LinuxQuestions.org
Help answer threads with 0 replies.
Go Back   LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Linux Forums > Linux - Distributions > Fedora
User Name
Password
Fedora This forum is for the discussion of the Fedora Project.

Notices

Reply
 
Search this Thread
Old 06-24-2012, 05:36 PM   #1
darthaxul
Member
 
Registered: Aug 2008
Distribution: Gentoo; Funtoo
Posts: 197

Rep: Reputation: 18
fedora 18 bootloader


Just can't help but think about all those people that made donations/contributions at one point or another...
http://www.geek.com/articles/news/re...8-pcs-2012061/
 
Old 06-24-2012, 06:07 PM   #2
syg00
LQ Veteran
 
Registered: Aug 2003
Location: Australia
Distribution: Lots ...
Posts: 12,129

Rep: Reputation: 986Reputation: 986Reputation: 986Reputation: 986Reputation: 986Reputation: 986Reputation: 986Reputation: 986
Hardly (new) news.
I was a bit shocked when I originally read Matthews blog, but this is what happens when one company has a near monopoly.

Lucky the original proposal to make (Microsoft owned) keys mandatory and not disable-able got successfully fought.
I would expect the other mega distro makers to have to follow suit eventually.
 
Old 06-24-2012, 06:59 PM   #3
TobiSGD
Moderator
 
Registered: Dec 2009
Location: Hanover, Germany
Distribution: Gentoo
Posts: 15,438
Blog Entries: 2

Rep: Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001
Not this again. They even admit that the title is wrong later in the article (they are NOT paying Microsoft).
I wonder what people expected? Fedora is NOT a community distro, it is the testbed for a commercial Linux distribution, nothing more. And since Secure Boot will unarguably be a requirement sooner or later for any larger company buying new machines (which is not bad at all, since it actually makes machines more secure) Red Hat has to go this way if they want to stay in the competition. Ubuntu, also backed up by a commercial entity, will do the same (they already announced that).
If that bothers you, just don't use Ubuntu or Fedora, load your own key into the hardware and sign the OS/bootloader/kernel of your choice with it. Or simply disable Secure Boot.
 
Old 06-25-2012, 03:13 AM   #4
John VV
Guru
 
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 12,694

Rep: Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687
whether secure boot is good or bad or can be turned on or off is for some other place

the one big issue is one company with a very bad track record of " playing nice" with others
has control of ALL the keys
 
Old 06-25-2012, 05:52 AM   #5
TobiSGD
Moderator
 
Registered: Dec 2009
Location: Hanover, Germany
Distribution: Gentoo
Posts: 15,438
Blog Entries: 2

Rep: Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001
Quote:
Originally Posted by John VV View Post
the one big issue is one company with a very bad track record of " playing nice" with others
has control of ALL the keys
Yes, they have some keys. In no way ALL of the keys. And as soon as Secure Boot is distributed widely they don't have the ability anymore to misuse their might. They can't just blacklist Red Hat or Ubuntu suddenly for fun, because they will have to face serious consequences. Want to blacklist Red Hat? Wait, that will bring down the NYSE and many computers of the armed forces. It doesn't work as simple as most people think, because they can't selectively shut only only a few computers down, it is an all or nothing thing.
Besides that, everyone that really has fears that something like that will happen will easily be able to just turn secure boot off or use their own keys.
This "Oh, now they have all the keys!" thing is not true and in my eyes nothing more than FUD.
 
Old 06-25-2012, 04:08 PM   #6
John VV
Guru
 
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 12,694

Rep: Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687
they can not block everything
but oops'es ???



Quote:
They can't just blacklist Red Hat or Ubuntu suddenly for fun,
then why did Microsoft list
"donate.fsf.org" as a "gambling site "
and block people from donating to the free software foundation on windows networks

http://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/d...-gambling-site

Last edited by John VV; 06-25-2012 at 04:10 PM.
 
Old 06-25-2012, 04:24 PM   #7
TobiSGD
Moderator
 
Registered: Dec 2009
Location: Hanover, Germany
Distribution: Gentoo
Posts: 15,438
Blog Entries: 2

Rep: Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001
Quote:
Originally Posted by John VV View Post
they can not block everything
but oops'es ???
Ooopses would be very damaging to Microsoft's image. Or would you trust an OS developer to run your mission critical systems if they aren't even handle to run a signing service? Also, you can be sure that there would be at least one entity, be it the FSF or anyone else, that would instantly sue Microsoft and they don't need another antitrust trial. Oh, and may be the NYSE or anyone else running Red Hat would also go down (or not come up in the morning), which would not be very good for a stock company in general and especially if it is the company that brings the stock market down.

Quote:
then why did Microsoft list
"donate.fsf.org" as a "gambling site "
and block people from donating to the free software foundation on windows networks

http://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/d...-gambling-site
Dead link.
Funny, I can visit that site from my Vista system and I really doubt that I can't donate. I am currently short on money, otherwise I would just give it a try.
But anyways, what has this to do with preventing to run other OSes? How should that give them any use? Microsoft is currently having serious problems on the markets in India, Russia and China, which are the biggest markets on this planet. Especially when it comes to China, do you really think such a behavior as blocking out other OSes will do them any good?
The marketing department and the shareholders will blast Steve Ballmer into the orbit if he even thinks about this.
 
Old 06-25-2012, 06:53 PM   #8
John VV
Guru
 
Registered: Aug 2005
Posts: 12,694

Rep: Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687Reputation: 1687
the link is not dead
it works just fine
http://www.fsf.org/blogs/community/d...-gambling-site
 
Old 06-25-2012, 07:34 PM   #9
TobiSGD
Moderator
 
Registered: Dec 2009
Location: Hanover, Germany
Distribution: Gentoo
Posts: 15,438
Blog Entries: 2

Rep: Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001Reputation: 4001
Of course, after you corrected it. In my quoted text from you it is still not working. But anyways, I can't see why this is related to the discussion. The entry in the database (that consists several million entries, I would guess) is already corrected. This has nothing to do with a few keys they have to manage.
 
Old 06-27-2012, 01:31 PM   #10
Lsatenstein
Member
 
Registered: Jul 2005
Location: Montreal Canada
Distribution: Fedora Core 6 XEN
Posts: 194
Blog Entries: 1

Rep: Reputation: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by TobiSGD View Post
Not this again. They even admit that the title is wrong later in the article (they are NOT paying Microsoft).
I wonder what people expected? Fedora is NOT a community distro, it is the testbed for a commercial Linux distribution, nothing more. And since Secure Boot will unarguably be a requirement sooner or later for any larger company buying new machines (which is not bad at all, since it actually makes machines more secure) Red Hat has to go this way if they want to stay in the competition. Ubuntu, also backed up by a commercial entity, will do the same (they already announced that).
If that bothers you, just don't use Ubuntu or Fedora, load your own key into the hardware and sign the OS/bootloader/kernel of your choice with it. Or simply disable Secure Boot.
Actually, the only pure community distributions that I know about are Linux From Scratch, Debian, Centos, Scientific Linux, Mint and many others.
And needless to say, all the distributions from A to Z and 0 to 9 work with and rely on the communities. Both UBUNTU and Red Hat are commercial versions. Pretty soon UBUNTU will ask for money to support their development. Developers need some candies to enjoy.
 
  


Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Fedora 14 Bootloader Options njozwiak Fedora 1 04-17-2011 11:14 AM
fedora 3 bootloader antiseven Fedora - Installation 1 07-26-2005 03:22 PM
restoring fedora 3 bootloader pcandpc Linux - Newbie 8 05-16-2005 10:18 PM
Install Fedora without bootloader ? How ieeestd802 Linux - Software 3 10-05-2004 02:31 AM
Fedora Core 1- Config bootloader? littlewhinging Linux - Software 2 04-06-2004 09:05 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:05 PM.

Main Menu
My LQ
Write for LQ
LinuxQuestions.org is looking for people interested in writing Editorials, Articles, Reviews, and more. If you'd like to contribute content, let us know.
Main Menu
Syndicate
RSS1  Latest Threads
RSS1  LQ News
Twitter: @linuxquestions
identi.ca: @linuxquestions
Facebook: linuxquestions Google+: linuxquestions
Open Source Consulting | Domain Registration