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Old 03-25-2005, 12:04 PM   #1
rsheridan6
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Experiences with toner refill kits?


I need to replace the toner cartridge for my Samsung ML 1710 B&W laser printer, and I had sticker shock at the retail price of a new cartridge. I can save a lot of money with one of those DIY toner refill kits, but I'm not sure whether they're any good or not, and a google search reveals nothing but people trying to sell them. So does anybody here have an opinion on this matter?
 
Old 03-25-2005, 05:00 PM   #2
thorn168
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As an A+ certified guy I would recommend that you buy new toner cartridges or new certified remanufactured cartridges. Refilling the toner in your old cartridge and using that cartridge in your printer will void the vendor warrenty. It may also end up destroying your printer.

Another a word of caution about laser printers: They are high voltages devices. Always turn them off or unplug them if you need to clear paper jams or replace a printer cartridge. You can be killed if you touch a charged up printer drum.

So work safe and be safe,

Thorn
 
Old 03-25-2005, 07:09 PM   #3
KimVette
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Quote:
Originally posted by thorn168
As an A+ certified guy I would recommend that you buy new toner cartridges or new certified remanufactured cartridges. Refilling the toner in your old cartridge and using that cartridge in your printer will void the vendor warrenty. It may also end up destroying your printer.

Another a word of caution about laser printers: They are high voltages devices. Always turn them off or unplug them if you need to clear paper jams or replace a printer cartridge. You can be killed if you touch a charged up printer drum.

So work safe and be safe,

Thorn
A+ is worth even less than an MCSE if you don't have the experience to back it up. Unfortunately there are a lot of "paper MCSE" types out there.

ANYWAY:

1. Clearing paper jams does not present danger while the unit is plugged in. In fact on many printers you may have to have it powered up to clear the jam. Printer manufacturers do not expose any unshielded high voltage components in areas where humans may have to access the paper path to clear a jam.

2. Toner refills are just fine - usually you can refill a cartridge ~5 times before the drum shows any degradation. Also, per precedents set in court, it cannot void your warranty unless it is the DIRECT cause of a component failure. Sure, if you dump an entire jug of toner into the cartridge rather than the few grams required, it will ruin the cartridge, and might possibly jam the printer, but it all comes down to RTFM. Heck, high-end laser printers (HP Laserjets need not apply! ) use refillable cartridges rather than disposable like the HP crap in the consumer market. Early on in the laser printer evolution refillable cartridges were the norm and not the exception.

3. Why do you have to cite your "A+ certification" when it only invites folks with years of experience to trip you up?
 
Old 03-25-2005, 08:18 PM   #4
toastermaker
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I used a refill kit for the black ink cartridge in my HP 940c deskjet. It wasn't too difficult.
Following the directions as best I could, I stopped trying to get more ink to go into the cartridge when it appeared to be full.
It only took about 1/3 of the ink from the refill kit, I thought that may be a bit odd but did not want to risk damaging something by overfilling.
Anywho, the refilled cartridge works well as far as printing goes but my printer started giving me the "low ink" warning really soon after installing the refilled cartridge.
I have always upon a low ink warning, pulled the cartridge, shook and lightly tapped it, then reinstalled the same cartridge to get a little more use out of it. The difference now, with the refilled cartridge is that I have pulled it and gave it the shake and tap a lot more times than I did with an OEM cartridge and it keeps printing.
The moral of my story is that whether or not through fault of my own, the low ink warning for the refilled cartridge seems to be set off while there is still considerable ink in the cartridge.

Best of luck,
 
Old 03-25-2005, 08:48 PM   #5
KimVette
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By the way - if you want to discuss ink cartridges rather than toner, systems like HP's and Lexmark's where the printhead is integrated into the disposable cartridge, you simply cannot damage the printer with a refill where the refill is done properly (e.g., a don't refill the cartridge while holding it over the printer dumbass kind of thing). There is a chance an air bubble or even coagulation of cheap ink can ruin the printhead, but remember: this is a printhead you were going to throw away eight refills ago, so who the heck cares? You just spent $12.00 on ink which lasted for eight refills, saving over $240, so what's another $30 for a new cartridge to replace the one which you'd have had to throw away anyhow?

It's similar to refilling toner cartridges, the only problem is if you do overfill a toner cartridge, there is a chance you can bind up the mechanism and damage the motor in the process. This is why you RTFM and do what TFM says and do not overfill the toner cartridge.
 
Old 03-25-2005, 09:31 PM   #6
Pauli
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Quote:
Originally posted by KimVette
A+ is worth even less than an MCSE if you don't have the experience to back it up. Unfortunately there are a lot of "paper MCSE" types out there.

ANYWAY:

1. Clearing paper jams does not present danger while the unit is plugged in. In fact on many printers you may have to have it powered up to clear the jam. Printer manufacturers do not expose any unshielded high voltage components in areas where humans may have to access the paper path to clear a jam.

2. Toner refills are just fine - usually you can refill a cartridge ~5 times before the drum shows any degradation. Also, per precedents set in court, it cannot void your warranty unless it is the DIRECT cause of a component failure. Sure, if you dump an entire jug of toner into the cartridge rather than the few grams required, it will ruin the cartridge, and might possibly jam the printer, but it all comes down to RTFM. Heck, high-end laser printers (HP Laserjets need not apply! ) use refillable cartridges rather than disposable like the HP crap in the consumer market. Early on in the laser printer evolution refillable cartridges were the norm and not the exception.

3. Why do you have to cite your "A+ certification" when it only invites folks with years of experience to trip you up?
*coughcoughcoughpwnedcoughcoughcough*



And trust me its hard to void a warranty. I've burned through soooooooooooooo many hard drives and they have yet to figure out that it was my fault
 
Old 03-27-2005, 12:44 AM   #7
thorn168
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Kim,

The machines that you refer to are HP & Lemxmark printers. How does that experience apply to the Samsung Printer?

Further more the poster stated that he is looking for information on how to refill the cartridges. If you are so superior in your experience then why have you not posted a how to; instead of a personal attack on my post and my credibility.

Also given the nature of the question I felt that it was prudent to advise the poster of the potential risks involved in servicing a laser printer.

As far as your comments about years of "experience";
I took my experience and put it to the test and passed.

Can you say the same?

Thorn
 
Old 03-27-2005, 04:27 AM   #8
Winno
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The other refill option would be taking the cartridge (inkjet or laser) to a place that refills them (eg cartridge world). I had my HP Deskjet refilled once and it wasn't bad. The degradation in my case was probably due to print heads crashing during paper jams.
 
Old 03-27-2005, 10:13 AM   #9
Pauli
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Quote:
Originally posted by thorn168
Kim,

The machines that you refer to are HP & Lemxmark printers. How does that experience apply to the Samsung Printer?

Further more the poster stated that he is looking for information on how to refill the cartridges. If you are so superior in your experience then why have you not posted a how to; instead of a personal attack on my post and my credibility.

Also given the nature of the question I felt that it was prudent to advise the poster of the potential risks involved in servicing a laser printer.

As far as your comments about years of "experience";
I took my experience and put it to the test and passed.

Can you say the same?

Thorn
I personally AM A+ certified, and trust me its a piece of paper. I did not learn how to fix computers from getting this paper, nor taking the exams. I do not find it helpful to insist on flouting it. I help people, I don't tell them how I'm qualified.


And Kim, you're wrong about MSCE. You go pass the exams and come back to me. I've seen them, they aren't A+, A+ is simple entry level stuff that most people can pass. You have to take like 7 exams and I have the books for studying for them. So before you talk shit, get out of this 'I hate microsfot' mode that all linux users seem to have.
 
Old 03-27-2005, 11:30 AM   #10
Crito
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Which Microsoft test covers repairing laser printers? There isn't one! The A+ tests cover a much broader range of topics. That even applies to the OS portion/test BTW, where I distinctly remember getting a question on USB support in Win95 OSR2. There's no single MS test that covers Windows 95, 98, ME, NT, 2000 and XP, like the 2004 A+ does. Of course, being focused on specific products, MS goes into far greater detail and depth. So the difference is breadth vs. depth. And , BTW, if you haven't tried the new 2004 A+ tests, you really should. It's much harder now than it used to be, IMHO. Looks like Linux+ is going same route, while Network+ actually got easier (go figure.)

Anywho, I never tried to refill laser toner, but on my injet it was a messy operation; you had to drill a hole, use a needle, and the cartridge was very easy to overfill. I'd personally go for the re-manufactured or new cartridge myself. If for no other reason than avoiding the possibility of cyan colored powder getting all over my white carpet and sofa.
 
Old 03-28-2005, 06:24 PM   #11
thorn168
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I am not here to debate the merits of A+ Certification.

I felt that refilling the toner posed a safety hazard. I still feel that way.

Thorn
 
Old 03-28-2005, 06:54 PM   #12
KimVette
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Don't base technical decisions on what you "feel" but what you know. A+ certification is totally worthless.
 
Old 03-28-2005, 09:45 PM   #13
vharishankar
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For once I must say that I agree with KimVette.

It is a big scam, this "original" cartridge business. Because printers are less expensive these days, the manufacturers are deliberately introducing a policy of "original" cartridges only which are ridiculously priced and thus increasing recurring costs to the customer by more than 1000%.

An old B/W inkjet printer that I have can print 1000 or more pages with 1 cartridge.

Most modern printers that come cheap have cartridges that can only print 100 pages! Ridiculous and enormously expensive, especially when you consider colour cartridges. And I'm only talking about inkjet printers.

That's the reason why I've postponed buying a printer for a very very long time. The deal is increasingly loaded against the customer because the manufacturers are making a huge profit, not out of printer sales, but of the sales of consumables. Since this cost is recurring and more frequent (since number of pages is less), they are assured of a good profit on the sale of a single printer.

The actual ink used is not expensive at all. My uncle, who is an electronics engineer, can testify to this. He has successfully used and refilled cartridges with excellent quality ink at just a fraction of the price of "genuine" replacements. It is a marketing tactic to sell more printers by reducing their price and then charging the moon for the consumable products, namely the cartridges.
 
Old 03-28-2005, 11:07 PM   #14
thorn168
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This is a classic apple to oranges comparison.

inkjet cartridges are NOT like laser cartridges. It is as simple as that.

I said this before and I will say it again Kim: "If you are so superior in your experience then why have you not posted a how to; instead of a personal attack on my post(s) and my credibility."

Give us a How to: on Samsung ML 1710 B&W laser printer cartridge refills preferably with a series of digital photos to illustrate the disassembly, refill process and reassembly of the cartridge in question.
 
Old 03-28-2005, 11:13 PM   #15
vharishankar
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I was expressing a general opinion on printer cartridges, not a howto.

Be it inkjet or laserjet, the manufacturers are always making a profit on the sales of consumables rather than on the actual device.

The lower costs are just a myth. In the long run, the cost of using a printer are higher today than it was 5 or 6 years ago.
 
  


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