"GRUB _" when booting, nothing but "ctrl+alt+del" functions
 

i have 3 hard drives. 2 sata and 1 ide.

i dont have the exact specs, but drive c: was the 40gb ide, drive d: was 120gb sata and e: was 160gb sata. i was running primarily on the d: drive.

originally (don't ask me why) i had a diff installation of xp on each. i decided i'd like to give linux a try (and also was tired of spyware/malware that i couldnt seem to remove). so i used the computer management thing to format my e: drive, and it said it worked fine. after that though, it couldnt seem to find the c: drive (not really the problem now). so i backed up my files on d: over to e: (i figured it was ok to not have an os on it if i just used it for storage - true?). then i booted from my linux cd (redhat). the instal said it worked fine, i assumed it did. but now, when i boot up without a disk, it goes through the boot sequence of my 2 cd-rom drives, then says "GRUB _" with the flashing underscore. nothing on my keyboard does anything except ctrl+alt+del. i tried the rescue to put the boot loader on the mbr, same result. so i tried it again with the other option (i think the first section of the boot partition), same result. so i decided to just go back to windows, only now when i boot from that install disk, it says 'detecting hardware configuration' and then goes blank and nothing else. i have a knoppix live cd, and it works, so i can get online if necessary, but i cant access any of my hard drives or the os on them.

(if this belongs in the general section, i'm sorry. i just figured it was more technical than microsoft-related)

Hi, and welcome to LQ!

To help you with this we need to find out in which order FC saw the drives
during install, where it installed Grub to, and what drive Linux is on now.

From Knoppix (in the hope that Knoppix sees the drives in the same way FC did):
what does
fdisk -l
show you, can you, from that output, tell which is your linux instal, which is
the working XP and which holds the data?



Cheers,
Tink

i assume i need to put the fdisk -l into the konsole (brand spankin new to linux-related things). so i did, and all it did was move me one line down. so i dont think i did it right. i did discover though, that if i disable all the cd-rom booting in the bios, it doesnt even MENTION grub. the list of operating systems is a bit screwed up ('restore windows xp pro', and also 'setup windows xp pro'... besides the 3 plain 'windows xp pro' options) and i can load the old c: drive (ide 40 gb) XP and it works fine. but that now shows the old e: drive (160 gb sata now just backup) as drive d: (files still ok) and the old d: drive (120 gb sata, should now be linux) as drive g: - and there's nothing on it. i assume that's because it just doesnt recognize linux file system?

the interesting thing to me is in the computer management/disk management thing. this is what shows up

Disk0 C:\ Healthy (System)

Disk1 __ 102 mb Healthy (Active) no drive letter [i'm assuming this is where GRUB should be?] [this box also has diaganol lines through it]

Disk1 (still) G:\ 111.69 gb Healthy

Disk2 D:\ 149.05 gb NTFS Healthy (Active)

i dont really know what all that means, but i think my assumptions are at least close. i'm gonna leave knoppix running (please tell me if that's a bad idea.

as far as the order that the install showed the drives, i'm 90% sure it showed my 120 gb as sda and my 160 gb as sdb. and although it makes no sense to me, it didnt show my ide drive at all. for future help/instructions, could you dumb down the linux-related lingo so i know i'm doing things correctly?

also, as a last resort, would i be able to back up my files onto my roommates computer using knoppix? and is it possible for knoppix to use my wireless network? i've had to use the 'nodhcp' code so it doesnt hang on eth0 when loading. i configure eth1 for my cat5 cable to get online here, and i'm not sure what eth2 is. anyway, if i can fix this instal, just ignore these questions. thank you

after posting, i noticed the ROOT shell option and figured i'd try it there. viola! here's what i got. (by the way, is there a way to cut and paste from the shell?)

Disk /dev/hdb: 40.0 GB, 40060403712 bytes
240 heads, 63 sectors/track, 5174 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 15120 * 512 = 7741440 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/hdb1 * 1 5173 39107848+ 7 HPFS/NTFS

Disk /dev/sda: 120.0 GB, 120034123776 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 14593 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 * 1 13 104391 83 Linux
/dev/sda2 14 14593 117113850 8e Linux LVM

Disk /dev/sdb: 160.0 GB, 160041885696 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19457 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sdb1 * 1 19457 156288321 7 HPFS/NTFS

i think that means i was wrong about it not seeing my ide drive, eh? or maybe just knoppix sees it but not the linux install? either way, does that help? i tried to space it all out, but it didnt work, sorry.

You could use [ code ] [ /code ] (without the spaces) between the words
and the [ ] to get proper spacing.

That said: it really depends on what FC saw during install, and where it
installed grub to.

Chances are that Knoppix will see your wireless card, just try it.


Cheers,
Tink



Cheers,
Tink

well every time i use knoppix without the nodhcp code it just hangs when trying to configure eth0 so i'll just stick to the cable. if FC saw my system the same way knoppix does, how do i fix it? i'd like to avoid messing with the 40 gig and 160 gig drives if possible. i dont even know what the PROBLEM is, is it the mbr? is it grub? is it me? should i try to reinstall linux? if so, can you tell me exactly what options i should use for partitioning, etc? i'm so lost. thanks.

i'd at least like to know how to get it too boot from my windows cd... do you know why it wont? it doesnt sound like something that's supposed to happen. like something is actually messed up and not just a mistake i made, you kow? (it just stops after detecting hardware configuration and doesnt let me do anything like recovery console or a new instal)

I wouldn't go trying that. I suggest you use the FC install CD
as a rescue-disk. Once you're in, grab the same info (fdisk -l).

If it displays the same things, make sure to run
grub-install /dev/hdb

What's hda, btw, do you have a CD-ROM as the primary master on
your IDE controller? The problem may well be caused by your
BIOS, if you -for instance- force the slave to master via BIOS,
Grub may get confused.


Cheers,
Tink

ok, i'll do the rescue thing as soon as i get home... i'm fairly sure my cd-rw and my dvd-rw are secondary master/secondary slave respectively, but i'll make sure. (i'm not incredibly great at hardware stuff, so i'll get my roommate to verify). to be honest, i'm not sure what hda is because i've only got 1 non-sata drive, and it's showing as hdb. i'll check to see if i have the jumper on slave, but i dont know if that would cause that. and if you can get another reply in before i do, is there a way to print all that info from the shell? or do i have to write it out? i guess i can just print my old info and compare, but what if it's different? i'll check back if that's the case. thanks for the help.

ok, i ran the rescue and did the fdisk -l. everything was the same expect it didnt have hdb. or hda for that matter. since it wasnt the same, i didnt do anything (for fear of screwing something else up). i assume, also, that the install command you gave was supposed to install grub on a drive that it didnt even find, so it probably wouldnt work anyway, right?

about the master/slave, this kinda confuses me. according to my bios, i don't have anything set as primary master or primary slave. my dvd drive is secondary master and my cd drive is secondary slave. bios is another thing i'm not that familiar with. i tried the autodetect, and it detected nothing. i'm gonna take a guess and say that's (at least part of) why linux doesn't find my ide drive.

also, the boot to windows i managed last night was apparently a one time thing. i couldn't do it just now. it did the whole "GRUB _" thing again.

should i try to do that command on hdb anyway? thanks

Some thoughts; hopefully won't add confusion:
- I recall reading somewhere FC didn't install to SATA disks properly
- hdb is fine, just means it's not the primary on the cable.
- I'm surprised Windoze booted at all
- the reason the Windoze CD won't boot is because of the boot flags on the SATA disk. Yes I know 'doze is installed on a different disk; I've seen this before. Yes, it' stoopid, but we are talking M$oft here. However the Fedora install shouldn't set that flag either - just as inane.

Mmmm - just saw that last post. Personally I'd give up on Fedora if it's causing that much grief.
I'd recommend Ubuntu, but I don't want to start a "Distro war". Pick another distro and install it smack over the top of your FC install - all your issues should disappear. This all seems a shortcoming in Fedora rather than anything you've screwed up.

If you'd like to go back to XP (normal) booting and calm down for a while before embarking again on Linux, ask here and we'll get that sorted as well.

Edit: removed junk at end of post.

well seeing as i really dont have any way of downloading anything new, such as ubuntu, i'd like to just get my windows working again. then i'll do some more legwork on linux and issues with dual-booting, etc. as far as i can tell, the 120 gig drive (sda) is the only one affected. maybe the mbr? but if you'd help me to get that reinstalled, i'd appreciate it. thanks to everyone.

well anyone willing to help with this, anyone at all, i'm anxious. i even looked into ubunto... i went to ubunto.com and saw i could get a free cd (wow!) but it would take 6-10 weeks. i'll probably go ahead and place an order, but i'd like to use my computer between now and then. thanks to anyone.

Sorry I got side-tracked and never got back to this.

Simplest (quickest) solution is to remove the 120 Gig drive to allow the XP CD to boot. Simply pull a cable out; power or interface cable, either at the drive or the motherboard - doesn't matter.
Then boot the XP, get into "recovery console" (hit the "R" key during the boot I think), then run "fixmbr" (no quotes).
Reboot - when happy it works, connect the 120 Gig again. Won't affect subsequent reboots off the hard-disk.

The other option is to boot Knoppix, get the root console open, and type "fdisk /dev/sda" - as it says, "m" gives you the (sub) commands. Always handy to do "p" for reference - then "a", then the partition number - in your case "1".
Then "w" to update the disk,and "q" to quit.
Reboot.
You can (also) do this after you get XP back if you want - handy to have a spare disk to play with and get the experience.

It is possible it (the XP CD) still won't boot because of the bootflag on the 160 Gig drive, but if it sees a valid Windows install there it should proceed - that is a valid (multi-system) environment, even for M$osft.
In need, repeat the Knoppix actions above for /dev/sdb.

i'll do that when i get home. just out of curiousity, when i plug the 120 back in, i'm assuming that the 'fixmbr' command wouldnt include it (since it wouldnt detect it), but would it detect another operating system to boot? or would i at least get access to it from my windows install? thanks in advance.

The MBR simply points to where ntldr lives - doesn't give a rat's arse about anything else.
Same should apply to the "installer", but appears not to (from experience) - but I'm not going to try and rationalize the thinking behind it.

The new disk will be seen but ignored by XP as it's not a M$oft partition type - it might offer to reformat it for you. I always reply "no" - especially if I plan to use it for Linux in the future.