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Old 08-23-2012, 12:34 PM   #16
unSpawn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by business_kid View Post
What's your chipset? Is there 2 disk controllers?
Dunno if you missed it but he already posted his dmesg:
Code:
]$ curl -s "http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=GYgwY4sb"|egrep -ie "(detected|nvidia|via|ata[_|0-9])"
[    0.000000] Nvidia board detected. Ignoring ACPI timer override.

[    4.484909] sata_via 0000:03:07.3: version 2.6
[    4.956357] sata_nv 0000:00:0e.0: version 3.5
[    4.958473] pata_amd 0000:00:0d.0: version 0.4.1

[    5.473444] ata6.00: ATA-7: ST3250824AS, 3.AAE, max UDMA/133
[    6.104789] ata7.00: ATA-8: WDC WD10EARS-00MVWB0, 51.0AB51, max UDMA/133
[    6.276321] ata9.00: ATAPI: HL-DT-ST DVD-RW_GSA-H11N, JH02, max UDMA/66

@OP: BTW there's another interesting line:
Code:
[    4.495832] 8139cp 0000:03:08.0: This (id 10ec:8139 rev 10) is not an 8139C+ compatible chip, use 8139too
but changing Ethernet driver to 8139too shouldn't alleviate slowness. Maybe it's time to benchmark the machine? See how slow the system actually is in comparison to others with the same HW profile?
 
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Old 08-23-2012, 01:22 PM   #17
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I suspect that as it's an Athlon64 X2, "cool n quiet" is down-clocking the CPU... probably due to heat build up.
 
Old 08-23-2012, 05:22 PM   #18
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Ok, for easy finding, here are the tracks I still have to pursue:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
1. Can you recommend Linux tools for diagnosing the harddisc? Which parameters should I try to check?

2. About the CPU temperature, how can I tell if a measured value is too high (i.e. will cause the CPU to clock down)?

I've looked around in my distro's repos and also tried some tools I had installed, but no "conclusive results" yet.
Thanks, Ben
I have Psensor installed now, it outputs a temperature graph - now how to evaluate those data?

@business_kid: is your question answered by what unSpawn wrote, or do you need additional info?
@unSpawn:
Quote:
Maybe it's time to benchmark the machine? See how slow the system actually is in comparison to others with the same HW profile?
What do you recommend I use for benchmarks (pls if you'd know a GUI tool, it'd probably be much easier for me to handle)?

thanks, Ben

Last edited by bennypr0fane; 08-23-2012 at 05:25 PM.
 
Old 08-23-2012, 05:24 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caravel View Post
I suspect that as it's an Athlon64 X2, "cool n quiet" is down-clocking the CPU... probably due to heat build up.
Are you sure my device is using that "cool n quiet"-thingy? Do all the chips of this build use it? How can I check?
 
Old 08-25-2012, 07:02 AM   #20
unSpawn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
Are you sure my device is using that "cool n quiet"-thingy? Do all the chips of this build use it? How can I check?
Code:
]$ curl -s "http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=GYgwY4sb"|grep -i powernow
[    0.000000] ACPI: SSDT 000000007bef9680 0020C (v01 PTLTD  POWERNOW 00000001  LTP 00000001)
[   18.257127] powernow-k8: Found 1 AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4600+ (2 cpu cores) (version 2.20.00)
[   18.257178] powernow-k8: fid 0x10 (2400 MHz), vid 0x8
[   18.257180] powernow-k8: fid 0xe (2200 MHz), vid 0xa
[   18.257182] powernow-k8: fid 0xc (2000 MHz), vid 0xc
[   18.257184] powernow-k8: fid 0xa (1800 MHz), vid 0xe
[   18.257186] powernow-k8: fid 0x2 (1000 MHz), vid 0x12

# 'lsmod|grep powernow' should return something like:
# powernow_k8            13360  1 
# mperf                   1275  1 powernow_k8
# processor              26144  1 powernow_k8

# also 'cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/{scaling_available_frequencies,scaling_setspeed}' /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor
# and 'grep '^cpu.MHz' /proc/cpuinfo'
 
Old 08-25-2012, 07:05 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
What do you recommend I use for benchmarks (pls if you'd know a GUI tool, it'd probably be much easier for me to handle)?
I found Geekbench but I can't recommend it as I've never used it. If you decide against using it check your distributions repo's, Sourceforge.net, Freecode.com (formerly known as Freshmeat), Savannah.nongnu.org or Berlioz.
 
Old 08-25-2012, 07:58 AM   #22
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I'd start with a memory test, and move on to a HDD test.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
Hello,
My Computer is slow and I believe I've pretty much ruled out the possibility of heavy software being the reason, but let's take a look first:
It's a desktop PC from Acer I bought in 2006, 2GB RAM on a AMD Athlon 64 X2 CPU, NVidia GeF 6100 on-board graphics. The specs here aren't totally accurate, but you get the picture more or less.

Opening applications usually has a few seconds delay, even the Terminal or Thunar file manager take 1-3 seconds
That is in LXDE, and it has me suspecting one or the other hardware component might be failing, or ripe for replacement anyway - if it's still worthwhile.

I'd appreciate it if someone could help me narrow it down, or if you think that kind of sluggishness is normal for a PC like that...
That isnt normal for systems in that sort of spec range. Its not RAM slowness either, I have systems running DDR1 and single core CPUs that run faster than that.

Your sig is wrong, its its a AMD Athlon X2 '3800+' it doesnt run at 3.8GHz, its probably running at 2.0GHz. The 'XXXX+' number used for athlon/athlon64/athlon64 X2 CPUs is a PR (performance rating) meant to be compared to P4/Celeron GHz numbers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
Grrr, the diagnostic tools from Western Digital are only available only for Windows, and Win can't see my HDD because it's entirely ext4.
Any chance I could test it with a Linux tool?
Nope, there are also DOS tools (including "Data Lifeguard Diagnostic for DOS (CD)" with you can burn to CD, boot from the CD then test HDDs from the booted CD).

I cant recall if Data Lifeguard can read non-windows partitions, but even if it cant it can still get some information, like the SMART status.

BTW, are you trying to test your WDC WD10EARS HDD? If you are running / or have /home on the WD Green EARS drive, that could be part or even all of the problem. The EARS drives are 'advanced format' HDDs, which means they use 4k sectors...that report as 512b sectors to the OS.

If the partitions arent 'aligned' then read and write preformance goes from 'pretty good' to 'OMG this thing is slow...'.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
I've thought of that too, and I did remove a quantity of dust from the cooler fan. I may not have gotten to what actually makes th CPU heat up though. There is a cube of long fins/lamellas sitting on top of it (like the ones in the attachment), and they're so long I couldn't get only halfway down with my brush, so there may be still some dust left in there right on top of the CPU. I tried to remove the lamella cube, but it seems to soldered on there, or else, I wasn't able to unhinge it. is it supposed to come off? Could it be the residual dust in there is slowing me down?
Small amounts of dust wont have much heating effect. If heat is part of the problem, its likely your thermal paste has dried out. When the paste dries out, it loses most of its thermal conductivity, and will cause the CPU to run hotter.

Neat trick for those that cant/wont remove the heatsink for whatever reason- pipe cleaners, wetted with a bit of metho or isopropyl alcohol. Gets right down between the heatsink fins easily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by caravel View Post
I suspect that as it's an Athlon64 X2, "cool n quiet" is down-clocking the CPU... probably due to heat build up.
It is being downclocked to 800MHz/1GHz if under low loads....even then the system should respond much faster than the OP is reporting.
 
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Old 08-25-2012, 09:36 AM   #23
bennypr0fane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascade9 View Post
I'd start with a memory test, and move on to a HDD test.
Memory test, like in the Memtest available in most GRUB boot menus?

Quote:
Your sig is wrong, its its a AMD Athlon X2 '3800+' it doesnt run at 3.8GHz, its probably running at 2.0GHz. The 'XXXX+' number used for athlon/athlon64/athlon64 X2 CPUs is a PR (performance rating) meant to be compared to P4/Celeron GHz numbers.
I've always known there's something wrong with that figure - Windows Control Panel even reports the CPU to clock at 4600MHz!
But the accurate number isn't listed anywhere, so I've been giving the one printed on my PC's front panel...

Quote:
Nope, there are also DOS tools (including "Data Lifeguard Diagnostic for DOS (CD)" with you can burn to CD, boot from the CD then test HDDs from the booted CD).

I cant recall if Data Lifeguard can read non-windows partitions, but even if it cant it can still get some information, like the SMART status.
Data Lifeguard is the tool that WD offer for download in their support section, and that I can't get to boot - it says I need a older version (doesn't say which one), not publicly available for download, and I should contact support to get it (see my earlier post....)

Quote:
BTW, are you trying to test your WDC WD10EARS HDD? If you are running / or have /home on the WD Green EARS drive, that could be part or even all of the problem. The EARS drives are 'advanced format' HDDs, which means they use 4k sectors...that report as 512b sectors to the OS.

If the partitions arent 'aligned' then read and write preformance goes from 'pretty good' to 'OMG this thing is slow...'.
YES, exactly. I think the slowness in WinXP may come from its HDD being just old, but the other HDD is new and it's the WDC WD10EARS with all my slowed-down Linuxes on it. What does "aligned" partitions mean, and please how can I align them?

Quote:
Neat trick for those that cant/wont remove the heatsink for whatever reason- pipe cleaners, wetted with a bit of metho or isopropyl alcohol. Gets right down between the heatsink fins easily.
Is it possible there is dust between the heatsink and the CPU?

Last edited by bennypr0fane; 08-25-2012 at 10:32 AM.
 
Old 08-26-2012, 04:18 AM   #24
cascade9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
Memory test, like in the Memtest available in most GRUB boot menus?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
I've always known there's something wrong with that figure - Windows Control Panel even reports the CPU to clock at 4600MHz!
But the accurate number isn't listed anywhere, so I've been giving the one printed on my PC's front panel...
Does your system really have a '3.8GHz' sticker on the panel? That would be a 1st for me, all the Athlon X2s I've seen list the PR rating number 'XXXX+' (3800+ in your case).

Easier and more accurate to list the PR number rating, listing pure MHz/GHz doesnt mean much, there are other X2 CPUs with the same MHz but faster PR ratings (eg, 4000+, also 2GHz but with 2 x 1024k cache, not 2 x 512k cache on the 3800+).

Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
YES, exactly. I think the slowness in WinXP may come from its HDD being just old, but the other HDD is new and it's the WDC WD10EARS with all my slowed-down Linuxes on it. What does "aligned" partitions mean, and please how can I align them?
Some background on 4k sector drives-

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2888

Eeerrr......I dont know how you would align the partitions on a already setup drive with linux, I've always got the partitions aligned during setup myself. Sorry.

There are tools to algin the partitions on a setup drive with windows, but those wont work with linux filesystems (or at least they didnt when I checked a while ago).

Depending on how you partitioned the drive and what partitioning tool and version you used, its possible that your partitions are aligned.

Bit more info and possibly some hints here-

http://linuxconfig.org/linux-wd-ears-advanced-format

https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Advanced_Format


Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
Is it possible there is dust between the heatsink and the CPU?
Not unless its been there since installation.
 
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Old 08-26-2012, 06:34 PM   #25
bennypr0fane
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I'm not sure how this is helping me, maybe you could explain a bit more what you want me to do with it?
I'll just try to post the output from your code:

Quote:
Originally Posted by unSpawn View Post
Code:
]$ curl -s "http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=GYgwY4sb"|grep -i powernow
[    0.000000] ACPI: SSDT 000000007bef9680 0020C (v01 PTLTD  POWERNOW 00000001  LTP 00000001)
[   18.257127] powernow-k8: Found 1 AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4600+ (2 cpu cores) (version 2.20.00)
[   18.257178] powernow-k8: fid 0x10 (2400 MHz), vid 0x8
[   18.257180] powernow-k8: fid 0xe (2200 MHz), vid 0xa
[   18.257182] powernow-k8: fid 0xc (2000 MHz), vid 0xc
[   18.257184] powernow-k8: fid 0xa (1800 MHz), vid 0xe
[   18.257186] powernow-k8: fid 0x2 (1000 MHz), vid 0x12
# 'lsmod|grep powernow' should return something like:
# powernow_k8 13360 1
# mperf 1275 1 powernow_k8
# processor 26144 1 powernow_k8
looks like it, I get:

Code:
~ $ lsmod|grep powernow
powernow_k8            17574  1 
mperf                  12453  1 powernow_k8
processor              28059  1 powernow_k8

Quote:
# also 'cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/{scaling_available_frequencies,scaling_setspeed}' /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor
I'm not sure what to do with this, could you explain?


Quote:
# and 'grep '^cpu.MHz' /proc/cpuinfo'
Code:
~ $ grep '^cpu.MHz' /proc/cpuinfo
cpu MHz		: 1000.000
cpu MHz		: 1000.000
Thanks, Ben

Last edited by bennypr0fane; 08-26-2012 at 08:04 PM.
 
Old 08-26-2012, 06:43 PM   #26
bennypr0fane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascade9 View Post
Does your system really have a '3.8GHz' sticker on the panel? That would be a 1st for me, all the Athlon X2s I've seen list the PR rating number 'XXXX+' (3800+ in your case).
The sticker says 3800+, I just thought that meant 3,8 GHz. Never heard about performance ratings before...


Quote:
Eeerrr......I dont know how you would align the partitions on a already setup drive with linux, I've always got the partitions aligned during setup myself. Sorry.

There are tools to algin the partitions on a setup drive with windows, but those wont work with linux filesystems (or at least they didnt when I checked a while ago).

Depending on how you partitioned the drive and what partitioning tool and version you used, its possible that your partitions are aligned.
I used GParted to setup the HDD, on during setup I used the option "align with cylinder", if that's the kind of alignment you're talking about...?

Code:
~ $ sudo blkid
/dev/sda1: LABEL="PQSERVICE" UUID="16D9-B5D2" TYPE="vfat" 
/dev/sda2: LABEL="ACER" UUID="80B077A7B077A1F8" TYPE="ntfs" 
/dev/sda3: LABEL="ACERDATA" UUID="4850-BCF8" TYPE="vfat" 
/dev/sdb1: LABEL="Bodhi" UUID="4fab35f8-aa95-4c82-9cc3-0a1effe38e64" TYPE="ext4" 
/dev/sdb2: LABEL="Linuxdata" UUID="6d83d2e3-b710-43d9-a2d7-11d67f7661b1" TYPE="ext4" 
/dev/sdb5: LABEL="LinuxOS3" UUID="61a9b8c4-1f85-4b32-9e8b-3d863a87bf16" TYPE="ext4" 
/dev/sdb6: LABEL="SWAP" UUID="2345bc31-8d1d-4e91-9bcd-286159f7a844" TYPE="swap" 
/dev/sdb3: UUID="11be46de-739e-460b-92cd-80bcbb2dbf89" TYPE="ext4"
Code:
~ $ sudo fdisk -lu /dev/sdb

Disk /dev/sdb: 1000.2 GB, 1000204886016 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 121601 cylinders, total 1953525168 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x0002b063

   Device Boot      Start         End      Blocks   Id  System
/dev/sdb1              63    62910539    31455238+  83  Linux
/dev/sdb2        62910540  1740626684   838858072+  83  Linux
/dev/sdb3      1740626685  1803537224    31455270   83  Linux
/dev/sdb4      1803537286  1879026659    37744687    5  Extended
/dev/sdb5      1803537288  1866447764    31455238+  83  Linux
/dev/sdb6      1866447828  1879026659     6289416   82  Linux swap / Solaris
---Maybe important info, it only occurred to me now to check other OS on the same HDD (/dev/sdb): Bodhi Linux (Enlightenment desktop, ultra light distro, on sdb1) seems to run normally!
- or if it is slowed down in any way, it's certainly not in the same class of slowness as Linux Mint, i.e. barely noticeable delays, if any!
I don't know if that says something about a possible partitioning problem, or it is the OS after all...?

WinXP on the /dev/sda HDD is also not the same kind of slow: the UI reacts normally, light applications load fast - it's just Windows-on-an-old-HDD slow.

In Linux Mint (on sdb3) I can watch windows being rendered, and wait for reactions to almost every click...

Last edited by bennypr0fane; 08-26-2012 at 08:08 PM.
 
Old 08-26-2012, 07:45 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unSpawn View Post
I found Geekbench but I can't recommend it as I've never used it. If you decide against using it check your distributions repo's, Sourceforge.net, Freecode.com (formerly known as Freshmeat), Savannah.nongnu.org or Berlioz.
So I installed Bonnie++, it was recommended to me in the #hardware IRC-channel on freenode, but it's command line. Will this help me find out what I need to know?
I don't know which tests I should run, and how to handle these arguments. Could someone help me put together the right commands?
Code:
bonnie++ [-d scratch-dir] [-c concurrency] [-s size(MiB)[:chunk-size(b)]]
      [-n number-to-stat[:max-size[:min-size][:num-directories[:chunk-size]]]]
      [-m machine-name] [-r ram-size-in-MiB]
      [-x number-of-tests] [-u uid-to-use:gid-to-use] [-g gid-to-use]
      [-q] [-f] [-b] [-p processes | -y] [-z seed | -Z random-file]
      [-D]
 
Old 08-27-2012, 02:20 AM   #28
TobiSGD
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As I can see from your fdisk output (the first partition starts with sector 63) your partitions are not aligned. This partition layout was either created with Windows XP or with an older version of fdisk/GParted. Newer Windows and fdisk/GParted versions create partitions in a way that the first partition starts at sector 2048 to keep it aligned with the 4kb sectors.
Seems to me that you have to re-partition and reinstall your Linux systems on the second disk.
 
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Old 08-27-2012, 06:33 AM   #29
bennypr0fane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobiSGD View Post
As I can see from your fdisk output (the first partition starts with sector 63) your partitions are not aligned. This partition layout was either created with Windows XP or with an older version of fdisk/GParted. Newer Windows and fdisk/GParted versions create partitions in a way that the first partition starts at sector 2048 to keep it aligned with the 4kb sectors.
Seems to me that you have to re-partition and reinstall your Linux systems on the second disk.
Ok, I was afraid that would be it...
That's a pretty drastic measure though - so, if I use the latest version of GParted for this, will it align the partitions automatically, or will have to make sure by adjusting the settings?

Anything else I might try before I go ahead and redo everything from scratch?
How would you explain the other OS not suffering from this issue, if the whole HDD was partitioned this way?
 
Old 08-28-2012, 07:59 AM   #30
unSpawn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
I'm not sure how this is helping me, maybe you could explain a bit more what you want me to do with it?
I only posted those commands so you could verify "cool n quiet" settings.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
I'm not sure what to do with this, could you explain?
Code:
# also 'cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/{scaling_available_frequencies,scaling_setspeed}' /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor
Sorry, should expand as
Code:
cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_available_frequencies
cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_available_frequencies/scaling_setspeed
cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_governor
if that's easier to read slash execute for you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post
So I installed Bonnie++ (..). Will this help me find out what I need to know?
I doubt it. Geekbench being more of a general purpose benchmark would allow you to check yours against comparable HW. I only suggested benchmarking because sometimes there is a difference between what users think they experience and what the HW is capable of. It may (or may not) help point to things but it's not meant to replace proper diagnosis of the problem. That said your observation, being able to watch windows being rendered in Linux Mint vs relative snappiness of Bodhi Linux, is interesting as both are based on Ubuntu and both (if you have the most recent version) run a 3.2 kernel and an I/O bottleneck like partition misalignment causes should indeed affect both.
 
  


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