Hi,

Most newbies post here to LQ requesting help with their GNU/Linux endeavor. LQ rules do state that;

Now where does it state the use of netspeak or slang as a means of communication? By use of netpseak along with the poster first language not being English just confuses the situation. Add to this poor grammar, punctuation and basic formatting of a post then we cannot always provide a complete answer for the request.

I'm not just speaking of posters outside of the U.S. Posters here in the U.S. don't always present a clear nor concise post. We can attribute this to laziness, poor education expectations and our acceptance of such communication. Some people do stand up and request clarity but a lot just let things slide therefore the problem just snowballs until it is acceptable.

I'm not stating that we need to speak the 'Queen's English' but to present the request in a clear understandable formatted question. If done properly then everyone benefits from the post(s).

I totally agree. Alot of posts are very hard to follow anyway, and the netspeak/slang makes it even worse.

Probably the best answer if you are sure it is not poor english skills is to ignore or tell them when they post their problem in a language that you can understand you will try and help with a solution.

If the person has poor english skills and if you do not understand then just do the best you can. There is no way that you can change that situation. I do believe these people should have a right to post as long as their intent is serious.

I do not agree with 'netspeak' or 'slang', I try and ignore those posts.

OK, but I'm not really sure what your suggestion is to improve the situation.

Perhaps the rules could do with a re-write to give it a bit more emphasis, but my impression is that some of the worst cases have never actually read the rules.

And additionally, while there are posts that you see in which it seems very clear that the poster has taken no effort to make their English at all like standard English, the most difficult to read are the ones for which the poster has applied no logic and no other skills (punctuation, blank lines) to make their post clear. I don't know what can be done about that.

Education, in the form of corrective feed-back. This may, however,
result in flamewars if the person whom you're trying to empower in
terms of their language and communication skills has no interest to
improve themselves .... :)


And while I love the topic and tone of this thread, it's not
a linux question, and herewith moving to GENERAL.




Cheers,
Tink

Clearly, we need to round up all school teachers and school administrators and explain to them that they will all lose their jobs if they can't figure out how to teach our young people to read and write. Concurrently, we will pass laws requiring an "exit exam" in order to get a high school diploma. Having employers require basic literacy will help also.

Meanwhile....(While we're waiting for this crusade to take hold.....)
Continue to (politely) ask people to speak English. Given that we are an international forum, we do have to have a level of patience and understanding but--IMHO--it is always OK to tell people that their writing is hard to understand.

What really gets my attention is the ESL poster who combines fractured English with the <<nettalk, SMS, chat-room baby talk.....WHATEVER>>. I visualize a growing sub-culture out there whose members honestly believe that "I wanna c u l8er" is English.

ur rite, pixellany, coz ur a modr8tur n modz roolz!

modz rool

mod roolz

I am shocked at such an error in otherwise flawless prose....

srry bout that, pixellany. u r l33t mod i cn lrn alot frm u.

Hi,
I don't agree that the post should be moved to 'General'. It is addressed to the Newbie Forum and the content is relative to the problems that exist within the 'Newbie Forum'. Sure other forums have the same condition but more so in 'Newbie'. Tink, not to to get into a semantic condition but if you use the guideline then everything could be lumped into 'General'. I think you pulled the trigger to quick!

I did not create the post to get into flame wars but for open discussion concerning the problem. Sure, the U.S. schools in general let too many things pass without personal responsibility. But some of the problem is related to social acceptance. Jargon, cool and confusion are means of shifting responsibilities or covering up weakness that some people have in regard to their public response. I find a lot of people try to use 'TechSpeak' and don't even understand what they are using to express themselves. Add 'NetSpeak' into the mix then you have a potpourri that confuses everyone.

It is a GNU/Linux problem here on LQ if we accept the situation. Self regulating is a very important function in the way we can improve our situation. Be it by informing individuals need to compose posts in a clear, concise and informational request for help.

One additional area of proper posting should include punctuation and use of paragraphs. I suspect that this abuse occurs mostly among native English speaking members who are too lazy or arrogant to take the time to clearly post. They may as well be talking with their hands since their posts are unreadable with no capitalizations and strings of commas as their only punctuation.

These posts are unreadable and not worth the time to decypher.

While you're entitled to that opinion the rule of
thumb (for all our technical forums) is that we only
allow technical questions there. And your little essay
on "language cruelty" doesn't qualify. That all said:
the link from Newbie to General for this thread is
permanent ;P

And no - I won't sticky it.


Cheers,
Tink

Oops!

Let's not get too pedantic about spelling and grammar. A conversational style in reasonably standard English will suffice.

Hi,
And you never make typo errors?

Corrected!

Hi,
I never requested to sticky the post. Technical questions are composed within a forum. The composition quality will dictate the quality of response for both parties.

As for an essay, your viewpoint. My purpose here is to help others with my participation within the forums. As for language cruelty, your judgment again. I feel more people should speak out concerning these issues. If you feel pacification is the answer then that too me is poor moderation. The technical communication within any forum should be correct and direct. Any form of communication that will assist to meet those goals would be a benefit for all.