New to Linux probs...
 

I've only been using Linux (Mandrake 9.0) for a couple of days, so obviously I have a few little questions! (I have a bigger one but that'll go in a seperate posting).

First of all, in the 'menu editor', when adding shortcuts to programs, what does the "open in a terminal"? option mean. I notice that the pre-installed apps such as OpenOffice.org have this set by default, but why would I want it to run in a terminal?

Seondly, and I realise this will probably be specific to me:
Why are all the 3d games so slow? I have a 1.6Gb Athlon and 768 Mb RAM, GForce2 and I can't even play TuxRacer or the Ping-pong game! It just jitters. Mandrake Control Centre lists my 3d card correctly.

And lastly a really silly one:
Is there a way to move the whole desktop, other than using the buttons on my monitor? This may seem like a silly question, but I dual boot WinXP and Linux and in Linux the screen is off to the right of the monitor and I can't see the 'X's to close windows for example. In WinXP it is fine so I don't want to have to change the monitor's settings.

I realise these are all diverse and probably stupid questions, but I thought I'd ask anyway.

p.s. Other than these minor problems, I am enjoying learning about Linux.

You need to install the NVidia drivers, there are about a million posts around here for how to do that, have a little search.

Ok your new so I'll be nice..read this post and pay attention to the big post by membrax:
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...threadid=41180

I don't know if this will work for you, but back when I was dual booting I just changed the settings using the monitor controls, and each OS remembered them correctly. Maybe voodoo, maybe dumb luck, maybe it will work for you...

Welcome to Linux...

set your xfree86 to use the same refresh rate as windows
is using.

also if you run a program in a terminal, you can watch
the error messages easy, or just the messages.

Re: New to Linux probs...
 

If there's something wrong with a program and you want to see the messages, or if it doesn't fire up or even needs some command line options, then you'll want to run it from the terminal.

Quote:

Is there a way to move the whole desktop, other than using the buttons on my monitor?

Have a look at your file

more /etc/X11/XF86Config

These are the settings to get the X server up and running. You need to add a few things here under the "Monitor" section:

DisplaySize 1024 768
HSkew 15

The first is size of your screen in DPI. These are example values! The second is the number of pixels you want to skew the horizontal display. Try some negative and positive values. BUT

Before you tinker with a file, MAKE A BACKUP of it. This is just good practice, so:

cp /etc/X11R6/XF86Config /etc/X11R6/XF86Config.bak

to copy the current one to a backup copy (here I just suffixed it with .bak). Now you can mess with the file it uses to start up. If at any point you're lost,

cp /etc/X11R6/XF86Config.bak /etc/X11R6/XF86Config

will restore things. Have fun!

Bert

Thanks Bert, you've been really helpful. (I think).
I say "I think" because I don't want to try your suggestion yet, as:

A previous post said "set your xfree86 to use the same refresh rate as windows is using" so:
I went to the Mandrake Control Centre thingy and clicked on 'display [something]' then 'options', and it said "I can change it so XFree starts automatically every time" (or something similar). I said "OK!" as it seemed like I couldn't actually get any options until I did and now I can't get a GUI at all when I start my PC. I'm a bit stuck.

p.s. I do find this group extremely helpful.....

Good tip Bert, thanks.

Always learnin' something new...

Well, OK. But that stuff about always making a backup of you XF86Config, well often people forget so the system does it for you. Have a look in your /etc/X11/ directory.

Can you see two files, one called

XF86Config

and another called

XF86Config~

?

If so you're in luck. Do

cp XF86Config~ XF86Config

and your old version should be copied into the current one. Then you can tinker with the current one.

Bert

Right, so what happened was: I was trying to alter display settings so I clicked on options in the display settings bit of Mandrake Control Centre. When I rebooted there was only the command line and no more pretty, clicky KDE.

I have cd'd to the /etc/X11/ directory and copied XF86Config.old over XF86Config. rebooted and it's still only the command line on a black screen. I would like a desktop back, but how?!

Also, why did Bert say XF86Config would be in /etc/X11R6/, but later on say /etc/X11/ ? Is there a difference and what are they for?

Thanks.

I meant the X11 directory.

On the command line, try:

XFree86 -configure

And answer the questions it gives you.

I moved the screen with the buttons for linux & windows is still fine I can see the desltop fine in both OSs. I don't know how to in Mandrake, but in SuSE you can move the screen with SaX2. Probably in the graphics setup.

I ran XFree86 -configure and it didn't ask me any questions, but one of the last lines did say it was using /root/XF86Config.new. So I backed it up, then copied /etc/X11/XF86Config.old over it and rebooted. Still the same, so I replaced it with the original one.

Also, I didn't mention that just before the command prompt comes up, the monitor makes five click-click noises, like it's changing resolution.

I'm about ready to give up and reinstall, but I won't yet. I still want to know why clicking a button in the Mandrake Control Centre has meant I can't use a GUI!

The program XFree86 -configure rewrites the config file, and from what you've posted, you overwrote the new file. RUn XFree86 -configure again and copy it in the /etc/X11 directory:

cp XFree86Config.new XFree86Config

and you should have some sort of GUI.

I did:

log in as root;
XFree86 -configure;
cp XF86Config.new /etc/X11/XF86Config

Still five click-clicks and no GUI.

OK, can you post the output of:

more /etc/X11/XFree86Config

?

We'll get it working at low res, low colours etc. and move up.

t1mcooper:

whats going on here is that some changes have been
make to your xserver config file that your monitor cannot
handle. we're just trying to to find a simpler setting, that
allows your xserver to start. it's a fairly simple thing to do
and bert will probably have it working soon for you.
Don't give up and reinstall. You'll learn a bunch from this.
in linux the xfree server and the window manager
handle what you're thinking of as the gui.
the XF86config is the xserver config and all the other
config stuff you've messed with is stuff for window
managers and login managers and stuff. It will not
get all messed up from us telling you things to try
like windows would with a messed up registry.
the XFree86 -configure
command, creates a XF86config file that it expects
will work, but it will not overwrite your old one by
default, so you will not overwrite a working one by
accident.
In you /etc/X11 directory, there should now be several
XF86config files, all with different extensions. One of
them may be the original one that worked, but renamed
to a different name. maybe you can spot it by how old
it is with
ls -l /etc/X11/
maybe the oldest one is it.
XFree86 will use the config named XF86config unless
you specify for it to use a different one at the command
line when you start it.
if you put an XF86config file in your home directory,
that one will be used instead.

sorry, those should all be XF86Config, not XF86config.
it's case sensitive.

Here's the output Bert (save the *s):

*************************************
Section "ServerLayout"
Identifier "XFree86 Configured"
Screen 0 "Screen0" 0 0
InputDevice "Mouse0" "CorePointer"
InputDevice "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"
EndSection

Section "Files"
RgbPath "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/rgb"
ModulePath "/usr/X11R6/lib/modules"
FontPath "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/misc:unscaled"
FontPath "unix/:-1"
EndSection

Section "Module"
Load "glx"
Load "dbe"
Load "dri"
Load "extmod"
Load "record"
Load "xtrap"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
Identifier "Keyboard0"
Driver "keyboard"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
Identifier "Mouse0"
Driver "mouse"
Option "Protocol" "PS/2"
Option "Device" "/dev/mouse"
EndSection

Section "Monitor"
Identifier "Monitor0"
VendorName "Monitor Vendor"
ModelName "Monitor Model"
EndSection

Section "Device"
### Available Driver options are:-
### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",
### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz"
### [arg]: arg optional
#Option "DigitalVibrance" # <i>
#Option "PageFlip" # [<bool>]
#Option "Dac8Bit" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoLogo" # [<bool>]
#Option "Overlay" # [<bool>]
#Option "UBB" # [<bool>]
#Option "Stereo" # <i>
#Option "WindowFlip" # [<bool>]
#Option "SWcursor" # [<bool>]
#Option "HWcursor" # [<bool>]
#Option "VideoKey" # <i>
#Option "NvAGP" # <i>
#Option "IgnoreEDID" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoDDC" # [<bool>]
#Option "ConnectedMonitor" # <str>
#Option "ConnectedMonitors" # <str>
#Option "TVStandard" # <str>
#Option "TVOutFormat" # <str>
#Option "RenderAccel" # [<bool>]
#Option "CursorShadow" # [<bool>]
#Option "CursorShadowAlpha" # <i>
#Option "CursorShadowXOffset" # <i>
#Option "CursorShadowYOffset" # <i>
#Option "UseEdidFreqs" # [<bool>]
#Option "FlatPanelProperties" # <str>
#Option "TwinView" # [<bool>]
#Option "TwinViewOrientation" # <str>
#Option "SecondMonitorHorizSync" # <str>
#Option "SecondMonitorVertRefresh" # <str>
#Option "MetaModes" # <str>
#Option "UseInt10Module" # [<bool>]
#Option "SwapReady" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoTwinViewXineramaInfo" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoRenderExtension" # [<bool>]
#Option "UseClipIDs" # [<bool>]
#Option "CIOverlay" # [<bool>]
#Option "TransparentIndex" # <i>
#Option "OverlayDefaultVisual" # [<bool>]
#Option "NvEmulate" # <i>
#Option "NoBandWidthTest" # [<bool>]
Identifier "Card0"
Driver "nvidia"
VendorName "NVidia"
BoardName "GeForce2 MX/MX 400"
BusID "PCI:1:0:0"
EndSection

Section "Screen"
Identifier "Screen0"
Device "Card0"
Monitor "Monitor0"
SubSection "Display"
Depth 1
EndSubSection
SubSection "Display"
Depth 4
EndSubSection
SubSection "Display"
Depth 8
EndSubSection
SubSection "Display"
Depth 15
EndSubSection
SubSection "Display"
Depth 16
EndSubSection
SubSection "Display"
Depth 24
EndSubSection
EndSection

**********************************

I felling rather proud of myself, as I piped the output of more to a floppy! (I only learned that yesterday).

And whansard: there's only one XF86Config in /etc/X11/ and that was modified today.

I'm going out soon, so I won't be able to try any suggestions until tomorrow.
You've both been very helpful, it's nice to have things explained so well. And I'm enjoying trying to fix my PC!

Add this to the "Screen" section:

DefaultDepth 24
SubSection "Display"
Depth 24
Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubSection

whansard
set your xfree86 to use the same refresh rate as windows
is using.

Do you mean the VertRefresh and HorizSync ?
What should I set them to?

I never found a way to set the vsync option to off in Xfree.
(I dont no if it's enabled)


And for t1mc00per :
I dont see your Hsync and Vsync under Section Monitor.

This is how my Section Monitor looks like!
Go to the manufactors homepage to find the right HorizSync and VertRefresh for your monitor!


Section "Monitor"
Identifier "Monitor0"
VendorName "Monitor Vendor"
ModelName "Monitor Model"
HorizSync 30.0 - 72.0
VertRefresh 50.0 - 160.0
Option "dpms"
EndSection

Hope this helps!

Paul

Uh, in future there is *no need* to edit the XFree config file manually to move the screen. Most modern monitors can associate screen positioning with the refresh rate they use, just use the monitor controls to reposition the screen and all will be well in both OSs.

If you can't get X back then just reinstall, assuming you haven't made many changes that's the easiest way.

I didn't alter it manually. I just clicked on options in Mandrake Display Control Settings Thingy and it buggered it up somehow.
I'm only manually editing it because I'm following helpful advice.

Anyhow Bert, I tried putting
DefaultDepth 24
SubSection "Display"
Depth 24
Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubSection

after: Section "Screen"

and it still does the same five click-clicks and no GUI.

Shall I give up and reinstall?

Yeah I know, that comment was mostly targetted at others who may give similar advice in future :)

i think i see what the problem is.
xfree will use the highest refresh rate that it can,
and it looks like it is setting the vertical refresh rate
to 160. What you can do is set your monitor under
the monitor section to the highest resolution you
want it to use, with something like maximum
vertical refresh rate of whatever windows is using.
here's part of mine.
Section "Monitor"
Identifier "My Monitor"
HorizSync 31.5 - 57.0
VertRefresh 50-90

with this setting, the xserver is using an 84 vertical
refresh rate, in my case.


edit- I think i replied to the wrong person.

This is true. However, I assumed that t1mc00per has used the buttons on his monitor already, if present. :) It's also highly unusual that Windows gets the offset right and the X server doesn't - the X server needs the XF86Config file and looks for a few other files and attempts a number of modes and resolutions - no magic here just text config files.

OK, 2 options:

1. Find out and the horizontal and vertical refresh rates for your monitor, and add them into the XF86Config file. Retry and persist with the XF86Config file.

2. Say "sod it!" and reinstall (if it's possible, do an 'update' and add something small and unecessary like an extra font) through the installer - it should fix your X server. Please make a backup of the XF86Config - and if it's working again, take a copy of the XF86Config and post it - we'll all learn something we didn't know as it should be different to the one you posted below.

Bert

This may be a bit of a downer after all these posts. But I just had a bloke who knows a bit about unix round and he had a quick look round my pc and decided to copy /etc/X11/XF86Config.new over /etc/X11/XF86Config and upon rebooting I now have KDE back!

Now the question is: do I dare click the options button again? It seems I can't try to set any display options till I do.

Que?

What was this then?

Doesn't matter. What matters is that it works, and it is all good.

Can you just post the XF86Config? Then we can see the difference? Thanks.

Nice one. Your initiation is over. You passed.

:D:D:D

Yep, I see where you're coming from. I think what I did (that didn't work) was run XFree86 -configure which created a new XF86Config in whatever directory I was in when I booted. So I copied that (from the directory I was in when I booted) over /etc/X11/XF86Config.

When I did something that worked I copied XF86Config.new from the /etc/X11/ directory over XF86Config in the /etc/X11/ directory.
Does this make sense? Anyhow it worked, but I do still have problems that I won't bore you with.

One last question for Bert: My attempts at working out your location at 406292E 290755N ended in the conclusion that you live south-east of Sakaka Qarah in the middle of the desert in Saudi Arabia. I'm quite sure this is wrong as you seem to have the (typing) voice of an englishman (maybe canadian) and as I don't own a GPS device or even have the wherewithal to find a 6-digit reference, can you tell me???

Here's my new XF86Config that works:


Section "ServerLayout"
Identifier "XFree86 Configured"
InputDevice "Mouse0" "CorePointer"
InputDevice "Keyboard0" "CoreKeyboard"
Screen 0 "Screen0" 0 0
EndSection

Section "Files"
ModulePath "/usr/X11R6/lib/modules"
RgbPath "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/rgb"
FontPath "/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/misc:unscaled"
FontPath "unix/:-1"
EndSection

Section "Module"
Load "glx"
Load "dbe"
Load "dri"
Load "extmod"
Load "record"
Load "xtrap"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
Identifier "Keyboard0"
Driver "keyboard"
EndSection

Section "InputDevice"
Identifier "Mouse0"
Driver "mouse"
Option "Protocol" "PS/2"
Option "Device" "/dev/mouse"
EndSection

Section "Monitor"
Identifier "Monitor0"
VendorName "Monitor Vendor"
ModelName "Monitor Model"
EndSection

Section "Device"
Identifier "Card0"
VendorName "NVidia"
BoardName "GeForce2 MX/MX 400"
Driver "nvidia"
BusID "PCI:1:0:0"
#Option "CursorShadowYOffset" # <i>
#Option "OverlayDefaultVisual" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoDDC" # [<bool>]
#Option "UBB" # [<bool>]
#Option "MetaModes" # <str>
#Option "VideoKey" # <i>
#Option "FlatPanelProperties" # <str>
#Option "WindowFlip" # [<bool>]
#Option "UseEdidFreqs" # [<bool>]
#Option "RenderAccel" # [<bool>]
#Option "TwinViewOrientation" # <str>
#Option "UseClipIDs" # [<bool>]
#Option "PageFlip" # [<bool>]
#Option "IgnoreEDID" # [<bool>]
#Option "TVOutFormat" # <str>
#Option "CursorShadow" # [<bool>]
#Option "UseInt10Module" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoLogo" # [<bool>]
#Option "NvEmulate" # <i>
#Option "NoTwinViewXineramaInfo" # [<bool>]
#Option "ConnectedMonitor" # <str>
#Option "SwapReady" # [<bool>]
#Option "CursorShadowXOffset" # <i>
#Option "SWcursor" # [<bool>]
#Option "HWcursor" # [<bool>]
#Option "Dac8Bit" # [<bool>]
#Option "NoRenderExtension" # [<bool>]
#Option "TwinView" # [<bool>]
#Option "SecondMonitorHorizSync" # <str>

### Available Driver options are:-
### Values: <i>: integer, <f>: float, <bool>: "True"/"False",
### <string>: "String", <freq>: "<f> Hz/kHz/MHz"
### [arg]: arg optional
#Option "DigitalVibrance" # <i>
#Option "ConnectedMonitors" # <str>
#Option "TVStandard" # <str>
#Option "SecondMonitorVertRefresh" # <str>
#Option "Overlay" # [<bool>]
#Option "TransparentIndex" # <i>
#Option "Stereo" # <i>
#Option "NvAGP" # <i>
#Option "NoBandWidthTest" # [<bool>]
#Option "CursorShadowAlpha" # <i>
#Option "CIOverlay" # [<bool>]
EndSection

Section "Screen"
Identifier "Screen0"
Device "Card0"
Monitor "Monitor0"
DefaultColorDepth 16

Subsection "Display"
Depth 8
Modes "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubsection

Subsection "Display"
Depth 15
Modes "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubsection

Subsection "Display"
Depth 16
Modes "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubsection

Subsection "Display"
Depth 24
Modes "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubsection

Subsection "Display"
Depth 32
Modes "800x600" "640x480"
EndSubsection
DefaultDepth 24
EndSection

I live in the Midlands, just outside Birmingham. That gridref? I got it from streetmap.co.uk - never really checked it's validity.

Sakaka Qarah eh? Sounds exotic. :)

Heh, I'm in Great Malvern. Sakaka Qarah sounds more interesting :)

Canadians don't say "sod it" we say "piss on it" :D

Sorry for this useless post.

"Piss on it"? That's a nice expression. I might try to include that in my expletive vocab!

A linux question now - if anyone's still reading this post - I understand that a list of executable files is stored in a PATH environment variable. Very useful I thought, but what if it gets lost/deleted? Can this happen and what if it does?

It's best to start a new thread if you have a new question, because more people who are likely to be able to answer it will see it.

I know the answer to this one so it's OK here.

You can execute any file if you change it's permissions to 0777 and use dotslash:

chmod 0777 myprog &&
./myprog

will execute it. However, if the directory is included in the PATH variable, it can be executed simple by typing it at the command line:

myprog

There's a bit more to it though, as the PATH variable store lists of directories, not files. You have to think about PATH variables from a security point of view, because say if some ne'erdogood were to write a nasty program called bash and put it in your home directory, if the home directory was listed before the /bin directory inb the PATH variable, then when you type 'bash', his program would execute, not the bash shell as you expected.

I think the tutorial BASH Progamming in the links section on this site mentions this (it should anyway)

Bert