While I agree that the people we see here trolling are invariably MS fans or people that had a hard time installing linux, I would never make such a broad statement like saying MS never has people scan through various forums and pages looking at content and opinion - perhaps even going to the extent of putting some probing questions on lists. I don't think there is any way you can say there are never any people on here that have some affiliation...

I guess you can believe whatever you want ... l got a friend who believes in UFO's too.

Wayne

Never knew there were this many paranoid folks out there

Read again: only a very small percentage of those anti-Linux people are real "plants". You'll never find out, but I can still assure you that they exist.

One of the reason is that it is fairly easy to find out who is really seeking help and who is frustrated and venting their anger on Linux. There exists a small percentage of people who have active agendas and who register on the forum just to carry out an agenda rather than seeking help.

Every now and then you can see these kinds. Mind you, I am not saying anything for sure, but these people with "agendas" definitely do exist whether you like it or not. The world is full of different people and you would be naive to believe that everybody out there is pure.

I am not saying that all of them are "plants". Some of these "agenda mongers" may be Microsoft plants, some may not, but they really *do* exist.

I have done quite a bit of research into the older threads at LQ and at other forums and these kinds do exist. Every now and then these pop up with an amazing regularity which would astound you. They all share many features in common and it would take a totally innocent guy to believe that these users all registered on the forum to seek help.

Some of their common features:

1. Refuse to listen to any helpful suggestions, but keep whining about Linux.
2. Participate in discussions under the guise of neutrality but really pursue their own agenda.
3. Their "problem" with Linux is vague enough not to allow people to help, yet will draw the regular posters into defending Linux.
4. They will usually be self-righteous in attitude.
5. They would claimed to use every distro possible and will simply dismiss each one as unsuitable without any substantial argument.
6. They will usually post a few times and then disappear. Some of them will continue for longer periods, but these are rare.

Now the genuinely frustrated Linux user *will* seek help on the forum. It will be far easier to reason with them. They will not assume knowledge, rather they will be active to suggestions.

1. They will usually have a concrete problem.
2. They won't put on airs. They will usually ask for help.
3. They may vent their frustration on Linux, but usually will not carry "political" messages within them.
4. They are genuinely seeking an alternative to Microsoft because they dislike Microsoft's licensing policies and their restrictive nature and will usually say so.
5. They will show some pride in using Linux.

Let me just say that in 90% of the cases, it is easy to distinguish between the user who is genuinely frustrated with Linux and the user who has an agenda. I learnt this by doing some research, reading articles on forum behaviour and also by experience.

I never said "paid M$" plants,...
They don't do that [anymore]. But there are M$ fanboys who come on and blast Linux once or twice and run,... like ringing a doorbell. I'm not the only one who has noticed this.

Hopefully, some helpful links for the "wannabe newbies". BTW, I first installed Linux in 1999 as a dual boot machine, now I have a workstation (Linux) and a playstation (Windows XP Pro). I spend most of my time in Linux except for playing some on-line games with my son in the US Air Force. It's the only way I can get him to communicate with me!

Preparing to install Linux:
# Choosing a Linux Distribution:
Will your hardware work?
Do you have good RAM? Memtest86 - A Stand-alone Memory Diagnostic
A Beginner's Guide to Choosing a Linux Distribution
Reasons to Choose or Not Choose Linux
LWN distro list
elinux Linux Distributions
# Freeware tools for partitioning/resizing hard drive partitions:
Any Linux Live CD usually have fdisk, cfdisk and other tools available
Ranish Partition Manager
# Understanding Linux Filesystem layout:
Directory Navigation Help File
Filesystems, Directories, and Devices Help File
Proper Filesystem Layout
Advanced filesystem implementor's guide (requires registration)

Do I buy a boxed source, download off the internet or buy some cheap CDs?
It's your choice! If you download, I suggest that you check the md5sums on the Linux ISO Images and make sure you know how to burn ISOs in Windows to install Linux
# Cheap CDs
Discount Linux CDs
Linux Central
Cheapbytes
TuxCDs
ComputerHelperGuy
CheapISO
Os Heaven

I am one who is new to Linux for about 2 months including installation period. I started with FC3 and couldn't get that working so moved to FC2 although it is not as user friendly as others it worked really well because I was able to learn alot about how the system works and commands and etc.

Now I'm trying out Suse 9.1 and find it more user friendly. The only two problems I've run into with Linux are Wireless card install and playing DVD's. If anyone could help with the DVD part let me know, I have kaffeine.

For DVD playback in SuSE 9.1, you need a version of either Mplayer, Xine or Ogle off the net, complete with the secure DVD playback libraries. Currently, there is a section of the DMCA that allows for reverse engineering for compatibility if there are no commercially available measures. Currently there ARE NO commecially available Linux DVD playback programs (despite what the MPAA says), so figure it for yourself...

Do a search in the forums and you will find someone who will direct you to the necessary packages. I prefer Xine, myself. It works just fine for me.

xine works for me too, but it's UI is too awful for description

At least you can navigate the DVD menus w/ ui. Every try guessing through the menu trees on a DVD w/ mplayer

I have been able to play DVD's in Linux using either Totem or Kaffeine, though I had to go and install the libdvdcss package first. You could look on rpmfind.net or RPM Search at Pbone.net for the rpm.

I'm pretty much a noob myself, having only started using Linux (well, on a regular basis that is) back in October, first with Knoppix, then Fedora 2, and now I have Mandrake 10.1. My laptop dualboots Mdk with WinXP, though I very seldom boot into Windows anymore. If I could manage to get my iPod working in Linux, I would never boot into Windows!

But the community forums have been wonderful sources of help thoughout my experience. I got the dvdcss tip through another search on here, and much of what I've learned to do is a result of reading a post and trying it out on my own system. Oh, Linux has frustrated the hell out of me now and again, but I have been able to sort out most of my problems and I've learned a lot in the process.

Overall, I'm very happy with moving to Linux. While the amount of options you have (for example, window managers, office applications, etc, not to mention all the configuration choices available at the application, environment, or system level) can seem overwhelming, especially to those coming from Windows and its "Wizards", I personally enjoy the fact I can tweak the system as much (or as little) as I choose.

"Wizards" were the one thing I absolutly hate about windows. They seem to fail to do anything the bulk of the time, and you can't ever figure out what they were trying to do anyway, and then do it yourself manually. And yeah, there are a whole lot of libraries you need to view DVDs in linux.

Hey Misunderstruck: I am using Mepis and it has a program called GTKPod(ipod manager) for ipods. Now l don't have an ipod so lcan't vouch for it's functionality but it is there.

Wayne

As a newbie myself, i would like to add a bit about my experience

i am not a techie by any sense of the word, other than internet, news, emails and the sort, i am pretty much a novice with computers, but i do enjoy them for their entertainment value

of course at work, everyone is email crazy, so i do dabble with the computers

with windows, i was tired of the spyware, viruses, windows98 bsod, and then the costs

though i am not into programming, i do like to perform minor tweaks that make the computer run better, and with windows, i wasnt getting a smooth running machine

so from running a bootleg xp that i couldnt get any updates on, i figured i would partition using fedora core 2

well, being the newbie novice i am, i wiped out my entire computer

so with no xp disk and these four fedora cd's, i wound up plunging into the linux world

after my first two weeks, thru going the "blinking grub", i was yearning for windows, but being forced into a corner, i had no where to turn, so i went out and got a free copy of mandrake 10.1

my first drawback was that i had to pay for updates, which reminded me of bill gates

then after all was said and done, it reminded me of windows-lite, and i started yearning for the fedora days

now i am back, trying to figure out all of the little intricacies

so i was "curious" to learn about linux, and "forced" to stay

i really enjoy the "linux" world, and the involvement everyone contributes to helping each other

as a newbie, i would like to say this to the oldbies

there are many times where i am looking for a solution, and either the existing page is outdated, the instructions dont work, or the advice is given in "technicaleez"

this is what made me yearn for my windows again, but it also required some more energy on my part and being willing to dig deeper

so i havent said it to anyone in particular, but i figure i may as well say it now

my hat goes off to all of you developers and others who spend endless hours playing and tweaking the systems

and my vote goes off to all of you for a job well done

(ps, hoping i can get my kaffeine, totem, mplayer, xmms and so forth working.........) right now i am just playing anything realplayer will let me

Hey all,
I'm a big time newbie with linux, I've been using it for about two or three weeks now, and I'm hooked. I'm running Mandrake 10.0 on a dual boot with XP which I think is probably making the switch easier. It is definitely a steep learning curve to use the command line, but the GUI definitely makes most things pretty easy I find.
I think the thing I like most, and this post really shows it, is the strength of Linux users as a community. Every time I've encountered a problem so far, I've found a solution just by searching the forums.

Along the lines of what ironwalker said, whenever i tell people that I'm running Linux, I tend to get three responses. One of the more common ones is "What is Linux?" To those people I try to explain, but only about 3 in 10 understand what I'm talking about. The next is rather like the one in the above quote, and the third is when I'm talking to Linux veterans, and they tend to be impressed, kind of in the way you might be impressed if you saw someone that looked like they had been wearing the same clothes for a week, then you found out they're a graduate student in nuclear physics or something. Even though I don't know very much about it yet, I guess they know that I will be able to if I keep at it.
Unlike most of the people in this forum (at least the ones who have expressed an opinion) I don't detest MicroSoft. Frankly, I think that if you aren't willing to put a little extra work into figuring out how to work linux, then Windows is probably a simpler option due solely to its prominence, and therefore the greater likelihood of finding help when it crashes. That being said, I probably spend about 80% of my time on Linux.
The hardest part I find for learning Linux is figuring out the commands for the command line. I saw someone's complaint that people don't use the man command. personnally that kind of bugs me. Often the man files are only useful if you already know what you're doing somewhat. The coreutils file seems to be useful, but dry, and long. If anyone knows any easily accesible file/document that lists all the basic commands and how to use them (in simpler language than the man files tend to be). So far i've been using a file I found at http://linux-newbie.sunsite.dk/
It's useful in that it tends to be fairly simple, although it's often only helpful if you're doing just what the author was doing. If you do use this, then I would just suggest that if you have decided to switch, or have already switched, then try starting at chapter 6 for basic commands. they aren't necessarily ordered so you'll find the most basic ones first, then more advanced and so on, which I think would be ideal, but other than that I've found it sufficient so far.

Basically I'd just like to thank the whole Linux community for helping newbs like me, and once I've got it figured out, I hope I can help some of the newbs like you've helped me. Anyone thinking of making the switch, I'd urge you to do so; if you're willing to do a lot of work you can become a guru in a few years, if you're only willing to do a little work, you can set up your computer to mimic windows in most aspects and it will generally work better (for example, I started up a direct connect client [dctc with dc_qt front-end interface] and I get much higher transfer rates). If you do switch, try to have patience. I spent easily three hours getting my direct connect client, although I'm sure some of the more skilled users around me could have done it in 10 minutes maximum, but in the end I love it. My only current problems are that totem doesn't allow concurrent sounds, and that I haven't bothered to upgrade my drivers fot my video card. Most Linux apps, once you get them working, are much simpler than any other apps I've used. Gaim, for example, is clearly far simpler in coding and appearance to MSN (and the other IM programs it works with) and yet it accomplishes everything i've ever wished my MSN would do wor me. If you're thinking of returning to MS (or other) I would say you should just try to stick it out, it's definately been tough for me, but already I find it far superior. That being said, Linux probably isn't for everyone. I DO believe that everyone would benefit from trying, if only to learn that there IS an alternative.

Well I've rambled on for a while now, I'd like to congratulate anyone who read all of this,
Thanks to all those to help us newbs, and to my fellow newbs, stick with it.

Steve -- Linux user since February 28th 2005