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Old 12-24-2011, 07:47 PM   #16
SigTerm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spudgunner View Post
I know this is a bit of topic, but it pertains other legal substances. If you're old enough to decide that you want to kill people for your country and you have no problem putting your life on the line for that, you're old enough to decide what chemicals go in your body.
I always thought that the purpose of "age restriction" is to make sure (or make it more likely) that the person making decisions has accumulated enough life experience to make REASONABLE decisions and be aware of consequences. Aside from that - I think that you can decide that you want to kill people (for your country) at pretty much any age. Also, some countries have conscription and don't even let you decide that.
 
Old 12-27-2011, 08:20 AM   #17
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Don't use it but don't have a problem with anyone that chooses to, as long as they use it safely, but that goes for all drugs legal and illegal. What i mean by that later point is mainly in respect to driving. I have heard people i know that have used the drug extensively in the past, argue that it's safe, but i'm sorry but i can't comprehend that.
Off topic, but i also feel the exact same way to magic mushrooms, which i have used, and enjoyed, but, once again, needs to be used safely; driving is out of the question! anyone who has used shrooms though will more than likely agree that it's a more obvious point with shrooms.
 
Old 12-27-2011, 10:10 AM   #18
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I smoke cannabis sometimes. I rarely drink (so far this year I've had less standard drinks than a lot of people I know drink opn a friday night). I do not use any other illegal drugs, though in the past I have had a few trips (I wouldtn call it LSD, its not, not here anyway, and never closer together than 6 months).

So its pretty obvious I'm not against the stuff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by carlosinfl View Post
I have never heard of anyone killing anyone, themselves, or doing anything life altering under the influence of this drug.
Killing others? Not as far as I've ever heard about. Killing themselves? Well....I know of one case, but he was also a regular and heavy user of alcohol, speed, herion, trips, MDMA (ecstasy), amyl nitrite and probably other stuff have forgotten or never knew about. I' dont think he was stoned when he hung himself anyway...

Life altering, heard and seen that plently of times. 'Lets move to Carins!' 'I'm going to breakup with XXXX''I dont like my partents church, sod going to mass today' etc. Nothing 'evil' or especially bad though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
Personally, I've always found the alcohol and tobacco analogy weak. Just because we have people risking their health with some drugs, how does that justify enabling them to do it with others?
If you found out that using windows, in any form (even the ever popular 'pirate' edition) was legal, but using a safer system like linux was illegal, wouldnt you question the logic behind the laws and regulations that led to that state of affairs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
I think there will obviously be a national colour to opinions on this. In countries where the state (i.e. the tax-payers) has to pay for the sick, it will naturally be seen to have the right to have a say on how they look after themselves. In a country where the poor rely on charity or die in the gutter, the individuals 'right to pursue happiness' will be rated higher.
The western country with the lowest government support (the US) seems to have by far the harshest cannabis laws. Countries where the government pays far more of citizens health bills (like western Europe) have far looser cannabis laws.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidMcCann View Post
There definitely seems to be medical evidence that marijuana is harmful, and it has been regarded as causing mental instability for centuries in India.
Yes, cannabis can be 'harmful'. Mostly because people smoke it, if people moved to eating cannabis the risks to physical health would be lower, pretty much zero. Not many people eat cannabis, its harder to guage the dose, and it takes a 50-100% higher dose to get the same effect. When cannabis is the price it is, a 50-100% increase in dose isnt cheap.

AFAIK vaporisers are safer than smoking, but not many people use them either. They are harder to get and more expensive than the traditional smoking setups- papers, pipes, bongs/hookahs, 'buckets' and all the variants.

As far as mental health goes, thats far more complex. I tend not to believe 100% some of the stupid reports, from experience I know that lots of people who claim to have 'mental health issues' from cannabis didnt get them from cannabis IMO. At least 3 people I know blame cannabis for mental health issues...they dont bother to mention that when they developed 'the problem' they were using a _lot_ of alcohol, speed, 'trips' (which at least in this case was a odd conconction of amphetamines and a few other nasites) and anything else they could get.

IMO its been the speed and nasty trips that has caused the problem...that stuff can rot your brain faster than most people would believe.

I'd like to know what sort of 'mental instability' you think that cannabis causes in India. Maybe Sadhus/sadhvis? Living on the edge of society on a quest for god/gods seems to be a lot less 'unstable' than a lot of the stuff I've seen with alcohol in particular.

I've never seen anyone on cannabis punch out his friend, then half and hour later be doing the whole 'I love you man' thing. Or engage in spousal abuse. Or do 150Kph in a 60 zone. etc..

Quote:
Originally Posted by SigTerm View Post
I knew a quite problematic region where teens from schools (aged 14) could get the stuff, and as far as I know, this is definitely wasn't good.
Teenagers can petty much always get alcohol, tobacco, and any illegal drugs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by linus72 View Post
There's also the huge industry that could be created as the oil in Marijuana can be used for engines, cooking, etc and of course many textiles can be made from it's fibers.Many problems in many countries could be solved simultaneously if governments would make effective use of this plant.

There's also a side benefit that Marijuana produces more oxygen than almost any other plant.
I'd agree, a lot of problems could be solved by better use of the cannabis plant. Not that I'd expect that much in the way of a seed crop from cannabis users, the seedless versions (grown without a male plant nearby, not some sci-fi thing) are more potent. Male and hermaphrodite plants are normally removed as soon as possible (and if someone is growing for seed, they still remove the hermaphrodite plants, no-one wants a messed up XX/XY plant...)

I'd like to add- hempcrete (you can make that from cannabis) and it would be a very useful 'green manure' crop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Knightron View Post
Don't use it but don't have a problem with anyone that chooses to, as long as they use it safely, but that goes for all drugs legal and illegal. What i mean by that later point is mainly in respect to driving. I have heard people i know that have used the drug extensively in the past, argue that it's safe, but i'm sorry but i can't comprehend that.
Off topic, but i also feel the exact same way to magic mushrooms, which i have used, and enjoyed, but, once again, needs to be used safely; driving is out of the question! anyone who has used shrooms though will more than likely agree that it's a more obvious point with shrooms.
I wouldnt call driving stone that safe, but IMO its a lot safer than driving under the influence of alcohol. I will never get in a car driven by someone who has been drinking again, but I'll hop in a car with stoned driver most of the time. (depends on the driver, how trashed they are, destination, etc..). Most of the time, stoned drivers go slower, not faster. Unlike most other drugs.

Driving on mushies is _crazy_. I personally think that mushies are crazy anyway, too much stricnine. But hey, I havent dug to far into mushies, its possible that you got some 'clean' strain of psilocybin mushroom, not the drity stuff I've used twice (never again!). Goldtops are dirty, blue meanies are the mushroom from hell, and thats all I've ever seen.....

Last edited by cascade9; 12-27-2011 at 10:12 AM.
 
Old 12-27-2011, 10:08 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascade9 View Post
Driving on mushies is _crazy_. I personally think that mushies are crazy anyway, too much stricnine. But hey, I havent dug to far into mushies, its possible that you got some 'clean' strain of psilocybin mushroom, not the drity stuff I've used twice (never again!). Goldtops are dirty, blue meanies are the mushroom from hell, and thats all I've ever seen.....

There is no stricnine in real magic mushrooms! (unless some arse as laced them) that is a myth that for some reason many people believe. The active chemical in magic mushrooms is psilocybin, and psilocycin. Gold tops and blue meanies are commen terms i don't use as what one person would call a 'gold top' ect, someone else might call it something else. The only known commonly agreed common name i am aware of is liberty caps, which refers to psilocybe semilanceata.
If you are interested in learning more about magic mushrooms, i would recommend the FAQ at shroomery.org. It is chock full of knowledge and the forums there are extremely helpful in helping people identify any type of mushroom.
 
Old 12-27-2011, 10:42 PM   #20
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I've been to grows, Both visiting and as 'the help' (both where it was legal) ... and the amount of work that goes into pot is amazing. Even for outdoor grows it is unbelievingly time consuming. At the same time, anyone can grow a plant or 3 in their closet. I'd like for it to be legal ... As it does have it's place much like anything else in the world. The places I've been to have quite the economy going just off of sale of marijuana. But it also poses it's own risks, Such as fires at indoor grows because of the heat lights, Spreading mold and mites to other plants in the area (if neighbors are close enough) in outdoor grows ... Risks other then health.


As far as judging the effects, It takes different strokes. I don't smoke as much as I used to because now it gives me minor headaches and anxity. others are fine for 50 years. But I can safely say the general side effects people will experience are not that bad. Hungry, Sleepy, Giggly, and the intense urge to play videogames doesn't seem all that horrible to me. I don't think we can say 'marijuana is safe for 100% of people 100% of the time.' but it's safe at least 90% of the time, and that's a helluva lot better then even Tylenol.

Overall I'd vouch for it, not only from a medical perspective (glucoma,artritis, and such) but on the grounds it never should have been illegal in the first place.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 05:17 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knightron View Post
There is no stricnine in real magic mushrooms! (unless some arse as laced them) that is a myth that for some reason many people believe. The active chemical in magic mushrooms is psilocybin, and psilocycin. Gold tops and blue meanies are commen terms i don't use as what one person would call a 'gold top' ect, someone else might call it something else. The only known commonly agreed common name i am aware of is liberty caps, which refers to psilocybe semilanceata.
If you are interested in learning more about magic mushrooms, i would recommend the FAQ at shroomery.org. It is chock full of knowledge and the forums there are extremely helpful in helping people identify any type of mushroom.
I wouldnt go making blanket statements about mushrooms. To many species, too little research.

Yeah, I've heard the 'no strychnine in magic mushrooms' theory before, its its quite likely that most mushrooms dont have any strychnine.

There are quite a few alkaloids closely related to strychnine, eg brucine. So a organic/industrial chemist could be 100% correct in saying 'there is no strychnine in magic mushrooms', but the mushroom could well have other componds that are similar to strychnine and have the same effect. There are also other chemicals that are quite different to strychnine but have the same baic effect.

I really couldnt be bothered making distinctions between what is technically strychnine, and what just gives a similar effect.

Unfortunately I've lost contact with the chemists I used to know who actually knew this stuff backward....

BTW, I have seen the shromomery site, and I'm not impressed. I'd guess you are going off this?

http://www.shroomery.org/8758/Is-the...e-in-mushrooms

Nice dead link, stuff which is out and out wrong- ("No, there is no strychnine in mushrooms. There is no strychnine in LSD, either. In fact, there's no strychnine added to any drugs!"). Funny, the industrial chemist I knew who made 'trips' (at queensland uni, LOL) told me that the stuff he makes does contain a small amount of strychnine. At a _very_ low level, but it was there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hevithan View Post
But it also poses it's own risks, Such as fires at indoor grows because of the heat lights, Spreading mold and mites to other plants in the area (if neighbors are close enough) in outdoor grows ... Risks other then health.
Heat lights....man, sometimes this whole cannabis business just depresses me. What a waste of power.

I live in a fairly hot climate, and I've seen small grow rooms hit 55C+ in summer. Even in winter when it can drop as low as 2-3C here, the grows rooms are still well into the 20s. People are slowly going to move to LEDs here, not just because of power draw (IIRC you can replace 800-1000watts of HPS with 250-300watts of LEDs) but also because of het output from 'traditional' lights.

If there is a mold problem, thats enviromental. Mites....typical monoculture problem, the sort of thing that can be avoided. That would require legallity, or at least quasi-legallity though, and even if cannabis was legalised, IMO we would still see lots of monoculture setups (both indoors and outdoors).

'Lets take the failing method of big argibusiness and apply it to our cannabis crops'. Lame.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 05:34 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cascade9 View Post
BTW, I have seen the shromomery site, and I'm not impressed. I'd guess you are going off this?

http://www.shroomery.org/8758/Is-the...e-in-mushrooms

Nice dead link, stuff which is out and out wrong- ("No, there is no strychnine in mushrooms. There is no strychnine in LSD, either. In fact, there's no strychnine added to any drugs!"). Funny, the industrial chemist I knew who made 'trips' (at queensland uni, LOL) told me that the stuff he makes does contain a small amount of strychnine. At a _very_ low level, but it was there.

Yes that would be part of the faq, specifically referring to the topic of strychnine. If your chemest mate said that, that's great! i won't say they're wrong because i don't know them, or the authors of the FAQ in mention. To be honest i don't really care, i just provided you with a good websight, (wasn't meant to be a link) in case you were interested in learning more. The websight is simply there to educate people better; the community is very knowledgeable on mushrooms, and i think that if any health issues were identified with magic mushrooms, it would mention them somewhere. If you're not interested, or 'not impressed' then great, because i wasn't trying to impress anyone.
 
Old 12-28-2011, 08:22 AM   #23
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It should be legal. I don't see why tobacco is legal, because it is much more dangerous and addictive.

Either way, I don't want anyone smoking anything near me.

If you choose to use it, it should be legal to do so, but I recommend only taking any drug for a reason. I know they have studies that show some anti-cancer properties to THC, so this is when you might use it. Otherwise, you shouldn't use anything as a habit or for no good reason.
 
Old 01-03-2012, 01:33 PM   #24
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I personally dont dislike ppl smokin it, i smoke it few times a year myself and i grow my own plants sometimes, atm have one plant that is about to turn from seed to actual plant. its ok thing i guess if u dont provide income to criminals by buying it from them.
 
Old 01-03-2012, 02:26 PM   #25
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Those criminals exist because it is illegal.
 
Old 01-04-2012, 03:44 PM   #26
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your freedom ends where my freedom begins
ALL drugs should be legal
you want to destroy or kill your self
then by god it should be up to you how you do it
you should not be forced to use alcohol to do it

I for one would rather share the road with people doing ANY drug other than alcohol
the worst drug of them all bar none is alcohol
as far as problems with drugs go the law and it's effects dose far more damage than
it all the drugs would do even if they were given away free as much as anybody wants

given that there is such a thing as taste in drugs just about everybody who would do
a given drug is already doing it legal or not
 
Old 01-06-2012, 06:31 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob.rice View Post
your freedom ends where my freedom begins
ALL drugs should be legal
you want to destroy or kill your self
then by god it should be up to you how you do it
I'd just like to point out the waste issue too. It's not so much in reference to cannibals, but you say all drugs. I am talking mainly about needles. i am on not the same but a leaning your way of point of view, but i think that all waste should be strictly disposed of in the appropriate manna.
 
Old 01-07-2012, 06:18 PM   #28
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Something to listen to while you're discussing in this thread:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sD3HHbzHoc0

 
Old 01-07-2012, 08:10 PM   #29
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I agree that marijuana is way less harmful than some legal drugs like alcohol and tobacco and should be legal. People under the effects of alcohol do all sort of stupid things and can even kill, something that doesn't happen with marijuana... That said, I don't support the legalization of other drugs like cocaine, heroine and crack; these substances really can mess up and destroy lives.
 
Old 01-10-2012, 11:48 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odiseo77 View Post
I agree that marijuana is way less harmful than some legal drugs like alcohol and tobacco and should be legal. People under the effects of alcohol do all sort of stupid things and can even kill, something that doesn't happen with marijuana... That said, I don't support the legalization of other drugs like cocaine, heroine and crack; these substances really can mess up and destroy lives.
there are other ways to destroy your self that don't require drugs (gambling comes to mind)
ALCOHOL destroys more people in one day than ALL DRUGS destroy in 4years
I doubt there would be any increase in the use of the hard stuff
there may even be a decrease in the use of the hard stuff
as people switch to psychedelics
unlike other classes of drugs psychedelics can only be used once every 3 days of so with out a large increase in dosage
 
  


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