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Old 10-02-2012, 01:22 PM   #1
Zimo
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UEFI boot


Hi guys.

I think to buy a new PC in the next days or month ( it depends on ebay ). I focused on Acer N56VZ ( i7 ivy, 6GB RAM, GeForce GT 650M ). I have found online that newer machines will have UEFI instead of BIOS.

So i'm thinking if this UEFI will cause me troubles installing my Linux distro ( ubuntu, debian, mint ). Any experience about that? Did you get troubles with UEFI?
 
Old 10-02-2012, 02:13 PM   #2
JaseP
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It should be possible to disable UEFI secure boot, in the system setup. Plus, Fedora and Ubuntu are supposed to be registering themselves with MS keys,... so that UEFI secure boot detects them as a version of Windows.
 
Old 10-02-2012, 02:49 PM   #3
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Please differentiate. UEFI is not the same as Secure Boot. A Linux distro has to be prepared to boot on an UEFI PC and this has nothing to do with Secure Boot at all.
Ubuntu: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UEFIBooting
Debian: I am not quite sure if that will be supported by the upcoming Debian Wheezy, but there should be unofficial UEFI install CDs by the developers: http://blog.einval.com/2012/08/12
Mint: Should be the same as Ubuntu

Quote:
I focused on Acer N56VZ ( i7 ivy, 6GB RAM, GeForce GT 650M )
I think you mean the ASUS N56VZ. this laptop features the Nvidia Optimus technology, which is currently not supported in Linux by Nvidia (rumors say that they are working on it, but I believe that when i can see it). it may be possible to get Optimus working with the software from the Bumblebee project, nonetheless.
 
Old 10-02-2012, 03:55 PM   #4
Zimo
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Sorry for the litte OT, but Tobi, "not supported" means what? Not supported that specific function ( optimus ), not supported at all ( cannot use GUI ) or not supported for graphic effects?

@JaseP: i have heard that Ubuntu is going to support uefi during installation , as it is in 12.04 yet, or so i read. However it seems that not always UEFI can be disabled!

Last edited by Zimo; 10-02-2012 at 04:00 PM.
 
Old 10-02-2012, 06:11 PM   #5
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Again, there is a difference between UEFI and Secure Boot. You don't need to disable UEFI to install Linux, but if you have an UEFI BIOS with Secure Boot and you use a distro with no own keys (at present only Ubuntu and Fedora have them, AFAIK) you either need to disable Secure Boot (rendering Windows 8 unbootable) or you have to make your own custom key, add it to the firmware and sign your bootloader with it. Both is possible if you buy x86 hardware with Windows 8 logo. If you buy a notebook with Windows 7 you don't have to bother with Secure Boot.

Regarding Optimus, Nvidia currently does not support switching the video chips. This can be solved by either disabling one of the chips in the BIOS (not always possible) or by installing Bumblebee. When you use Bumblebee the Intel video chip will be used by default, you can run applications on the Nvidia chip by starting them with optirun, like
Code:
optirun glxgears
 
Old 10-02-2012, 10:45 PM   #6
JaseP
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TobiSGD is right. I misread the original question. If your system uses UEFI instead of a traditional BIOS, it can be an improvement over the old BIOS based systems in terms of boot speed, etc.

I thought your question was in regards to the Secure Boot sub-specification. Secure Boot is supposed to be able to be deactivated on all Win8 certified x86 systems. However, as I said, Fedora and Ubuntu are supposed to be able to use MS keys to be installed... The jury's out... on whether that works and if it will work well...

Last edited by JaseP; 10-03-2012 at 09:02 AM.
 
Old 10-02-2012, 11:50 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JaseP View Post
Secure Boot is supposed to be able to be deactivated on all Win8 certified x86 systems.
Nope. There must be an option to disable Secure Boot if the hardware is x86 and has the Windows 8 Logo.
 
Old 10-03-2012, 12:19 AM   #8
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@Tobi, Optimus question again: with GT650M can i run X server without bumblebee?

About UEFI: i have to use distros like Ubuntu and Fedora?
 
Old 10-03-2012, 01:42 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zimo View Post
@Tobi, Optimus question again: with GT650M can i run X server without bumblebee?
Most likely the Xserver will run on the Intel graphics without Bumblebee.

Quote:
About UEFI: i have to use distros like Ubuntu and Fedora?
No, it should work with almost any modern distro, sometimes wit a little bit of fiddling. You only have to use Ubuntu or Fedora if the laptop supports Secure Boot and you run Windows 8 and you don't want to create your own key to sign your bootloader.
 
Old 10-03-2012, 09:01 AM   #10
JaseP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobiSGD View Post
Nope. There must be an option to disable Secure Boot if the hardware is x86 and has the Windows 8 Logo.
You really think they're going to enforce that one???
 
Old 10-03-2012, 09:26 AM   #11
TobiSGD
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May be you should read the requirements for getting a Windows 8 logo. The ability to disable Secure Boot on x86 hardware and the ability to manage the key database are listed as mandatory.
So yes, they are enforcing that if you want to get the logo.

Last edited by TobiSGD; 10-03-2012 at 09:27 AM.
 
Old 10-03-2012, 10:06 AM   #12
JaseP
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Oh,... I READ it,... a long time ago, when they first put that out (after the initial flack they took following RedHat's Matt Garret's blog about it). I just know that what they SAY that they'll do,... and what they actually do are often two different things,...

Like conforming to the (now expired) DoJ consent decree regarding not using their market position with hardware manufacturers to prevent the installation of competitive software ... Back room deals eviscerated that, especially in the early X86 mobile market (ever try to get a Compal based MID in the mid-2000s, anywhere but in Europe or China?).

Look what happened to YukYung/Viliv... The original Viliv S5 MID, and their similar MIDs were developed to be Win/Linux agnostic ... But in the span of 3 -5 mos. from a trade show to product release,... They became Windows only,... with hardware spec changes and hardware device activation locked up with a Windows app. The original Linux app to do that disappeared, only to be "leaked," much later, by an Intel employee,... Then even later YukYung/Viliv went OOB,... And they were an "award winning" MS partner... The DoJ consent decree was in full effect at that time,... And getting hardware spec info out of YukYing was like smuggling people past the Berlin Wall during the Cold War... "Contracts" prevented them from making disclosures... Excellent build quality on their devices by the way,... but that didn't prevent their demise.
 
Old 10-03-2012, 12:28 PM   #13
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But that was the other way around. The hardware manufacturer's had an open device that in what way ever was closed down. Now Microsoft is actively forcing the manufacturers to keep the platform open, at least if they want to use the logo.
 
Old 10-03-2012, 12:57 PM   #14
JaseP
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What I'm saying is that I'll believe that when I see it... I trust MS as far as I can throw Steve Balmer...
 
  


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