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Poll: Do you think ubuntu is the most recommmended linux distro ?
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Do you think ubuntu is the most recommmended linux distro ?

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Old 07-04-2011, 09:43 PM   #46
snowpine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dEnDrOn View Post
that is the whole issue here,
why was ubuntu your first distro ?
I was interested in the ASUS EEE PC (but could not afford one). I knew it used a version of the Linux OS called Xandros, but that Xandros was not available to the general public. So I did a quick Google search for "best desktop linux distro" (or similar) and discovered Ubuntu.

I used lightweight variants of Ubuntu from 7.10 to 9.04 until my favorite (CrunchBang) made the leap from Ubuntu to Debian.

Of course I have experimented with a lot of other distros too...
 
Old 07-05-2011, 12:04 AM   #47
dEnDrOn
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Wink

Quote:
Originally Posted by snowpine View Post
I did a quick Google search for "best desktop linux distro" (or similar) and discovered Ubuntu.
everyone search the same way one day or other and ends up mostly with ubuntu...
that is the real thing that made me ask this question...^_^
 
Old 07-05-2011, 05:57 AM   #48
brianL
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If you look at any how-to-do-whatever article in any Linux magazine (online or paper), it will most likely concentrate on Ubuntu, as if there were no other distros. I've nothing against Ubuntu (the LTS versions, anyway), but it's not for me.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 06:13 AM   #49
TobiSGD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianL View Post
If you look at any how-to-do-whatever article in any Linux magazine (online or paper), it will most likely concentrate on Ubuntu, as if there were no other distros. I've nothing against Ubuntu (the LTS versions, anyway), but it's not for me.
Yeah, even if they say the how-to would be for all Debian based system they use sudo as if it were a standard in all Debian based systems, not knowing that it is not configured (sometimes not even installed) on most of them.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 06:39 AM   #50
screwbottle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobiSGD View Post
Yeah, even if they say the how-to would be for all Debian based system they use sudo as if it were a standard in all Debian based systems, not knowing that it is not configured (sometimes not even installed) on most of them.
Hi TobiSGD

Mint, Mepis (these first two from reading about their features in readme's), Ubuntu and native Debian all have "sudo" and "sudo su" configured and usable as default. In fact you can even activate the locked out superuser account, although again not to be done for general users.

I looked at your recommended distros, especially Mepis as I have never actually used it. Mint recommended to new or crossing over users would have a problem as it uses GNOME 2 which has been deprecated and shortly no further support. So Mint is going to be forced to upgrade to GNOME 3 (with or without Unity, they are not saying) or change to KDE 4 (this will serve as a better desktop for Windows users as GNOME is more Apple O/S in similarity). Mepis are using KDE 4.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 06:42 AM   #51
TobiSGD
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I have used Debian for a long time and can assure you that it has not sudo configured by default and has by default no locked out root. Same is true for many other Debian (not Ubuntu) based distributions.
By the way, there is already a KDE version of Mint.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 07:04 AM   #52
cascade9
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Just in addition to the other reasons listed here as to why ubuntu is so visible-

The 6 month cycle- It had various reasons, including gnome (ubuntu releases were synced with gnome releases) and keeps ubuntu on the techie blogs. When its a slow week and microsoft, apple and google havent done anything interesting, then out comes the 'we try/rate/review ubuntu' stories.

Gnome- I know I saw more than one forum post a few years back which was basicly 'if you love gnome, you will be using ubuntu'. I think I may even have seen the same idea with more words on a few tech sites as well.

Cult of personalilty- Some people seem to think that Mr. Shuttleworth has a halo.

PR- I think I've seen 'bug #1' used as an excuse for all sorts of stupid bugs and mistakes.

Dont forget, that what can attract users to ubuntu can also be what drives then away. Example? See the latest release, 11.04. Its got the 270.41.06 drivers-

http://packages.ubuntu.com/natty/nvidia-current

Which would be nice, but the drivers only came out 8 days before the final release. Not enough time for testing IMO.

Ubuntu also tends to get the newest version of xorg possible. That is one reason why the nVidia 96.XX drivers break every release or 2 now......

Quote:
Originally Posted by dEnDrOn View Post
Is it because of their simplicity or because of their user friendliness or is it because they ship free CDs...??
They wont ship free CDs anymore-

Quote:
our ShipIt programme has finally run its course. While we can no longer deliver free CDs through the programme, it’s still easy to get Ubuntu.
http://www.ubuntu.com/shipit

Well, to be honest I do recall somebody saying that there was some way to still get freeCDs from shipit, but I forget the details of how to do that. If it was even true, I dont know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
Mint, Mepis (these first two from reading about their features in readme's), Ubuntu and native Debian all have "sudo" and "sudo su" configured and usable as default. In fact you can even activate the locked out superuser account, although again not to be done for general users.
Mepis, not sure, its been a while since I used mepis. Ubuntu and mint, yes, 'sudo' is configured and usable as default. Debian...well, sort of, but not exactly-

Quote:
As of DebianSqueeze, if you ask for the Desktop task during the installation, that pulls in sudo with a default configuration that automatically grants sudo-ing rights to any member of the sudo group. Depending on what user accounts you set up during the install, it's still possible that you may not have been added to that group - you can check by running groups.
http://wiki.debian.org/sudo

su is NOT 'locked out' with debian at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
I looked at your recommended distros, especially Mepis as I have never actually used it. Mint recommended to new or crossing over users would have a problem as it uses GNOME 2 which has been deprecated and shortly no further support. So Mint is going to be forced to upgrade to GNOME 3 (with or without Unity, they are not saying) or change to KDE 4 (this will serve as a better desktop for Windows users as GNOME is more Apple O/S in similarity). Mepis are using KDE 4.
I wouldnt jump the gun. Gnome might be dropping support for gnome 2.X, but thaqt doesnt mean that mint will be forced to gnome 3.X.

They could always just wait a bit, if there isnt a community fork of gnome 2.X I'll be very suprised. Or they could just flick gnome totally.

Last edited by cascade9; 07-05-2011 at 07:12 AM.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 07:40 AM   #53
dEnDrOn
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Cool

first linux distro that i saw was ubuntu,'boz i got the free CD....
Obvoiusly now my CD requested(they said that it is due to too much demand,they give CD's now to only first time orderers) was rejected but i get kubuntu CDs regularly ....
But i never used ubuntu too much and finally landed on fedora !

Last edited by dEnDrOn; 07-05-2011 at 07:41 AM.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 08:14 AM   #54
screwbottle
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[QUOTE=cascade9;4405508
Cult of personalilty- Some people seem to think that Mr. Shuttleworth has a halo.

Dont forget, that what can attract users to ubuntu can also be what drives then away. Example? See the latest release, 11.04. Its got the 270.41.06 drivers-

Mepis, not sure, its been a while since I used mepis. Ubuntu and mint, yes, 'sudo' is configured and usable as default. Debian...well, sort of, but not exactly-

su is NOT 'locked out' with debian at all.
[/QUOTE]

Hi Cascade9

Nice points you make.

Ummm to correct both you and TobiSGD on what I am referring to in Debian, I'm not referring to 'su' as the superuser access, I'm referring to the actual root (Administrator) account that is disabled by default on an install, the "sudo pass?? etc etc" command to enable it. This is what I am referring to that is disabled in Debian systems. Of the distros I've used and are familiar with, OpenSuSE creates both a root account and a user account, with the root acount having a big red and bold splash screen to advise users of where they are and what they are doing.

I personally don't believe Mark has a halo, but he has made and sold a program earning himself in excess of $500Mil. after American taxes, and become one of South Africa's richest people. He along with his famiy and brother also do good community services here locally S.A. (he now residing in the Isle of Mann and his co. Canonical), the Shuttleworth foundation, so this is something worthwhile, maybe the rest of the world does not know this side of him. He's just a man but I believe has his heart in the right place.

Fortunately (and unfortunately) I use ATI/AMD video, so not familiar with the issues around nVidia. I also cannot figure it out yet whether it's from Debian, the kernel or Catalyst drivers, but I cannot get the frequency above 60HZ. I use three 21" Dell P1130 Pro CRT monitors and for the last couple of distro releases my CRT's only display at 60HZ, from the previous 100HZ at 1280x1024. I've tried everything from web advice to my own knowledgebase of editing the xorg.conf, but cannot display above 60Hz.

Regards

Last edited by screwbottle; 07-05-2011 at 08:22 AM.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 08:23 AM   #55
TobiSGD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
Hi Cascade9

Nice points you make.

Ummm to correct both you and TobiSGD on what I am referring to in Debian, I'm not referring to 'su' as the superuser access, I'm referring to the actual root (Administrator) account that is disabled by default on an install, the "sudo pass?? etc etc" command to enable it. This is what I am referring to that is disabled in Debian systems.
If I read that I have to ask if you ever have installed Debian? On a normal install you are asked for a password for root, so disabling root after that does not make much sense. I have never had the need to enable the root account on any of my Debian systems because it is activated by default. Most people in the Debian community (there where very long discussions of that topic on the Debian forums) think that sudo should be used for what is was invented, and that is not the "Enable the user to do all administrative tasks"-thing.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 08:57 AM   #56
cascade9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
Ummm to correct both you and TobiSGD on what I am referring to in Debian, I'm not referring to 'su' as the superuser access, I'm referring to the actual root (Administrator) account that is disabled by default on an install, the "sudo pass?? etc etc" command to enable it. This is what I am referring to that is disabled in Debian systems. Of the distros I've used and are familiar with, OpenSuSE creates both a root account and a user account, with the root acount having a big red and bold splash screen to advise users of where they are and what they are doing.
:S

root is NOT disabled by default on debian-

Quote:
At installation time, you are asked whether you want to use the root account or not.

*If you want to (the default), you'll be asked to provide a complex password for root. Use a strong one!
http://wiki.debian.org/Root

Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
I personally don't believe Mark has a halo, but he has made and sold a program earning himself in excess of $500Mil. after American taxes, and become one of South Africa's richest people. He along with his famiy and brother also do good community services here locally S.A. (he now residing in the Isle of Mann and his co. Canonical), the Shuttleworth foundation, so this is something worthwhile, maybe the rest of the world does not know this side of him. He's just a man but I believe has his heart in the right place.
I'm not overly fond of the shuttleworth foundation, in part for the same reason as canonical- basing an international company in a tax haven with virtually zero transparency laws isnt something I like at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
Fortunately (and unfortunately) I use ATI/AMD video, so not familiar with the issues around nVidia. I also cannot figure it out yet whether it's from Debian, the kernel or Catalyst drivers, but I cannot get the frequency above 60HZ. I use three 21" Dell P1130 Pro CRT monitors and for the last couple of distro releases my CRT's only display at 60HZ, from the previous 100HZ at 1280x1024. I've tried everything from web advice to my own knowledgebase of editing the xorg.conf, but cannot display above 60Hz.
I saw a post from you about that, and when I saw it I didnt have the time to properly reply so I just left it. That could be caused by a few things, but I'm sure that with a bit of xorg.conf hacking, you should be able to get at least 85Hz. But I havent used catalyst with newer versions of debian, and I've never been a big user of multi-monitor setups, and the only ATI card I own (9600XT) lost support ages ago.

BTW, the nVidia drivers dont impact on ATI/AMD GPUs at all, but xorg-server does. Ubuntu was one of the 1st distros to lose catalyst support on the 'dropped' cards, due to the general 'use the newest xorg version' policy.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 08:58 AM   #57
screwbottle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobiSGD View Post
If I read that I have to ask if you ever have installed Debian? On a normal install you are asked for a password for root, so disabling root after that does not make much sense. I have never had the need to enable the root account on any of my Debian systems because it is activated by default. Most people in the Debian community (there where very long discussions of that topic on the Debian forums) think that sudo should be used for what is was invented, and that is not the "Enable the user to do all administrative tasks"-thing.
Yes but that is the password to use for su and sudo function, and it is not the true root account password. The root account is disabled by default. Of course there is no real reason to enable the root account, but one can do it by issuing two commands, first to give root it's own password "sudo passwrd root" and then unlocking the root account "sudo passwrd -u root". So with all respect I do know Debian and have installed and used it.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 09:11 AM   #58
cascade9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
Yes but that is the password to use for su and sudo function, and it is not the true root account password. The root account is disabled by default. Of course there is no real reason to enable the root account, but one can do it by issuing two commands, first to give root it's own password "sudo passwrd root" and then unlocking the root account "sudo passwrd -u root". So with all respect I do know Debian and have installed and used it.
Sorry, but thats not what other debian users are reporting, thats not what the debian wiki says, and its just plain wrong.

Ubuntus settings are NOT debians settings. Ubuntu does disable su/root, debian doesnt.

If you look back at my posts on the subject I've given you links to the debian pages on su/root and sudo.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 09:30 AM   #59
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Oh yes. First distro question. Well to be honest Red Hat was first distro i actually used - in school. Then first distro on my PC was Ubuntu(forgot version) because classmate had free Ubuntu CD from Shipit and at that time it didn't matter which one to use.
Quote:
Originally Posted by screwbottle View Post
{...}The root account is disabled by default. Of course there is no real reason to enable the root account, but one can do it by issuing two commands, first to give root it's own password "sudo passwrd root" and then unlocking the root account "sudo passwrd -u root". So with all respect I do know Debian and have installed and used it.
Sorry not true for Debian. Proof is here - image from Debian 6 installation and btw i used Debian 6 some small time ago so it's false statement. This leads to think either you are outdated(in case Debian had root disabled in past) or not telling truth..also lot of other distros make warning screen when login in as root aswell.

Last edited by Arcane; 07-05-2011 at 09:35 AM.
 
Old 07-05-2011, 06:56 PM   #60
jefro
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I actually used the mks toolkit as my first linux. Of couse that was back when all we had was dos. They had converted a bunch of posix commands to dos exe and com files.

http://www.mkssoftware.com/products/

I hate to say it but a lot of newbies tend to suggest it a lot. I think there are better ways to select a distro.
 
  


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