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Old 08-16-2005, 11:36 AM   #16
aysiu
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A newbie's take on Linux


Quote:
Originally posted by Johnnycab
Who is "we" though? Do you speak for everyone on this forum? Obviously not, as nobody else seems to be sharing your sentiment.

You definitely don't share mine, which makes your "we" neither here nor there.
I would assume, from the context of harken's post that "we" is anyone who's been reading the forums for more than a week, as these "Linux is not ready to compete with Windows" threads pop up every couple of days or so--hence harken posting links to a bunch of similar threads.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 11:53 AM   #17
PeterRJG
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Fair enough, but being spoken for by people online is a pet peeve of mine and it irks me
Nothing personal.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 12:09 PM   #18
boxerboy
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the biggest problem ive seen on forums is comparing linux to ms in anyway shape or form. ok givin ms is more user friendly but thats cause all it is is point and click. if you want a point and click os for linux my understanding is mandrake/mandriva is the basic user friendly version of linux. yast is a very good package manager but i perfer yum i found yumex to be very easy to use well thats just my feedback on that. my personal opion is that kde is better that gnome in the sence its more of a ms win desktop but i had a few lil problems with it as i did with gnome. the other ones ppl talked about ive never heard of nor tried would like to if someone can give me info on how to get them for fc4.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 12:39 PM   #19
Haiyadragon
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I found that the biggest drawback with Linux (distros) is the GUI part.

As mentioned some KDE apps seem to have serious stability problems, the toolbar system is totally broken and I just don't like that the file manager and the webbrowser are the same app (Konqueror). They are different applications requiring different interfaces (I don't need a bookmark toolbar to browse my files for example).

The only (real) other choice is to work with anything using GTK(2). GTK is just really really slow and not as capable as QT.

Firefox and Azureus, two of my favorite applications (because of their features), seem to run so much faster/snappier on Windows. I'm not sure this is because of GTK or because they use some half-assed port system but it sucks.

I now use XFCE because is very lightweight and the best choice for me right now.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 02:18 PM   #20
craigevil
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File manager - LinuxQuestions.org Wiki

There are lot of file managers. Xfe and XFFM4 are both similiar to windows explorer. Then there is ROX which will also manage your desktop wallpaper and icons.

Firefox should be just as fast on a Linux machine as it is on windows. On mine it is faster.

There are many many window managers. It is all a matter of choice. But until someone has actually tried a few different ones and ran Linux for more than a week or two they really don't need to start more microsoft is better than linux threads.

Window manager - LinuxQuestions.org Wiki

The best thing about Linux is the variety of choices one can make. Dozens of Window Managers, dozens of File Managers. Heck even a few browsers: Konqueror, Galeon, Epiphany, Mozilla, Firefox. Opera, Dillo, Lynxs, links2, elinks, Amaya.Web browser - LinuxQuestions.org Wiki

So find what works for you and enjoy.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 02:28 PM   #21
harken
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You are more than right Johhnycab, and I it seems like I owe you some appologies. Sorry if you felt offended, I thought that using "we" instead of "I" will not injure anyone's pride. I was simply thinking that, like aysiu pointed very well, many of the LQ members have seen in the past threads that reach topics like this one. Also, I posted the links to show that the matter has been already discussed under numerous occasions by certain members, not to mention that they were of course read by even more of the members.
So, long things short, I wanted "we" to represent those members who have already read such threads until today. If they share or not my sentiments about a thing like MS vs. Linux is another issue, I didn't say that, I only said "we knew", not "we agree that" or "we think that" etc.
I am a men which admits when he made a mistake, therefore I ask for your kind forgivness. I also promise that, from now on, I will refrain myself from using the pronoun "we" whenever it might hurt someone's feelings, when it will damage someone else's public image, when it would make masses felt oppresed and reduced to silence by tiranic dictators who speak for them and, especially, when it could imply your person, Johnnycab.
Or do you think it's better to use a subtle maneuvre and phrase something like "we (except for X,Y and Z) [put verb here]...", where X, Y and Z are persons that sent me official emails which show their disapproval on each and every topic discussed on these forums?
Anyway, perhaps the bitternes of being included among "the many" by that damned pronoun would have been ... sweetened if the context had described qualities or other positive attributes of the depicted persons.
Phew, it turns a longer than should be post, so I will end it here, not before reissuing my humble request of benefacting from your mercy... shall I be forgiven.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 02:29 PM   #22
boxerboy
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i would say to anyone that even thought ms was better than linux than ur scared of linux. i say give linux a few months of steady playing with it b4 u count it out. i know uve heard the saying "lets hack windows" well since the source code comes with linux the words "hack linux" should rarely ever come up because thats what they mean when they say its "free" free as in free to do what u want to it. so all i can say is give it time u learn it u will see what everyone means.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 08:26 PM   #23
opnickc
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Wow! This got a lot of replies.

The main thing I want to clarify is that this isn't some "M$ is better than Linux" argument. The fact is, I'm still using linux and have been looking into different distros. When I say that linux needs to be better to compete, I'm not saying it isn't already as good or better than windows. The fact is, it's hard to compete with a monopoly, and linux is going to have to be darn near perfect before it really has a chance to take over (which I want it to do).

BTW, excellent point by tkedwards about proprietary file types. I suppose I do have to install things for DivX and such on windows too.

Ok, so to re-emphasize my point; I tried several FREE operating systems, and the most I came up with was a VERY SMALL list of complaints. Imagine if someone were listing their complaints about windows. I guess the frustration comes from how incredibly close Linux is to perfection.

Thank you all for your thoughts. And some nice links here too. Good reading material.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 08:44 PM   #24
boxerboy
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thats one thing i have heard so often that linux has a way to go to beat the monopoly but the thing is it will never happen the thing that sets linux apart is the terminal they will always have it no matter how point and click they get. linux is known for the terminal and it always will be as far as ive heard they have no plans to get rid of it. but i understand that ur not saying ms is better and im not really saying that linux is better. i do recomend trying linux distros for a few months or so it takes a while to get used to it if uve never used it b4.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 09:04 PM   #25
opnickc
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Quote:
Originally posted by boxerboy
thats one thing i have heard so often that linux has a way to go to beat the monopoly but the thing is it will never happen the thing that sets linux apart is the terminal they will always have it no matter how point and click they get. linux is known for the terminal and it always will be as far as ive heard they have no plans to get rid of it. but i understand that ur not saying ms is better and im not really saying that linux is better. i do recomend trying linux distros for a few months or so it takes a while to get used to it if uve never used it b4.
I don't think Linux needs to completely lose the terminal, I just would like the OS it to be easy enough for even my grandma to use. And IMO that means being able to do basic tasks (getting and installing software, doing common home-user type stuff like DVD watching) without having to get into the command line.

On a slightly different subject, I just put ubuntu back on my pc. I've decided I like it more than SuSE because of it's Package Manager. I was reminded how easy the ubuntu installation is, I was able to complete it at a leasurely pace between this and my last post.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 09:21 PM   #26
aysiu
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Quote:
Originally posted by boxerboy
thats one thing i have heard so often that linux has a way to go to beat the monopoly but the thing is it will never happen
Sure, Linux doesn't have to take over or beat Windows, but it could definitely do with a bit more marketshare, if only to get more hardware vendors to release drivers for Linux or game-makers to port more commercial games to Linux. Linux should really be shooting for a marketshare equivalent to what Apple has on the desktop (which isn't much).

Quote:
the thing that sets linux apart is the terminal they will always have it no matter how point and click they get.
And having a GUI for things never takes away the terminal. Look at Mepis, for example--all point-and-click, but the terminal's still there. What's annoying about Windows (though, I've heard this may change for Vista) is that DOS can't do everything while Windows is running. The Linux terminal can do anything, even if KDE or Gnome are in full swing.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 10:20 PM   #27
PeterRJG
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@harken

Don't worry about it too much. Apology accepted.

@ the OP

Windows and Unix (and Linux by extension) are apples and oranges. The entire design rationale behind both is different. There's a lot of overlap and both platforms try and do things the other does, but really, never the twain shall meet.

I'll go out on a limb here and say the problem with Windows isn't Windows itself but a combination of poorly written software and inexperienced and undisciplined computer usage. I've run Windows 2000 since it was released and never had it crash on me once.

I'd like to think that's because I know what I'm doing and practice good usage habits. In other words, I don't download 45 types of instant messager, allow toolbars to be installed, use screensavers full of spyware, etc.

Linux (and Unix) has the advantage that it forces you to learn good usage skills. It's intolerant of errors and mistakes as you'll find out. You cannot do things half-baked or take lazy shortcuts.

But never think Linux's aim is to replace Windows. It's not. Flat-bed trucks won't replace 4 door sedans. It's simply apples and oranges.
 
Old 08-16-2005, 11:18 PM   #28
scuzzman
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Please learn to use a search engine. All these points have been brought up before: your ideas are not new. Here's the secret about open-source software: you can change it. Go ahead! Modify the source code to your heart's content! Don't know how to code? Fine - learn! Don't want to? Stop complaining!
Everything I need to do, I can do with Slackware. Often times, through the command line. Know how long I've seriously been using Linux? Just over 6 months. Now, tell me again a Newbie can't use this software - I'm living proof one can
 
Old 08-16-2005, 11:51 PM   #29
jtabasundrajr
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hi to all

hello
i'm a newbie in using linux xandros 3, my network is working properly, but i can't connect to the internet, because my gateway is wrong, how can i change my gate way setting, the the txtbx is disable!

by the way i'm connected to a LAN to have a internet connection

And how can i map a network drive in linux

i need your anwer. can u plz answer me in my email charjim20@yahoo.com

thank you very much!
 
Old 08-17-2005, 07:21 AM   #30
rollo
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Quote:
Originally posted by Haiyadragon
The only (real) other choice is to work with anything using GTK(2). GTK is just really really slow and not as capable as QT.

Firefox and Azureus, two of my favorite applications (because of their features), seem to run so much faster/snappier on Windows. I'm not sure this is because of GTK or because they use some half-assed port system but it sucks.
Yep, I have this issue too. Check out http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...hreadid=270160

I just put up with it, though I improved things slightly by installing the most lightweight Firefox theme I could find.
 
  


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