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Old 04-24-2011, 03:56 PM   #1186
SigTerm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneM View Post
If a missionary knocks on your door and you're not interested, the best answer (in keeping with politeness and common decency) is "I'm not interested" or something very similarly direct and polite.
And if the same missionary keeps knocking on your door again and again?

Frankly, while people should be able to select their beliefs, trying to challenge my beliefs at my home without invitation is, in my opinion, very rude. I do not push my beliefs (agnostic) onto other people, and expect them to do the same. If they are unable to comprehend such simple idea, they will have a problem.

In my opinion, religion related information should be provided on request only. If is interested in new faith and asks for info, then it is okay to explain. Maybe the person will change their faith. This applies to all faith including any religion, agnosticism and atheism.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 04:24 PM   #1187
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DaneM, I had a JW and his entire family turn up at my place 2 weeks ago and while they were the image of politeness it took a bit to get them to leave and move their car from blocking my driveway. I wont go into details but my extended family and the JWs have quite a history and I know the people who turned up know this. I can;t help but think some, not all, push the boundaries of decency when they keep imposing themselves.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 04:59 PM   #1188
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Funny though, what really pushes me away from religion is these folks. Its bad enough when they come to your door on the weekend and you just have woken up an hour before, or even worse when you are still soundly asleep!

I have already stated a few posts way back of my mistrust of western Christians and all of their denominations in general. Oddly enough I can probably tolerate Catholics more than the Protestants and all of their offshoots, and thats REALLY saying something considering the history between the Catholics and those like myself on the Eastern Orthodoxy side.

Still I have my reasons for being an agnostic, but at the same time I never had that extra push needed to become truly an atheist. Then again I guess because I have been fortunate not to be stuck with overtly religious parents, and or overbearing priest. Also most of the time when we go to church itis during a wedding, funeral or Easter. Yea thats how some if not most Eastern Europeans are. I guess we aren't as uptight about religion as others are? Who knows.

Also everyone knows my taste in music, and yea I wear mostly black but funny thing is it is not the priest at my church or parents that come up to my and start asking me if I accepted Jesus or anything, it is again the western Christians which like I said before is what began to really push me away from religion. Go figure.

I don't know when I would completely re-affirm mys faith but whenever I do, I will also clearly state that I belong to Eastern Orthodoxy and not any of the Western denominations including Catholicism. Nooooo way!

Last edited by Jeebizz; 04-24-2011 at 05:02 PM.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 06:45 PM   #1189
DaneM
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Unhappy

I can understand your frustrations about missionaries who bug you repeatedly or won't go away the first time you ask; it's obnoxious. Usually, at least with Mormon missionaries, if you put a small sign or note up saying that you're not interested in religion (not just "no soliciting"), they'll respect it. There are jerks in every faith, though, and I can understand that you shouldn't have to put up a sign just to be left in peace. If a Mormon missionary (the kind I know the most about) keeps harassing you or coming by more than once every couple of months (after they've canvassed the entire area BESIDES your house), then they're not doing their jobs--and are indeed being counter-productive. You might tell them that if they continue so.

Personally, I can't stand the whole "Have you accepted Jesus" routine. For one, the ultra-bland, zombie-brained, happy expression they get on their faces sometimes when they ask that is just inhuman. Nobody is THAT nice, or THAT brain-dead. (OK, well maybe the latter, but the real ones are vegetables/comatose.) Also, most of the people who ask that seem to espouse the belief that since we're "saved by grace," it must mean that we can be complete A-holes to everybody in real life, and we'll still go to heaven because we "believe on Jesus!" *Facepalm* Most of the really nasty folks I've dealt with in every-day life have publicly claimed to be that kind of "Christian." (I know that many "grace Christians" aren't like that, though.) I'm interested in knowing how Eastern Christianity is different from what we're exposed to in the 'States.

Sorry, I can't seem to keep from ranting about this topic; I really hope I haven't offended anybody.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 06:59 PM   #1190
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Wow, the religion thread is back…although (so far) it seems to be pretty civilized. I'll admit, when I first saw it at the top of the /General thread list, I was a bit nervous/shocked, but for now things seem to actually be okay.

As for my opinion, well…one only need look back through the previous pages of this thread to know at least part of my opinion. I'm not a terribly religious person, and my beliefs are fuzzy to say the least, but there *are* some things that do very personally bug me about both sides of the fence.

WRT preaching/evangelism (from any point of view), my opinion basically mirror's SigTerm's: believe (or not) what you want, just don't talk to me about it or try to force it upon me.

I hope what I've written here doesn't offend anyone/spark a flame war.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 07:05 PM   #1191
Jeebizz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneM View Post
I'm interested in knowing how Eastern Christianity is different from what we're exposed to in the 'States.
I would really give you links, but frankly I just don't even want to go that far. Google Orthodox Christianity and go from there. Also library resources are great too. Thats as far as I will go since I'm already blurring the line into promoting Orthodoxy which makes me in the same category of proselytizing as the very folks I am annoyed at . On the other hand you are requesting info, but this I feel is as far as I can go, is to just point you in the general direction. I also especially hate those that the first four words out of their mouths are, "Have you found Jesus?."

Not to sound too crass, but I didn't know he was lost! Someone put out fliers!

Last edited by Jeebizz; 04-24-2011 at 07:08 PM.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 08:05 PM   #1192
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Atheists and Agnostics (Rationalist?) rule, 65% to 31%. That's huge. Is anyone a fan of Sam Harris or Christopher Hitchens?

Sam says that the time has come to stop assuming that we cannot come to any definite conclusions about what are and are not moral or ethical behaviors or conditions:

Sam Harris: Science can answer moral questions

I agree with Sam for the most part, but it's a slippery slope dictating morality, but there are areas we can improve on without violating peoples' freedoms perhaps.

Christopher Hitchens tears this Rabbi a new one:

Christopher Hitchens Goes After Rabbi Harold Kushner re: Circumcision

Hitchens is a brutal and gifted debater.

Enjoy.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 08:35 PM   #1193
Coresay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrCode View Post
Wow, the religion thread is back…although (so far) it seems to be pretty civilized. I'll admit, when I first saw it at the top of the /General thread list, I was a bit nervous/shocked, but for now things seem to actually be okay.

...

I hope what I've written here doesn't offend anyone/spark a flame war.

Please don't think I'm singling you out because I quoted you. Most of us would say the exact same thing. But, I find it sad and exasperating that we have been conditioned since childhood in this society to believe that it's not polite to talk about religion or politics. In essence, it's not polite to talk about important issues???!!! It's not right for the population to scrutinize the two most powerful institutions that affect every one of our lives??? So, the effect is the world does not improve and the two most insidious sources of evil and corruption continue unabated.

I wish people were arguing about religion and politics all of the time... everywhere. Instead we practice "tolerance", as if tolerance for evil and corruption is the natural order of things and are instead forced-fed crap news stories like what Anna Nicole Smith is doing or Charlie Sheen. We learn to tolerate corruption and lies and false logic as if no ill effects come from them. I hate that. Rant over.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 09:05 PM   #1194
k3lt01
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I agree Coresay. I wish people would stop this "you can't talk about that" routine. If people don't want to join in then they don't have to but some do want to discuss things and shouldn't be told its a taboo topic.

Another thing I dislike, and I've said it somewhere else, is when people say the 2 groups (Church and State) should be separated. I find it rather off-putting that someone who has a genuine belief and for all intents and purposes has their heart and head in the right place is put down because they exercise a political right based on a personal belief system. I don't believe that any aspect of society should be barred from a political voice IF it does no harm. I would have hoped that in the 21st century "democratic" societies had moved on from such biases.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 09:43 PM   #1195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k3lt01 View Post
Another thing I dislike, and I've said it somewhere else, is when people say the 2 groups (Church and State) should be separated. I find it rather off-putting that someone who has a genuine belief and for all intents and purposes has their heart and head in the right place is put down because they exercise a political right based on a personal belief system. I don't believe that any aspect of society should be barred from a political voice IF it does no harm. I would have hoped that in the 21st century "democratic" societies had moved on from such biases.
Well I don't know the system in Australia, but here in the states the religious organizations are tax exempt. So I do have a problem when those in the pulpit begin to influence how people should vote. Here it is more of a general understanding/unwritten rule that since religious groups are tax exempt, that some things then they cannot influence, in this case it is politics.

I don't mind if those in the pulpit want to get into the political fray, but if they do then they should make the choice to give up their tax exempt status and pay taxes like the rest of us. You cannot be tax exempt and dabble in politics, that should never happen but sadly it does and I think the nice folks at the IRS should take a closer look at these religious organizations.

Last edited by Jeebizz; 04-24-2011 at 09:45 PM.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 10:43 PM   #1196
k3lt01
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I agree to an extent. I believe as individuals everyone has a political voice, as organisations in the example you give that is a different matter altogether. I have to admit that we do have tax exemptions here for some things to do with legitimate charities but not with income per se from a "Sunday Service". Say for instance if your doing a "soup kitchen" for the under privileged you would get a tax exemption on some aspects.

My beef (issue) is with private education, you don't need to be a religious organisation but they are the most prolific. Most private education institutions get funding from the government, this is theoretically so the government can maintain control over curriculum, but they charge huge fees which mean only people who are financially well off can really afford it. I think if they can afford to pay huge fees they shouldn't be getting subsidised by the state.

Last edited by k3lt01; 04-24-2011 at 10:47 PM.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 10:52 PM   #1197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaneM View Post
I guess Jesus isn't the only thing that gets resurrected sometimes... :-D (Happy Easter, BTW.)
While we're at it here, Eastern has absolutely nothing to do with the product of adultery which lie went horribly wrong.
 
Old 04-24-2011, 11:34 PM   #1198
corp769
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If I posted here what I said on my old facebook account about easter, I would surely get banned
 
Old 04-25-2011, 02:12 AM   #1199
Coresay
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Originally Posted by rsciw View Post
While we're at it here, Eastern has absolutely nothing to do with the product of adultery which lie went horribly wrong.
Easter is about collecting Easter eggs delivered by the Easter Bunny, of course! Wait! I'm confused. Which lie is the real lie and which lie is the truth?

In case some of you haven't seen the ground-breaking Zeitgeist yet, here is the part on religion.
 
Old 04-25-2011, 03:24 AM   #1200
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Here in Mexico Jehova's Witnesses are WAY TOO ANNOYING!! Really, no offense , but man school is the only entity that could give me homework and now if i answer to these _______ they give me some stupid books i have to answer then they come back and give me others... I guess i really need to stop being polite to them, and start replying back some of the stuff that were posted on the first page of this thread! LOL! ZOMG!!
 
  


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