Relax, I don't post there anymore. (And I don't have a clue as to why you'd have a problem with me. If our opinions differ on various subjects, we can still discuss our viewpoints and maintain respect for each other- as I do for you.) (Oh, and I ride I Klein... I hear they're very highly thought-of in Germany?)

It must have been nice being off-line and living entirely in the real world. If it weren't for the fact that the net is so much more convenient than the library, I think I'd ditch the computer permanently. At least I try and keep the e-world at bay, by not using a smartphone or GPS or any such gadgets.

Hmmm...seem to be a lot of us cyclists on this forum!


I don't necessarily disagree; just saying what works for me. I just can't help but thinking that if I was safer not updating Windurs than the people around me who did update, that I should be even safer with Linux. Not that Linux is impervious- but between the fact that I practice safe computing in all other respects (other than updating); and that the vast majority of malicious code is designed for the majority who use Windurs, as opposed to the tiny percent who use Linux, I guess I see the odds of a problem being very slim.

But just discussing this IS helping to get me out of my old Windurs mindset of not updating (I guess that mindset came from not trusting MS)...so I may just start doing updates more regularly- maybe once every 6 months or so. (At least until my release reaches end-of-life...'cause I will no doubt continue to use it years after that! )

Oh, and when I had a trojan, it was easy to spot- as I kept getting returned emails that were sent to dead addresses; plus, at the time, using a 500MHZ 'puter, any resource-drain was noticeable; and also, the fact that my modem was busily working when I wasn't even online...)

Errr. Since then and now. 3 Days. Only

So not too bad . I have waited Longer though. One finds the longer one waits. The more likely something is about to break.

Kinda like intercourse I guess. One can have a stroke a 70.

One tries not to become a slave I guess.

@sumguy. This install is long in the tooth in some respects. Since it is going on 2014.
I cant bring myself to do a reinstall yet on this. Kinda a pride thingy. But Backup is there if I need it Ok. Update done. No errors. Ya oughta try it sometime. By the way. I run Debian Jessie/testing repos on here.

Just a home using Biker like you.

Would you also think that you need no seatbelts in your car because you are a careful driver and your car has airbags? Security on your systems is only as good as the weakest link in the chain, regardless how strong the others are.

My head ain't gonna go through the monitor if I don't buckle-up my OS!

Seriously though, I just can't help thinking that the odds are so low with Linux. I mean, I may start updating, as I know with Linux, it's nothing to fear- so what the hey? But really, what are the odds, using an OS that is in a tiny minority; and would require root privileges to do anything nefarious, in most cases?

I can't help but thinking that if I'm going to woory so, the next step would be to run AV on Linux, also. (I'm definitely NOT going to be doing that). And of course, the biggest threat to one's security and privacy, is the NSA- and I doubt any security updates would eliminate that.

Your OS, if not properly updated, can easily be infected to act as spam server due to you not having the latest Flashplayer or Java plugin. Root privileges are not involved at all. This also has nothing to do with you running an AV or the NSA (they don't look at your computer anyways).

Again, this is not about you and the odds you will loose some data. This is about your machine being involved in bot-nets and spam systems, which does not need root rights and if you have a Java plugin or the Flashplayer installed the attack vector very likely is not OS specific, but exactly the same and as effective as on Windows. Want to guess how high the odds are now?

What seems to be very difficult to understand for you is that you are not magically any more safe just because you use Linux (in fact, again, your system is more insecure than a properly maintained Windows system) and this is not about someone spying on you or the safety of your data, this is about your system possibly being involved in criminal activities. This is about your behavior damaging us and our machines, this is about your machine being one of the causes for the massive spam problem that many others have.

To add to the above, I have downloaded, compiled and run mprime as a non-root user on my systems very easily. This is a program which can stress-test a system to the point of overheating if the system's cooling isn't well thought out. It is also just the kind of process that is use to "mine" "bitcoins". So, yes, a Linux machine could well be used for nefarious purposes without any root intervention. You can stop this kind of thing by making home non-executable, but I'm willing to bet that not many people have done that.
I've also heard recently that Ghostery Firefox extension is backed by advertisers. I don't know what to make of that other than dropping it until I know more -- after which I may start using it again.
The bottom line is -- if you've CPU cycles to spare they can be used maliciously despite precautions but at least if you take precautions you're less likely to be used as a host to harm somebody else.
Oh, apparently you can run a complete virtual Linux machine in a web browser also. So if you're tricked into leaving a website logged in you could, conceivably, be running a whole separate OS on your machine*.

*Found here I think http://bellard.org/jslinux/

I find the slap happy nature of the idea that linux is more secure so I can do less about security rather concerning. I'm a mod on another forum and I am getting over 150 emails a day from the forum email telling me a new member has joined. 99.99999 etc % of these are spam bots. They take my time from doing things that are more important such as helping people with Linux.

Sorry SumGuy but you really need to rethink your stance, it is flawed and puts other people at risk. If you want to run an insecure PC in the 21st century it says to me maybe you shouldn't be running a PC at all.

You are saying that 9,999,999 out of 10 million new members on the other forum you are moderating are spam bots. Only 1 in 10 million new members are real people, and the rest are bots? That is absurd.

While that number from k3lt01 may be exaggerated, I get several mails from fail2ban a day, reporting failed SSH access attempts to my Slackware mirror/torrent seeder. Those boxes that attempt to break in to that server are literally from all over the world, from Seoul to Kentucky. It is not that hard to imagine how many of those attempts come from machines where the user does know nothing about the connection attempts and just had not thought about the latest security hole or update.

What is absurd is neither of you can read plain English. Let me put it in words Ninety Nine Point Nine Nine Nine Nine Nine Nine Percent are spam bots. No exaggeration, just some people need glasses to see the point and not think its a comma. In other words read what is written not what you think is written.

That is not what k3lt01 said.

Linux systems get hacked and used for spam (and other nefarious purposes) all the time. Just because you have not seen it and it has never happened to you does not mean the risk can be ignored.

Arguing over the definition of "99%" is a distraction from the real issue.

Which exactly means that from 10 million mails you get only one is not a spam mail. You can't get half a mail or a tenth of a mail.
Therefore, if you have 99.999999 percent spam you must have at least got 10 million mails, otherwise you would get mails that are smaller than 1.0 mails from actual members, which is impossible.

But anyways, I think anyone can see your point.

Tobi, Last week I had 600 emails not one was genuine, that is 100%. Are you and Z038 going to say out of 10 million emails not one is a real person? If you follow on with your previous line of though then logically you would. That is absurd.

I did not exaggerate, I gave some leeway. You and one other person read more into a point than was actually there.

I can't say how many emails you get and how many of them are spam. You delivered those numbers, so we have to accept them as they are. This is why I say that you exaggerated, unless you tell me that you really got 10 million mails, otherwise it would be impossible you reached those numbers.

But as I already said, this is not really relevant, since anyone really should get what you wanted to tell us.