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Old 02-09-2007, 02:08 AM   #16
Junior Hacker
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I pulled a groin or something a week and a half ago cutting/loading firewood, for the first time this morning I did not feel it as if it was cured, not after I wrote that though, I'm in pain again. I feel as though I literally split a gut.
 
Old 02-09-2007, 06:18 PM   #17
Sintu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sintu
So what would be the best way to ask for the info? "Have you guys done an IT audit recently, and could I get a copy of it?"
Answer please?

And, uh, back on topic please Junior Hacker? Thanks.
 
Old 02-09-2007, 06:31 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sintu
So, while sitting on the toilet about a half hour ago, I started s
Oh!
My apologies, yeah, let's stick to the topic.
 
Old 02-10-2007, 10:52 PM   #19
fotoguy
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One of the things that also needs to be taken into account are the users of the new system, while I think it's a great idea to go to open-source, new software means you need to retrain users. There may be a resistance to change, there is enough stress with education already on the students and teachers that a complete change may add fuel to the fire.
 
Old 02-10-2007, 11:13 PM   #20
farslayer
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Well along with training people often forget that changing from one version of windows to another version of windows. or one version of MS Office to another also requires re-training.. They can't seem to leave things alone when they change versions. They can't leave the file formats alone either and you end up training users how to save their documents in the old formats so other users that are still onthe older versions can open them.

So I honestly think the whole retraining thing is blown out of proportion. You have that if you switch to Open Source or if you switch to new versions of MS products.. People just tend to get a bit funnier over a switch from MS Office to Open Office than f they switch from Office 97 to Office XP. but either weay there are a lot of differences in the menus etc..

Training does have to be considered, but for some reason people tend to forget the same issues when switching from one MS product to another MS product.
 
Old 02-10-2007, 11:26 PM   #21
frob23
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I work in a school and I have to admit the transition would be brutal for the schools. Getting it started would be near impossible... as quagmire and waste are the daily norm for most school IT departments. And the pain involved in getting all the Exchange stuff alone brought over would be a task worthy of a whole summer worth of overtime. Then you have contracts, hired IT workers who are absolutely worthless for their day to day tasks... and moreso for *nix.

Toss in about 1000 employees (give or take... based on the size of the district or school) and throw in "No Child Left Behind" and all the garbage associated with that... to keep the stress levels up. And then, finally, add a pinch of "weird peripherals" that you don't see anywhere but education and especially special education (accessible devices usually) for good measure and you've got a full on melt-down.

Of course, going slowly would alleviate a lot of this. But not all. Some of these teachers still haven't recovered from forced integration (yes it's a southern school) ... so I don't expect them to handle a switch to Linux well.
 
Old 02-11-2007, 12:21 AM   #22
Junior Hacker
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See, were all probably just runnin' at the mouth for nothing here, one thing I mentioned in a prior post is that "What kind of school is this?" "How many computers?" would give people a better grasp at what is required. For someone asking for help, there sure seems to ba a lack of information and participation.
 
Old 02-11-2007, 03:19 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior Hacker
For someone asking for help, there sure seems to ba a lack of information and participation.

No I don't think there is a lack on information or participation, everyone here has different levels of experience and skills and are offering advice as they see the relevance.

Regardless of the type of educational institute or the number of computers, there are still alot of things that need to be considered. Most educational institute or government departments like to see paperwork, be for any idea is to be looked at seriously they will want to see a feasibility report/study.

Since there is a lot of key stakeholders who need to be informed about such an idea, paperwork makes it much easier for eveyone involved to given the same information. Like most things it will come down to who pays the bills will have the final say.

While I think it would be a great idea to move all to linux, others who have to pay for it may not, unless they have something tangable that tells them otherwise.
 
Old 02-11-2007, 06:16 AM   #24
Xeratul
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Talk about Debian:

http://www.debian.org/social_contract
http://www.debian.org/users/

Nothg better than debian for that
 
Old 02-11-2007, 02:52 PM   #25
Sintu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junior Hacker
See, were all probably just runnin' at the mouth for nothing here, one thing I mentioned in a prior post is that "What kind of school is this?" "How many computers?" would give people a better grasp at what is required. For someone asking for help, there sure seems to ba a lack of information and participation.
If I knew I'd tell you, and as I mentioned in previous post, I don't know how to ask for the information. In fact, I think I've asked about how to ask for the info twice. Oh, and it IS Sunday, and where I live, we don't have school on the weekends, so I can't skip class to go count computers.

Anyway, perhaps a total conversion isn't realistic, but I can at least get them using Open Office over MS Office. Or to put Linux on some workstations instead of "upgrading" to Vista.
 
Old 02-11-2007, 03:50 PM   #26
farslayer
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The goal is information.. Getting the right information into the right hands.

You don't want to appear like some sort of anti-Microsoft zealot when you talk to the people at school. you truly can't go in expecting a total conversion from the start. you need to do like the rest of us and integrate Linux into the environment a little at a time. Once the value is seen they can make decisions from there.. Get them to try it, start small like with a teacher in the computer lab. get them hooked and they will help spread the word.. That's why I suggested starting a LUG, to build a Linux community at the school.

as for Junior I dunno what his issue is, his posts in this thread have been far from constructive.. seems like a "the glass is half empty" sort of fellow. Don't be discouraged by him, move forward as you've been thinking, continue to ask questions and gather information. Draw on support from those around you that are willing to offer help.

Last edited by farslayer; 02-12-2007 at 11:01 PM.
 
Old 02-11-2007, 11:49 PM   #27
Junior Hacker
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There may be a little sense of negativity coming from this view point by others here, but I try not to have a narrow minded approach to any life situation. And I am not one to push someone into a large undertaking without looking at all the angles. There have been allot of angles presented here that should all be considered, but I won't candy coat the reality.
As for the It Audit:
Let me explain how I see it from a business prospective. If an individual wanted to open a Macdonald's restaurant (example we can all relate to), in a small community, the franchise would want to make sure the name is well represented and protected. The
franchise will most likely want to do a "market evaluation" before granting someone a part of the franchise to make sure the business would prosper in an effort to protect the name etc. A market evaluation, has allot of important information regarding average household income, average draw in the market (rural and surrounding communities that shop in that market), how many millionaires in the area, etc. etc. A market evaluation is something very few people see because of the oath to confidentiality before you are allowed to see it, in other words, if the franchise hears someone not involved with the evaluation talking about what is in it, the individual whom the audit was compiled for can be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. Because the information in there can help other businesses that want to break into the market, allot of the information is not for the general public's ears, and that evaluation cost big bucks to put it together, so it is not something that gets shared.
An It audit is similar to a market evaluation for a large school, large schools do work together on certain fronts, but are in competition against each other for notoriety, standings, appearance. Because the better the school's name, the easier it is to get sizeable government grants, the easier it is to attract public offerings (private money). There is some confidentiality involved with It audits also, schools may share such information with other schools in the division, but not with the competition.
My point is simple.
Asking to see an It Audit is probably asking a little too much because of the level of confidentiality is involved.
Why do I think knowing what kind of school this is,is important?
A small country grade school has different needs, budget, income, and infrastructure compared to a large regional grade school, or a University/post graduate secondary schools, or a specialized school catering to more specialized needs. Just mentioning one of these with an estimated student population is a great amount of useful information, you don't need to actually count the amount of servers and client systems.
And as I said, I won't sugar coat the dream/thought, I don't think sending an individual to the front lines without knowing what can be waiting there for them constitutes "good guidance". The more you know about the stumbling blocks that may lay ahead, the easier it is to plan ahead to overcome them and follow through with your dream to the end. There's nothing worst than putting allot of effort into a dream only to end up getting squashed because of poor planning, such events have life altering consequences. Look at as many angles as possible, use the executive approach. Prepare.
 
  


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