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Old 02-12-2013, 01:34 PM   #16
NyteOwl
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What OS are you using on these ? I have 500Mb Linux swap partition also on this desktop, still not helping. Appears the older Oses are crashing as they are not able to recognize the more recent flat panel monitor.
They all have Slackware on them (though I have used Debian on at least one of them as well). Originally 13.1 but with various updates/upgrades. The Celeron is a Thinkpad. They have been connected at different times to both CRT and LCD monitors. They usen Radeon 7200/7500 (32/64MB) PCI for graphics (onboard Trident disabled).

Last edited by NyteOwl; 02-12-2013 at 01:37 PM. Reason: Forgot the quoted part so added manaully.
 
Old 02-12-2013, 05:42 PM   #17
rvijay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NyteOwl View Post
They all have Slackware on them (though I have used Debian on at least one of them as well). Originally 13.1 but with various updates/upgrades. The Celeron is a Thinkpad. They have been connected at different times to both CRT and LCD monitors. They usen Radeon 7200/7500 (32/64MB) PCI for graphics (onboard Trident disabled).
Thanks. This experience taught me few basic stuff so far:
1. The older OSes are ok, it is more about using the right boot options and xsetup so that the OS works ok in the graphical interface.
2. It helps to keep an older PC updated promptly, resolve any issues and keep extra copies of the OS, applications etc.,
3. Revise using this PC every 6 months, look for any related updates on net etc.,
4. Be on lookout for cheap hardware upgrades and make use of them when available. This will also help if something fails, specially the power supply.
5. Assist others with older PCs to get better use from them.
6. DL and try using different OSes for older PCs. Don't relay on just one OS.
7. Keep a file with notes on any issues encountered, how they were solved, vital tips etc., Keep a printout of this file and also burn this file to CD/DVD.
8. Keep in touch with others who use such older PCs or start a forum, email list for this.
9. Retrocomputing - When folks are using such old PCs, it shouldn't be an issue to use PCs just a decade or so old.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retrocomputing
10. If it really becomes junk and doesn't work, there here are some tips on how to let go of sentiments and declutter:
http://www.azcentral.com/style/hfe/decor/a...purge.html
I admit that I am sentimentally attached to this PC and from net can see that several others are also.
11. Minimalistic Computing:
For most basic routine tasks, older PCs are still ok. A very fast, latest PC is not needed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimalist_computing

Also, here is a wonderful OS that seems suitable for older PCs:
http://delicate-linux.net/
I will try this later and see how it goes.
 
Old 02-13-2013, 02:45 PM   #18
dillon101001
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Wink vector linux

vector Linux.

it has internet and email
and has a similarity to windows 98

requirments

66 MHz Intel Pentium 1
166 MHz Intel Pentium MMX

16mb RAM
24mb recommended
 
Old 02-13-2013, 03:19 PM   #19
rvijay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dillon101001 View Post
vector Linux.

it has internet and email
and has a similarity to windows 98

requirments

66 MHz Intel Pentium 1
166 MHz Intel Pentium MMX

16mb RAM
24mb recommended
I used to use Vector Linux 3.2 before, almost first linux distro I tried, it had several hardware issues and I got assistance at their forum but all that is gone now. Which version of Vector Linux is this that you use ? Present light version of Vector Linux needs a more advanced PC that than it appears.

Thanks.
 
Old 02-13-2013, 05:01 PM   #20
lykwydchykyn
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I explored some linux and non-linux options for machines of this age a while back; here are my thoughts:

http://www.alandmoore.com/blog/2012/...ossible-tasks/

I have a few P2 machines that I've shoved as much RAM into as possible; if you get up above 128MB and keep your desktop REALLY minimal they aren't half-bad.
 
Old 02-13-2013, 05:31 PM   #21
TobiSGD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lykwydchykyn View Post
I explored some linux and non-linux options for machines of this age a while back; here are my thoughts:

http://www.alandmoore.com/blog/2012/...ossible-tasks/

I have a few P2 machines that I've shoved as much RAM into as possible; if you get up above 128MB and keep your desktop REALLY minimal they aren't half-bad.
Just had a look at KolibriOS mentioned in the article you linked to. For basic usage or as temporary system that really looks promising, especially with the very low hardware requirements. I will have a look at that OS in a VM later on, thanks for that.
 
Old 02-14-2013, 03:33 AM   #22
rvijay
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Knoppix 3.5 - Hard drive install failed to boot. So deleted this.
VL 7.0 std - Said bootable CD not found
VL 7.0 light - long time to install, like 4 hours, took the entire 3G partition, just basic JWM window Manager. No more space to upgrade to Light level. So, uninstalled this.

Puppy Quirky 1.4 Live CD - works like a charm. Browser takes 30 seconds to load, rest of the apps take a few seconds to load. Once booted, the Live CD can be released easily. Hard drive install doesn't boot tho. Grub fails to be detected on boot and gives disk failure. However, this is a very minor issue. For now my choice of OS for this PC is Puppy Quirky 1.4 But for the few seconds delays, it works exactly the same way as my present PC for what I wish to do. (Only thing is there is no DVD reader on it, but this is not needed).

Quote:
Originally Posted by lykwydchykyn View Post
I explored some linux and non-linux options for machines of this age a while back; here are my thoughts:

http://www.alandmoore.com/blog/2012/...ossible-tasks/

I have a few P2 machines that I've shoved as much RAM into as possible; if you get up above 128MB and keep your desktop REALLY minimal they aren't half-bad.
Thanks for that useful link. How did they work well in those days with so little Ram ? I use Linux Swap partition for RAM however these days, it is more convenient.

I also downloaded the real tiny OS that you mentioned. These older PCs can be used for dedicated specific tasks. For eg., one man in local freecycle was looking for a stand alone PC to play Chess. Others use them as Webservers, routers, wifi hotspot etc., based on net posts.

I recollect now, I had an i386 first, it was slow to load images I think. These were the days of the BBS.

Then I had a Pentium 1. AT&T 75 Mhz PC, Don't recall the amount of Ram in it. It worked quite well for several years and cost a lot. Only reason I threw it was that it will not power on all the time. Sometimes, it took several tries to get it to boot. This PC helped me do a lot of things, including job search, entertainment. I have opened this PC a few times but didn't see anything wrong inside it back then. Was not technically inclined to change the PS on it etc.,

Later someone I knew gave me 386 and also a Pentium 1 Very old and used. This was before the days of CD writers. I used them to learn floppy Linux and couldn't do anything else above that. So I recycled these also.

That small OS must have worked great on these PCs. I should have looked for info. on net to repair these PCs but just kept it to myself. Also, I bought into the idea that newer and bigger is better.

It will be helpful to have a nice set of OSes and tips in advance to mend such old PCs if needed and Oses to use them. As someone said there must be a number of homes with one such dinosaur PC waiting to be revived.

As an aside, I still like pen and paper a lot, still use fountain pens. There is still a huge community that appreciates all these retro things and still finds them useful. It is just a matter of connecting with them and then learning.

I was curious as to how long this PC will last. I guess it is mostly related to how long the PSU lasts. Modern PSUs are more advanced, can heat the internals and affect other parts.

Found some interesting links in this regard:
http://forums.cnet.com/7723-7586_102...ktop-computer/

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=1720

I checked out some used PC buying tips and realized that, a lot of the used PCs may have been used a lot and they may not have much life left in them. So it helps to know the seller of a used PC:
http://www.computerhope.com/btips/desktop.htm
and
http://sustainablog.org/2008/09/10-s...op-that-works/

I was wondering why my PC has lasted so long. I used it for only 4 to 6 hours a day on average when I used it. Sometimes, not even that. Also, have not used it at all in the last 6 years, so it still has a lot of life on it. These days I use PC for perhaps 3 hours a day or even lesser.

Around 1997 or so, I also used something called the Brother Geobook:
http://www.cnet.com/laptops/brother-...-30000475.html
Based on the link provided here earlier, now it appears this Geobook used a custom version of the BEOS software called Geos OS. I was pretty happy with this also but then it has no graphics and the screen also has a bright glow. Also, it was heavy. It got stolen a long time ago in 1999.

I also liked the older pocket organizers, come to think of it, they must have used some sort of Linux also it appears. I never expected to think this far but now am glad I started this thread. It is telling me to keep my eyes open and keep learning about linux, older PCs. This may feel like being in a Ghost Town but if the PC works and there is a need for it, better use it than trash it.

I am mistaken on two counts. First, I saw posts that folks using FreeBSD 2.2.1 or 2.2.5 were able to run them ok on PCs with similar specs to mine.

Second, Geos was its own OS, this post is also an eye opener in several ways:
http://www.linuxondesktop.in/2007/03...on-ubuntu.html

I have also used the Vax/Vms system with green terminals and the earlier IBM PCs that were DOS based I think. They were also quite cool to use, were practical and did their job well. Usenet was also very popular then. It is almost gone now.

I mostly read eBooks like this on my PC:
http://www.gutenberg.org/dirs/4/2/0/9/42091/42091-0.txt

This is very light work for the CPU and doesn't strain it much. Hence, this can also be a factor in my PCs lasting longer. Also, I read for about an hour or so daily.

On a different note, in reflection, a floppy disk can be one of the most secure devices for small data. Most new PCs don't come with a floppy disk and those with old PCs don't use them. Wish I didn't throw away my floppy disks before.

Please share anything else in regards to older PCs or older OSes that you are aware here. It will be interesting for me to read this in my spare time and may also come in handy sometime. Thanks in advance.

Last edited by unSpawn; 05-21-2013 at 04:42 PM.
 
Old 02-14-2013, 03:29 PM   #23
vladimir1986
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Meh, don't listen to those people asking you to buy a new PC

I have muLinux running on a Pentium 1, 133mhz 16mb Ram, It provides me Internet and X, It boots quick and works like a charm. It is based on Slackware: You install the main thing, on a single floppy, and then install the other packages who provide you programs or funcionality. Needs 14 mb of Ram with X, abiword, mpeg123 to play an mp3 xli to view pics and the links browser (on graphic mode)


http://www.micheleandreoli.it/mulinux/
 
Old 02-14-2013, 04:29 PM   #24
frieza
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladimir1986 View Post
Meh, don't listen to those people asking you to buy a new PC

I have muLinux running on a Pentium 1, 133mhz 16mb Ram, It provides me Internet and X, It boots quick and works like a charm. It is based on Slackware: You install the main thing, on a single floppy, and then install the other packages who provide you programs or funcionality. Needs 14 mb of Ram with X, abiword, mpeg123 to play an mp3 xli to view pics and the links browser (on graphic mode)


http://www.micheleandreoli.it/mulinux/
thank-you ^^
the problem here is called PERCEIVED obsolescence created by the corporate marketing machine, not ACTUAL obsolescence, if it works, it can still be used, even if it can't run modern games and/or play modern media, there are things that can be done with the computer (add a network card, use it as a server for instance).

granted, if the machine breaks, then it might not be worth fixing, but UNTIL it breaks, why throw it out?
 
Old 02-14-2013, 04:43 PM   #25
lykwydchykyn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladimir1986 View Post
Meh, don't listen to those people asking you to buy a new PC

I have muLinux running on a Pentium 1, 133mhz 16mb Ram, It provides me Internet and X, It boots quick and works like a charm. It is based on Slackware: You install the main thing, on a single floppy, and then install the other packages who provide you programs or funcionality. Needs 14 mb of Ram with X, abiword, mpeg123 to play an mp3 xli to view pics and the links browser (on graphic mode)


http://www.micheleandreoli.it/mulinux/
I definitely need to check this out for those old machines I got.
 
Old 02-14-2013, 05:07 PM   #26
rvijay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frieza View Post
thank-you ^^
the problem here is called PERCEIVED obsolescence created by the corporate marketing machine, not ACTUAL obsolescence, if it works, it can still be used, even if it can't run modern games and/or play modern media, there are things that can be done with the computer (add a network card, use it as a server for instance).

granted, if the machine breaks, then it might not be worth fixing, but UNTIL it breaks, why throw it out?
On a related note, I can use older hardware as I read more and don't care for graphics that much. There are those who need graphics for work and entertainment. The need is never ending in this regard. However, sometimes this is good as it gives access to those with lesser resources access to such used systems. Due to ebooks, several paper books are being discarded these days.

Older PCs can be used as a backup PC. However, this is rarely mentioned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vladimir1986 View Post
Meh, don't listen to those people asking you to buy a new PC

I have muLinux running on a Pentium 1, 133mhz 16mb Ram, It provides me Internet and X, It boots quick and works like a charm. It is based on Slackware: You install the main thing, on a single floppy, and then install the other packages who provide you programs or funcionality. Needs 14 mb of Ram with X, abiword, mpeg123 to play an mp3 xli to view pics and the links browser (on graphic mode)

http://www.micheleandreoli.it/mulinux/
Thanks for this link, Mulinux is good I heard. I had a copy several years ago, however threw it along with several others. Now I see the need to keep older OSes and also spare parts for older PCs. Specially the PSU.

Yesterday, I also found several games that are simple and can be use with Puppy Linux on this old PC:
http://www.smokey01.com/bruceb/pets_n_stuff.html

Tablet PCs are becoming more common, convenient and mobile. They can be used as the main PC for normal tasks and an older PC with USB support can be used to transfer lot of data to it etc., Here is an article on Early Tablet PCs and their OSes:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_tablet_computers

These tablet PCs are also expected with Linux in the future:
http://www.zdnet.com/2013-the-year-o...ne-7000009254/

Perhaps, these OSes can also be tried on older PCs.

Last edited by unSpawn; 05-21-2013 at 04:43 PM.
 
Old 02-15-2013, 02:18 PM   #27
mjolnir
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@rvijay I didn't have any ebooks on a box to test, I usually d/l them straight to my Kindle. I did have some .pdf files that I reformat to fit my ereader and they display nicely from the Cli, no gui, using a framebuffer if you have it installed or gnu "less". You can also use "fmt" and "less" on low powered machines.

http://wiki.mobileread.com/wiki/Comm...e_eBook_Reader

Code:
fmt Test.txt | less
Code:
less Test.pdf
Code:
fbgs Test.pdf
I have Knoppix 3.7 on several old computers similar to yours. KolibriOs has some cool games on it. Not my thing but cool for the kids.
 
Old 02-15-2013, 03:50 PM   #28
rvijay
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Thanks to all the support here so far. Here is another site I found about old computers:
http://www.old-computers.com/news/default.asp

I feel nostalgic about older PCs and have a special feeling when I use them. I had many good times with my old PCs. They served me very well. I am very glad I started this thread and learned here instead of just trashing my EXCELLENT old pc.


Due to Moore's law, it appears most folks will upgrade long before the lifespan of their PC is up. At this rate, tablet PCs will cost like 25 bucks in a few years and will be better than older PCs. Most are pressed for time these days, don't have time to test older PC with older software, learn etc., So, it is expected that most will just trash their older PCs instead of trying to use them. Sad but reality.
 
Old 02-15-2013, 04:29 PM   #29
frieza
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvijay View Post
Thanks to all the support here so far. Here is another site I found about old computers:
http://www.old-computers.com/news/default.asp

I feel nostalgic about older PCs and have a special feeling when I use them. I had many good times with my old PCs. They served me very well. I am very glad I started this thread and learned here instead of just trashing my EXCELLENT old pc.


Due to Moore's law, it appears most folks will upgrade long before the lifespan of their PC is up. At this rate, tablet PCs will cost like 25 bucks in a few years and will be better than older PCs. Most are pressed for time these days, don't have time to test older PC with older software, learn etc., So, it is expected that most will just trash their older PCs instead of trying to use them. Sad but reality.
yep, that's exactly the point i was trying to make
i actually, up until recently, had a 286 PC with 4 megs of ram and a 10BaseT Ethernet card that could do basic web surfing with a dos-based browser called arachne, and i could play old classic dos games such as wolfenstein 3d.

sometimes people want old hardware because of nostalgia, sometimes people need the old hardware because they have specialized devices that would be TOO expensive to upgrade that aren't compatible with anything newer (yes i do know someone who has such a situation, he runs a machine shop and the software doesn't run well on anything newer than windows 98)
either way, the attitude of throwing out a perfectly working pc just because it doesn't have the flashy features of modern computers and can't do some modern tasks is incredibly stupid and i find it sickening.
 
Old 02-15-2013, 05:15 PM   #30
rvijay
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I agree with you. One thing I notice is that folks tend to discard older desktops when they have to move. Moves are challenging and folks try to discard what they can before they move.
 
  


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