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Old 03-27-2009, 06:05 AM   #1
gemmun
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Dependencies - achilles heel of linux


Is it at all possible to edit the RPM database. I want to burn mp3 from kb3 and it is a nightmare - see gripe below. I found a package which ONLY required two dependencies. I have found them and got them into /usr/lib but now stuck.


GRIPE

I'm running Centos 5. Linux is good and has the potential to be great BUT it has yet to learn that if it wants to knock Microsoft off its pedestal it has got to be better presented.


Using kb3 as an example, here is a program that looks, on the surface, to be quite good IF YOU CAN GET THE DAMNED THING TO WORK - it will not handle mp3 !!!!!!!!!!!!! without wasting three days and still no result!!! The supplied native version is EL5 - you know 2009 version and no mp3 built in ???????

I installed it only to find it does not do what it says on the tin. Will not burn mp3 format. So look it up on the web and find it needs A,B,C dependencies. Download those. Then find they need x,y,z dependencies. Find some of them not available separately but buried in other packages.Each time I downloaded a different version of k3b it needs different dependencies

GET THE PICTURE ???? - A USER WANTS TO INSTALL A PACKAGE AND FOR IT TO WORK.

Linux will remain a geek's domain until things like rpm packages work right out of the box.Joe Public would never accept it AS IS. The fault lies with package distributors. YOU MUST LEARN TO DISTRIBUTE DOWNLOADS WHICH WORK IMMEDIATELY - NODEPS !!!!!

I refuse to continue being a PI R squared bird chasing ever smaller bits to get some basic program to work

For burning audio CD's I'm temporarily using Nero for Linux, but since you have to pay for that it will not be long before it is discarded. After that back to Windows I'm afraid. At least those progs work out of the box !!!!!!

Last edited by gemmun; 03-27-2009 at 06:14 AM.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 06:23 AM   #2
ilikejam
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Calm down.

MP3 support is switched off on CentOS because it's a patented format - US Linux distros can't distribute MP3 decoders without paying royalties.

To get MP3 support for K3b, first install the RPMForge package:
( http://dag.wieers.com/rpm/FAQ.php#B )
# rpm -Uhv http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/i386/...l5.rf.i386.rpm

Then install k3b-mp3:
# yum install k3b-mp3

Dave

P.S. The irony of your last statement isn't lost on me.

Last edited by ilikejam; 03-27-2009 at 06:27 AM.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 06:33 AM   #3
gemmun
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Many thanks for your reply.

The first package you mentioned was already installed.

Command line yum install got the result "nothing to do" - did not find k3b-mp3.

I do have a i386 rpm but it wants libFLAC libs which are in the /usr/lib directory but unknown to rpm database
 
Old 03-27-2009, 06:38 AM   #4
ilikejam
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Could you try:

# yum list all | grep -i k3b

and see if it finds k3b-mp3?
 
Old 03-27-2009, 06:38 AM   #5
Didier Spaier
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Hi Gemmun,

welcome to LQ.

Bear in mind that there is really no "one Linux" but hundreds of different distributions/versions, each version of each distribution including specific:
- kernel(s)
- set of libraries (needed for applications to work)
- system tools
- applications.

The RPM stuff try to cope with dependencies between all theses components, but will often be unsuccessful unless you take care of only installing software prepared for *your* version of *your* distribution, preferably "official" ones.

If you don't check that, chances are you quickly will fall in what's called the "dependencies hell".

This is one of the reasons I ended up sticking with Slackware. It has no automatic dependencies checking, but the whole consistency of the system is thorough fully checked by a small team headed by one individual (Patrick Volkerding) so every application officially included in Slackware usually works right out of the box.

Last edited by Didier Spaier; 03-27-2009 at 07:00 AM. Reason: Typo removed
 
Old 03-27-2009, 06:55 AM   #6
gemmun
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Thanks ilikejam

Did that. Found

#yum list all | grep -i k3b
k3b.i386 0.12.17-1.el5 base
k3b-extras.i386 0.12.17-3.el5.rf rpmforge

# yum install k3b-extras.i386
Loading "fastestmirror" plugin
Loading "priorities" plugin
Loading mirror speeds from cached hostfile
* epel: ftp.nluug.nl
* rpmfusion-free-updates-testing: download1.rpmfusion.org
* livna: rpm.livna.org
* rpmforge: fr2.rpmfind.net
* rpmfusion-free-updates: download1.rpmfusion.org
* adobe-linux-i386: linuxdownload.adobe.com
* updates: ftp.nluug.nl
* base: mirror.bytemark.co.uk
* extras: mirror.bytemark.co.uk
* addons: mirror.bytemark.co.uk
2676 packages excluded due to repository priority protections
Setting up Install Process
Parsing package install arguments
Resolving Dependencies
--> Running transaction check
---> Package k3b-extras.i386 0:0.12.17-3.el5.rf set to be updated
--> Processing Dependency: k3b = 0.12.17 for package: k3b-extras
--> Processing Dependency: libk3b.so.2 for package: k3b-extras
--> Processing Dependency: libk3bdevice.so.2 for package: k3b-extras
--> Processing Dependency: libtag.so.1 for package: k3b-extras
--> Processing Dependency: libavformat.so.51 for package: k3b-extras
--> Processing Dependency: libavcodec.so.51 for package: k3b-extras
--> Running transaction check
---> Package k3b-extras.i386 0:0.12.17-3.el5.rf set to be updated
--> Processing Dependency: libavformat.so.51 for package: k3b-extras
---> Package ffmpeg-libs.i386 0:0.4.9-0.52.20080908.el5 set to be updated
--> Processing Dependency: libgsm.so.1 for package: ffmpeg-libs
--> Processing Dependency: libx264.so.60 for package: ffmpeg-libs
--> Processing Dependency: libdc1394.so.22 for package: ffmpeg-libs
--> Processing Dependency: libImlib2.so.1 for package: ffmpeg-libs
--> Processing Dependency: libfaac.so.0 for package: ffmpeg-libs
---> Package k3b.i386 0:0.12.17-1.el5 set to be updated
---> Package taglib.i386 0:1.5-2.el5 set to be updated
--> Running transaction check
---> Package x264-libs.i386 0:0.0.0-0.15.20080613.el5 set to be updated
---> Package libdc1394.i386 0:2.0.2-1.el5 set to be updated
---> Package k3b-extras.i386 0:0.12.17-3.el5.rf set to be updated
--> Processing Dependency: libavformat.so.51 for package: k3b-extras
---> Package gsm.i386 0:1.0.12-3.el5 set to be updated
---> Package imlib2.i386 0:1.3.0-6.el5 set to be updated
---> Package faac.i386 0:1.28-1.el5 set to be updated
--> Processing Dependency: libmp4v2.so.0 for package: faac
--> Running transaction check
---> Package k3b-extras.i386 0:0.12.17-3.el5.rf set to be updated
--> Processing Dependency: libavformat.so.51 for package: k3b-extras
---> Package libmp4v2.i386 0:1.5.0.1-6.el5 set to be updated
--> Finished Dependency Resolution
Error: Missing Dependency: libavformat.so.51 is needed by package k3b-extras

MY VERY POINT - dependencies again

This PI R squared bird is merely getting into tighter spirals before disappearing up his own fundamental orifice.

Linux geeks are a cheerful helpful lot but previous comments only reinforce what I said first. The community is too fragmented to ever challenge Windows. Too many distros, too many inconsistencies. I repeat that Linux is a brilliant concept and obviously supported by dedicated people, BUT while you remain so divided Windows will continue to conquer.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 07:08 AM   #7
ilikejam
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Ah. You've got a lot of extra repos in your YUM config. This is Not Recommended (some repos are mutually incompatible - I generally only use rpmfusion and the standard Fedora repos for my Fedora boxes).

Since k3b-extras is in rpmforge, I'd try switching off the rpmfusion and livna repositories in this case, then try the k3b-extras install again.

Dave
 
Old 03-27-2009, 07:22 AM   #8
gemmun
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Tried that but no joy.

That libavformat appears as a missing dependency elsewhere. It really is stupid to have libraries which are not self contained and depend on further libraries - MADNESS

I think you are beginning to get the drift - what a farce to install what is a fundamental application in a modern PC.

This problem MIGHT appear in <1% of Windows apps. Their progs tend to supply this sort of thing and install if not already there. It is years since I have seen this sort of problem on Win machines. The old one used to be VB6 runtime but not anymore.

PS

My native version of k3b is el5.i386. I downloaded the libk3b extras also in el5.i386 version and that failed on TWO dependencies - libavformat plus another. Pathetic

Last edited by gemmun; 03-27-2009 at 07:28 AM.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 07:33 AM   #9
ilikejam
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There is no farce here - maybe someone should have told you not to enable every 3rd party repo you stumbled across, but that's not Linux's fault. Anyway...

libavformat.so.51 is part of the ffmpeg package. Is that already installed?
# rpm -qa | grep ffmpeg

If so, I'd remove ffmpeg, then try the k3b-extras install again.

And this sort of problem is far more prevalent on Windows than you seem to think, except on Windows the new application's installer will generally just stomp all over the already installed apps' libraries. At least with RPM you can be fairly sure that what's already working will /keep/ working.

Dave
 
Old 03-27-2009, 08:07 AM   #10
pixellany
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gemmun;
~ 10 years ago, I gave up on the Mac and switched to Windows 95. Not long after, I moved to Windows 2000. In both cases it took many months before I was comfortable with everything and started to feel a bit "in control". ~ 7 years ago, I started moving to Linux. At the time, even though the learning curve was still pretty steep, it was already obvious (to me) that Linux was fundamentally a superior approach. Now, I have not had Windows on a personal machine in ~ 2 years.

My current assessment:
  1. For someone who has never setup or used a computer, Linux could now be an easier learning curve than Windows--especially if their needs were fairly simple and mainstream.
  2. On average, there are now more SW choices for Linux than for Windows.
  3. While Linux can meet the needs of the majority of users, there are definitely still some specific situations where someone will be better off with Windows.
  4. Not everyone cares about the anti-social business practices at Microsoft.
  5. Most people do not want to put out the effort to learn anything new--especially if it involves something as obtuse as a computer.

I would never want someone to give up on Linux after just a few weeks and 5 posts at the premier help site.......At the same time, I'm never surprised when they do.

"You pays your money and you takes your choice....."
 
Old 03-27-2009, 08:14 AM   #11
gemmun
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I take your point. No the ffmpeg package was not installed - and it never will be. I downloaded it and it fails for four dependencies. The other missing one was libmpcdec.s0.3.

Quite honestly it is not worth spending any more time on this. It should be a basic package for an everyday task on a modern PC.

It only confirms my "gripe2 above. Linux, despite its obvious strengths, will never be a "Joe Public" system. It is simply far too fragmented and geeky for wide spread use. I shall continue to use it for some limited tasks but it really needs to grow up to be useful in the wider world. I know people who are scared of computers - lucky eh ? - but they can at least install a downloaded program. Linux is probably unusable by over 95% of users.

This is my third distro after RH7 & RH9. It is actually getting harder with the explosion of distros and different versions. At one time I could download an RPM and be confident it would work. No longer. This is the fragmentation I mention. Who needs i386, i586, i686, X86_64 and further AMD versions ??? Windows doesn't care whether it is Intel AMD or someone else, only 32 or 64 bit. Much simpler even though documentation is not so good and many of the more esoteric parts are well hidden.

But at least you can install a simple burner program that works !!!!!

A long way from my original question about editing the rpm database !!!

Last edited by gemmun; 03-27-2009 at 08:26 AM.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 08:21 AM   #12
H_TeXMeX_H
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Linux does not equal CentOS. If you were running Slackware, and you were to use a slackbuild or even compile it yourself, everything would just work like it was supposed to. I know what you're talking about, because I've been there when I was using Fedora Core. It's a real PITA.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 08:23 AM   #13
linuxlover.chaitanya
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In my opinion you should have started with more desktop distribution rather than going off to CentOS. It definitely is a super stable build on RHEL5 but it is more aimed at servers and workstations than a everyday desktops.
The legal matters in the US are off my head, I live in India and do not know about the laws there.
 
Old 03-27-2009, 08:26 AM   #14
ilikejam
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Oh well, have fun on Windows. If you ever feel like trying again with a new Linux install, only switch on one 3rd party yum repo, and it'll all Just Work.

Don't forget to claim your money back for the CentOS software.

Dave
 
Old 03-27-2009, 08:33 AM   #15
gemmun
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Thanks Guys

I chose Centos because it had good reports - and it was a FREE download so no money to come back.

I really like it but it is a great disappointment if a "server" quality system can't even manage to install an audio burner.

Even wine is quite good. I like my old copy of MSWorks 4.5 - 1999 edition - as the database is a dream, so simple to use. It runs fine under wine. A pity the windows burner packages seem to have a problem finding the linux cdroms or I would use one of those.
 
  


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