I agree that Linux is not for everyone. But I take some pride in the fact that I'm a Linux user. Why?, you ask. I enjoy the freedom of setting up my OS the way I choose. Making it look, feel, and operate the way I want it.
You don't have to buy Vista. You don't have to use XP either. In fact, I have 2 systems that still have Win2k on them and they run all the proprietary Windows software just fine. It pains me to see people spend money on an OS just because Mr. Gates says we should...

If I were to flame you, it might be for the run-on paragraph that makes it a bit hard to follow what you are talking about. But---I don't flame.

I have been using Linux for over 3 years, and I still have struggles. In that light, your 2 months' effort with Ubuntu is not going to evoke compassion. AND--where were you the last two months?? (Obviously, not at LQ asking for help.)

I think my real question for you is: What are you trying to accomplish?
If you want to warn the Windows community to avoid Linux, you're probably in the wrong place.
If you want help, ask some specific questions and you'll get lots.

Finally, I offer a very old bit of wisdom: Usually, when people tell you that they CAN'T learn something, they are really saying that they DON'T WANT TO. Be honest with yourself as to which it is.

Sooooo...part of your objective is to have a continuing flame-fest? Why?

Actually, not. Driver support is one of the big things I find much LESS frustrating in Linux than in Windows.

Note that Linux support for laptop computer hardware is a lot more spotty than for desktop hardware. For myself and many others, this isn't a problem since we use desktop computers.

With desktop computers, many Linux distributions just plain work. With Windows, it's usually a frustrating experience of limping into Safe Mode and figuring out how the heck to at least get some sort of temporary connectivity so you can go and hunt down individual drivers off the Internet (because, frankly, the drivers on the included CDs often don't even work).

The last time I installed Windows XP, I couldn't even get it to work at all, because for some reason the install hangs on particular hardware combinations. In this case, I eventually figured out by arduous trial and error that it was an old Matrox Millenium video card--I swapped it for a different video card and Windows XP installed after that. Then I just had to do the whole hunt-download-install-reboot merry go round to actually get everything up and running.

This Matrox Millenium video card works just fine out-of-box with every version of Linux I've tried.

As a Windows user, one of the most amazing things to me was the first time I booted up Knoppix. Seeing the thing just automagically detect and configure all hardware in seconds was stunning, because I had done it so many times manually in Windows and that always took hours to accomplish.

I like debates, also its always good to have a counter weight. I am trying to help people make a decision. I am not on windows forums because people who want to switch wont be there. I have heard a few times on pod casts, Linux developers wanting to pick new users/windows users brains about what they would like to see in Linux and what they believe the problems are. And I want to see if anyone agrees with me...just curious.

Sorry---your starting post is no way to start a debate. Debate = Discussion. You were more like ranting.

So--for DISCUSSION: Does anyone agree with you? On what specific point?
I've been using Linux in the office for a year now--it's the only OS on my desktop--but I do have XP on a laptop for the increasingly rare situations where Linux does not do the job.
To be sure, I have had my share of problems. But the successes totally outnumber the problems.
YMMV

What's your point? Obviously, people that are new here post questions about their systems, same with experts.
That's the point of a forum.
Are you stating that "people who switch to linux" are not "average users"?
Many people who try it, don't like it, then switch back? Yes, it's possible. It's the same with any OS, Linux, Mac, or windows.
It happens, I don't really understand why you're attacking it. All I can think of, is you're trying to give us a bad name.
Well, this is open source, and generally free, so you can't say we're ripping you off. You can't say we're forcing you to use linux, and "If you don't have it, you're S.O.L."
So, what is your point?

I was not this average user, with experience in computers. Granted, Linux was hard, over my head, but I kept at it. I was determined to know the system, it was going to be my primary system, so I stuck with it. I asked around.

I agree with those who call this "ranting" and complaining, not debating.
Not EVERY person who makes a switch from one OS to another will switch back.
I have been a hard core; die hard fan of windows ever since I used DOS 6.2, 10+ years ago.
After FIVE MONTHS of using Mandrivalinux, FIVE MONTHS, I tossed out Windows COMPLETELY and I don't regret it.
I for one, made the switch, despite what a pain linux was at first, and I am happy with linux.
I may not be the "average user" as you put it, certainly not back in Janurary when I first started here, but I did come HERE, and asked for help, and look, here I am! I'm still here, and using Linux.

Anyways,
They say that each OS is different. We are not saying "Linux is better than Windows". We are saying "Linux is DIFFERENT than Windows". If Windows suits you, use it. If Linux suits you, use Linux. If they both suit you, then use the dual boot. It's that simple.

Yes, linux can be a pain, and can be harder to figure out. We have a lot of people here willing and wanting to help people figure out the linux system.

So, I'm sorry you don't care for linux. That's fine though. We're not competing against Windows. We're just simply different.

Primectown, anyone reading this forum has already done something you apparently couldn't do--find this forum. During all this time when you were having problems getting Linux to work, you didn't ask a single question for help here on linuxquestions.org.

I found out quickly that this and other Linux forums on the internet were awesome resources for figuring out how to get something to work in Linux. Even before I used Linux, I used similar forums to help figure out how to get stuff to work in Windows.

Would it be considered a science if no one was willing to do the reasearch on their subject? Does 2 months of research seem like enough to work an operating system that has been in developments since the sixties(maybe the wrong decade)? Were your methods during those 2 months efficient? What resources did you use (books, websites)? Did it take you 2 months to figure out how to be an expert in windows?

Just curious.

Quite a funny rant you got there primectown.
The thing that makes me disbelieve the motives behind this kind of nonsense is that your main reason is to "stear others clear". Anytime this is the main motive the entire post is highly suspect.
Apparently you are suggesting that anyone wanting a change due to the WGA give up all hope of an alternative, anyone that "hates Microsoft" has no other options,and you offer the great new advice that the free advice of our friends may be suspect.
Anyone interested in Linux should give a live CD/DVD such as Knoppix a try. Test drive with no hard drive install. Read the Linux is not Windows article. If you are interested try a dual boot.

Perhaps it will be better to not even bother with any alternatives since it is rumored that Windows Vista will be the best, most reliable operating system, the best price with all TCO considered, with unparalled security, with up to date activation and Genuine Advantage software, Digital Rights Management and other need-to-have software built right in.
Why even consider switching?

If those were your reasons for trying to switch, your frustrations and eventual failure were totally predictable. You expected Linux to be just like Windows, except without WGA and the Microsoft name stamped on it? Bad assumptions.
Wrong - another bad assumption. This may be a goal for Windows, but not necessarily for Linux. Linux allows you to customize it and work on it to your heart's content. If you have no desire to work with/on the OS, then I submit that Linux is not for you. You'd be better off sticking with Windows, which is much better suited for the point-n-click and newbie folk. Or maybe you should consider switching to a Mac if you hate Microsoft so.
Actually, I was going to say that the problems were most likely caused by a lack of initiative to learn and understand something new. Sorry, but just about all the things you mentioned you couldn't get to work ... they're working just fine for me. And vague problems you reported ... I've never seen, or was quickly able to solve.

I am sorry that you failed at Linux. But your failure does not imply that Linux is in any way inferior to other OS'es. You want to say "Linux is not ready for me". I think it's more the opposite, "You are not ready for Linux". This is not meant as an insult. Only to point out that your desires in an OS, and Linux's goals, are a bad match.

You said a friend told you to try linux. He should help you set it up. I gave a friend the ubuntu cd, because he wanted to try it - naturally assuming that you could do nothing wrong. I got a call that evening - he had been trying to set it up for hours and nothing worked.
It was all ridiculous, he had a pile of driver cd's that he wanted to install his stuff with - ignoring that everything was already working and recognized. - and of course the media codecs... All a matter of minutes, but if you're on your own, and you have never seen anything like it before, you're screwed, because nothin you ever learned on windows with eventually help you.

Wooww Nelly, just came back from walking my dog. I am NOT trying to steer anyone clear from Linux, I am just pointing out ONE new users perspective in switching to Linux. I don't hate Linux, I wish it success, I am just trying to point out for those who are looking for a viable alternative to windows like I was, that in my opinion it is not.

As for those who say that I am making a mistake in expecting Linux to be as friendly as windows...isn't that why they came up with Ubuntu...a user friendly version of Linux. Note for those who are willing to bog down and spend a lot of time fixing out of the box issues...go ahead...but for those who what an OS that has the same functionality as windows (I am NOT talking about FEATURES/FEEL, just workability) I RECOMEND that you stick with windows. And as for the problems I am having, your forums prove that they are not new, nor are they unique to me.

I am NOT lazy, I am still trying to get my printer to work, and other issues. I have posted on two other forums, this is my fist time here, and my friend does try and show me the ropes, I just didn't expect to have this many problems(my mistake). I plan to keep using Linux, because I cant afford a new copy of windows, and I feel dirty paying for one, but I don't know if I will in the future have time to be dealing with all of these issues and then be forced to buy Vista. Maybe after I get basic functionality, I wont have to spend some much time working the OS and let the OS work for me.

You know, I really don't think your problems are that impossible to solve. All your posts on this forum have been in this thread. I have been on quite a few linux forums, and I think this is the one with the most helpful community. Just make a few threads with a detailed discription of your problems, and what you have already tried, and It will probably get solved.

Listen to oskar. When I first tried Linux, I didn't like it. There were about a half a dozen things that didn't work, and about another dozen things I didn't even know about linux that I ended up loving.
Ask around, people will help.
Because of asking mandriva.com; linux questions.org, and a few other places, I have gradually been able to fix some issues and use this system quite well.

There are tactful ways of stating what you're getting to. If you're not steering people away from linux, please be more tactful about it.