of writing a file to a CD is not what you should do for a .iso file.


Quote:
Ok, it is not "Windows Firmware", but the BIOS in the firmware is pointing to a Windows directory.
The BIOS is booting the hard drive. Probably you correctly changed the boot sequence, but incorrectly burned the CD, so the BIOS looks at the CD first, sees it is incorrect, skips it and then boots the hard drive.

But the BIOS would boot the hard drive if the CD hardware were bad, or if you didn't correctly change the boot sequence, or if you downloaded a bad .iso file (even if you then burned it correctly). So, from what you have said, we can know the BIOS is still booting the hard drive; But we can only guess that is because you used your CD burning software incorrectly.

On your hard drive is either a recovery partition or the remnants of the Windows partition. One of those is getting control, seeing the absence of a valid Windows install and displaying the message you reported. All that only happens after the CD has failed to boot.

Quote:
I will check the cd/dvd copy to make sure I have a good image.
That would be great if you know how to do that. But I suspect you do not. I would start by using a healthy computer to do a top level directory of that CD. If you see the .iso file, then my guess is correct that you misused the CD burning software. I'm not sure exactly what you should see if you burned the CD correctly, but I can distinguish reasonable from wrong if you post what a top level directory shows.

Quote:
I will check to make sure the hardware is working properly.
Also good if you know how. The only way I can think of is using a known good bootable CD if you have one.

Quote:
I do appreciate your input and will continue to seek it out, so long as a respectful tone is present.
We are providing help. You should be looking for help, not respect. You made incorrect statements that indicate misunderstandings that interfere with your ability to reach the solution. It is helpful to try to correct your misunderstandings. It is respectful to treat your incorrect beliefs as equally valid with correct beliefs, and leave you unable to solve the problem. If you want the second of those choices, you're in the wrong forum.

Last edited by johnsfine; 05-13-2011 at 05:34 PM.
 
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Old 05-14-2011, 09:23 AM   #14
smturner1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jefro View Post
OK, lets work together to fix this.

I know you changed boot order, but I did want you to try the boot option that most HP's have to select boot at post.

I'd test the computer with a known working pressed cd like a windows xp cd. It is the best choice to help prove the thing can boot.
Thank you jefro. Unfortunately I do not have a working copy of XP. Because I do not have a working copy, I cannot test the drive. But looking through the three preceding posts, I have probably copied the image as data and not as an image. Rookie mistake, but what can I say I am a rookie!

I used the escape option, the F10 option and the F8 option. F10 allows me to change some of the boot options, especially the devise to boot to. The esc option allows me to boot from the CD or the HDD. The F8 option lists the old boot loader directory: \windows\system32\winload.exe
 
Old 05-14-2011, 09:38 AM   #15
johnsfine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smturner1 View Post
I used the escape option, the F10 option and the F8 option. F10 allows me to change some of the boot options, especially the devise to boot to. The esc option allows me to boot from the CD or the HDD. The F8 option lists the old boot loader directory: \windows\system32\winload.exe
ESC and F10 are keys intercepted by your BIOS before it boots the HDD, so the dialogs you reach with those are parts of the BIOS firmware.

F8 is intercepted by the Windows loader code on the HDD after the BIOS has booted the HDD. That behavior shows you still have a Windows partition containing the beginning of the Windows loader code. It seems you don't have enough of the rest of Windows in that partition for it to finish loading.

If you want to try ImgBurn to burn a new CD, you can get that from
http://imgburn.com/
Also look at the screenshot at
http://imgburn.com/index.php?act=screenshots

There you see "Write image file to disc", which is ImgBurn terminology for the correct operation that you need to create your bootable Ubuntu CD.

You also see "Write files/folder to disc", which is ImgBurn terminology for the incorrect operation that matches what we are guessing you did with some other CD burning software.

Last edited by johnsfine; 05-14-2011 at 09:41 AM.
 
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