LinuxQuestions.org
Visit the LQ Articles and Editorials section
Go Back   LinuxQuestions.org > Forums > Linux Forums > Linux - Distributions > Debian
User Name
Password
Debian This forum is for the discussion of Debian Linux.

Notices

Reply
 
Search this Thread
Old 07-03-2012, 08:53 PM   #31
jefro
Guru
 
Registered: Mar 2008
Posts: 11,954

Rep: Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482Reputation: 1482

Simple answer might involve what are the other Ham Radio proggies using. And what is a proggie?

Why are the proggies using that distro or OS?
 
Old 07-04-2012, 09:34 AM   #32
cynwulf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2005
Distribution: OpenBSD, FreeBSD
Posts: 1,378

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
Quote:
Originally Posted by widget View Post
There are some very large problems there. Stepping on users right to free speech (it seems friendly criticism is against the rules now) is driving more away.
You're talking of the forums? I'm not sure one needs to use the forums in order to use the distro, but I agree that there are problems there and when it comes to official forums, the poor attitudes of the admin/staff will always reflect poorly on the distro itself. IMO 'buntu are losing popularity for several reasons however.

Mint apparently do a much better job of doing what 'buntu were doing, which is probably why they've knocked 'buntu off the top spot - that's the nature of FOSS and that's why shuttleworth's project was doomed from the start. It doesn't matter how much money you throw at it, someone can always fork your distro and give users what they want, so trying to force a certain type of "user experience" and other unwanted features is a futile exercise - this natural process stops "big" distros from getting too big for their boots and monopolising.

Last edited by cynwulf; 07-04-2012 at 09:36 AM.
 
Old 07-04-2012, 10:34 AM   #33
cascade9
Senior Member
 
Registered: Mar 2011
Location: Brisneyland
Distribution: Debian, aptosid
Posts: 3,718

Rep: Reputation: 904Reputation: 904Reputation: 904Reputation: 904Reputation: 904Reputation: 904Reputation: 904Reputation: 904
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckNekkid View Post
I was told to get Xbuntu 10.4 OR 10.10. Well, they ran out of
support, so it went to the 11 series then the 12 series. 12.4 of
Xbuntu or Ubuntu is supposed to be the latest. Then when I
wrote here I got other advice, like Debian and there not being
much difference than Xbuntu.
I'm one of the people who advised you that debian wont be much different to ubuntu.

If you have the 'right' hardware its just as easy to get debian going as a *buntu IMO.

A lot of the reason why ubuntu and its versions are seen as 'easier for newbies' is because of 'jockey', a GUI for installing drivers.

With a dell 2400, there is no closed drivers for video avaible, and no wireless at all. So having the addition of tool for driver installation wont help.

Ubuntu used pulse audio by defualt, which can be a pain with some programs as a lot of them were written for alsa. That could be an issue with the ham radio software you are planning to run.

Ubuntu wont have made any tools to assist with ham radio software, they would be using the same software they got from debian. So if there is any different between debian and ubuntu for ham radio, its ubuntu that would be harder.

BTW, ubuntu versions are year:month. They are always released on the 4th and 10th month of any year. So its 10.04 (april 2010), 10.10 (october 2010), etc..

10.04 and 12.04 are 'LTS' (Long Term Support) versions. 10.04 is still supported, but IMO you would be better off with a debian anyway *see below*

Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckNekkid View Post
Now, as a , this is real confusing to me. I see
Debian Squeeze and a Debian 6, so again I'm stuck with which
is best and easiest.
Here is the simple version-

Debian releases software in stages. Software is 1st released on 'unstable' or 'sid'. Once its been tested there for a while, it moves into 'testing' (currently 'wheezy'). Every few years, debian 'freezes' testing (stops bringing new software and new versions of current software in from 'unstable').

When testing is frozen, it goes through a fair amount of user testing, and when debian is happy that its all working and 100% stable, the frozen testing version becomes 'stable' and the version that was 'stable' becomes 'old stable' (and support is continued for a while as well).

So currently, debian 'stable' is version 6.0, 'squeeze', testing is 'wheezy' and frozen. Sometime in the next 3-9 months debian 7.0 'wheezy' will become the 'stable' version.

I'd suggest installing debian 'wheezy' over 'squeeze' now BuckNekkid.

Dont be worried about the frozen testing status, it will be stable. By the time that debian testing has been frozen for a few weeks, for desktop use on older hardware its pretty much 100% sorted out.
 
1 members found this post helpful.
Old 07-04-2012, 02:41 PM   #34
guyonearth
Member
 
Registered: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Distribution: SolydX
Posts: 399

Rep: Reputation: 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by widget View Post
I note that Ubuntu is not mentioned as your distro.

As a long time Ubuntu dev release tester and Ubuntu user I can tell you that if you look at the Ubuntu Forums and have used them before that usage is down. Many Ubuntu users are leaving for other distros.

There is a reason for this. Ubuntu has, starting really with 10.04, done some really strange things with dependencies of packages. They are also continually removing configuration tools (Gnome is big on this too).

The testing community there has been gutted. Where in 10.04 we had somewhere in the area of 125 experienced testers, 12.04 had 12.

There are some very large problems there. Stepping on users right to free speech (it seems friendly criticism is against the rules now) is driving more away.

This is good for Linux Mint (Ubuntu respin) and Debian mainly but some other distros are benefitting too.

Linux Mint also puts out LMDE. Linux Mint Debian Edition. I have, as I said, tested several Ubuntu pre release OS's and used many released OS's. LMDE does a better job of taming the instability of Debian testing. It, like the Ubuntu LTS releases, is based on Debian testing. I am not particularly a fan of their package management system that allows LMDE to be so stable but I have it installed on here and it is very reliable and stable. More so than say 12.04.

I used to recommend Ubuntu to noobs. Now it is LMDE.

Personally, I use Debian testing, currently Wheezy as my production OS. Squeeze, Debian stable, on which 10.04 was based, is my secure install and no harder to set up than Ubuntu if you follow the advice on the sources.list thread on these forums;
http://www.linuxquestions.org/questi...e-list-330913/

The difficulty of setting up Debian compared to Ubuntu was much more true in the time of Ubuntu 8.04 and Lenny (Debian 5) than it is today.

When Wheezy is released it will be ahead of Ubuntu 12.04 as that is frozen to the packages in the Wheezy repo that were current when it was released.

All Ubuntu releases except the LTS releases are based on Debian Sid (Debian unstable). This makes them pretty up to date but not up to Sid as it continues on.

The Ubuntu definition of stable is conciderably different than the Debian definition. While 10.04 and Sqeeze will have a very similar end life date, Squeeze will be supported longer.

Wheezy will obviously be released later than 12.04. It will also be much more stable and have some newer packages.

I keep mentioning Ubuntu LTS because that is the Ubuntu stable release. Their regular releases are actually the preperation stage for the next LTS. Some of them are great. I particularly liked 9.04. This is why they are not supported for as long as the LTS.

Debian testing is "based" if you want to look at it that way on Sid too. Packages migrate there directly from Sid.

If you want cutting edge go with Sid and be careful. If you want stability go with Squeeze.

If you want uncertainty go with Ubuntu.

I will say that the last Ubuntu-testing release that I participated in testing was Xubuntu 12.04 and it, inspite of the "improvements" on Xfce by adding Gnome packages that make it harder to configure but add little except a larger base install size of about 20% over a Debian testing Xfce install (and Debian includes things like aptitude that Ubuntu removes), is a very nice OS.

The Ubuntu/Canonical thinking seems to be that what users want is the same lack of choice that they get with MS installs. This will make the transition easier I guess.

If someone is trying to switch from an OS that they are dissatisfidied with to something different, I think this approach is silly. Such people are obviously able and willing to learn something new and want something different.

Try not to be so defensive. You appear to like Ubuntu. Use it. This is Linux, it is your box and your choice.

The OP on this thread asked a question, in the Debian section, specifically about the relative stability of Debian releases due to confusion over the numerical designation and code name of Squeeze.

Folks are trying to explain what Debian means by stability and that Debian 6.anything is the same as Squeeze.

I am sure that the OP is perfectly able to go to any of the other distro areas of LQ and look into those distros with folks that use them.

Probably capable of even getting several Live CD/DVDs of several distros and trying them.

Many of the people that spend most of there time on LQ in the Debian section are ex Ubuntu users of long experience. Due to starting with Ubuntu and getting tired of their treatment by Ubuntu they have decided to use the source of Ubuntu.

The LM forum is also full of ex Ubuntu users for similar reasons. I do not see the point of LM as it is a respin of Ubuntu which is a respin of Debian. A respin of a respin seems silly to me.

On of the best testers of Ubuntu dev releases in a pillar of the LMDE forum. Loves it. They do a great job.

One of the main differences between Ubuntu and LMDE is that if you decide that you are ready to actually control your own computer and maintain the real Debian, you can switch to the Debian repos and have full compatibility.

Do not try that with an Ubuntu install.
Your missive here has actually prompted me to give Debian another try....
One question though, why doesn't someone do something about that sappy default wallpaper and login theme? It's not exactly confidence inspiring.
 
Old 07-04-2012, 02:45 PM   #35
273
Senior Member
 
Registered: Dec 2011
Location: UK
Distribution: Debian Sid AMD64, Raspbian Wheezy, various VMs
Posts: 3,508

Rep: Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyonearth View Post
Your missive here has actually prompted me to give Debian another try....
One question though, why doesn't someone do something about that sappy default wallpaper and login theme? It's not exactly confidence inspiring.
If you're referring to the space type theme then somebody else shares your view because it has been changed in Debian's unstable branch Sid. Whether it will change in current Stable or not I couldn't say but I suspect it won't.
 
Old 07-04-2012, 05:26 PM   #36
62chevy
Member
 
Registered: Mar 2002
Location: West (By God) Virginia
Distribution: Debian Squeeze - Sid
Posts: 281

Rep: Reputation: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by 273 View Post
If you're referring to the space type theme then somebody else shares your view because it has been changed in Debian's unstable branch Sid. Whether it will change in current Stable or not I couldn't say but I suspect it won't.

No but it might change in Wheezy which would be nice. It's called Joy and some SpaceFun is still in there if you want it. LOL!

Others will have to judge for themselves but I like the theme.
 
Old 07-04-2012, 05:48 PM   #37
273
Senior Member
 
Registered: Dec 2011
Location: UK
Distribution: Debian Sid AMD64, Raspbian Wheezy, various VMs
Posts: 3,508

Rep: Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800Reputation: 800
Quote:
Originally Posted by 62chevy View Post
No but it might change in Wheezy which would be nice. It's called Joy and some SpaceFun is still in there if you want it. LOL!

Others will have to judge for themselves but I like the theme.
True, and it might be time to consider Wheezy for a home system.
I have nothing against Space Fun, but I have to say I prefer the cleaner new scheme.
 
Old 07-04-2012, 06:59 PM   #38
Randicus Draco Albus
Senior Member
 
Registered: May 2011
Location: Wallowing in a pit of despair.
Distribution: OpenBSD
Posts: 1,342
Blog Entries: 4

Rep: Reputation: 395Reputation: 395Reputation: 395Reputation: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyonearth View Post
Your missive here has actually prompted me to give Debian another try....
One question though, why doesn't someone do something about that sappy default wallpaper and login theme? It's not exactly confidence inspiring.
If your confidence in an operating system is based on how pretty the log-in screen is, ... um
Do you judge the quality of a car by the colour of the paint?
 
Old 07-04-2012, 09:27 PM   #39
evo2
Guru
 
Registered: Jan 2009
Location: Japan
Distribution: Mostly Debian and Scientific Linux
Posts: 5,520

Rep: Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216
Hi,

the "Space Fun" them was for Debian 6, Squeeze, only. Squeeze was the alien character in Toy Story. Debian 7, Wheezy, will have something different. See http://wiki.debian.org/DebianArt/Themes

Cheers,

Evo2.

---------- Post added 2012-07-05 at 10:27 ----------

Hi,

the "Space Fun" them was for Debian 6, Squeeze, only. Squeeze was the alien character in Toy Story. Debian 7, Wheezy, will have something different. See http://wiki.debian.org/DebianArt/Themes

Cheers,

Evo2.
 
Old 07-05-2012, 12:26 AM   #40
guyonearth
Member
 
Registered: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Distribution: SolydX
Posts: 399

Rep: Reputation: 82
Academic, since the install fails anyway. Fails to detect other installations, fails to install bootloader. Waste of time.
 
Old 07-05-2012, 01:02 AM   #41
evo2
Guru
 
Registered: Jan 2009
Location: Japan
Distribution: Mostly Debian and Scientific Linux
Posts: 5,520

Rep: Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216Reputation: 1216
Hi,

Quote:
Originally Posted by guyonearth View Post
Academic, since the install fails anyway. Fails to detect other installations, fails to install bootloader. Waste of time.
Are you interested in getting help to try to get it working? Or just venting?

Cheers,

Evo2.
 
Old 07-05-2012, 01:49 AM   #42
guyonearth
Member
 
Registered: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Distribution: SolydX
Posts: 399

Rep: Reputation: 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by evo2 View Post
Hi,



Are you interested in getting help to try to get it working? Or just venting?

Cheers,

Evo2.
Neither really. I don't bother venting any more. I just move on. Debian's installer has been a weak point for ages.
 
Old 07-05-2012, 06:54 AM   #43
cynwulf
Senior Member
 
Registered: Apr 2005
Distribution: OpenBSD, FreeBSD
Posts: 1,378

Rep: Reputation: Disabled
The Debian installer is solid - never had a problem.
 
Old 07-05-2012, 09:49 AM   #44
62chevy
Member
 
Registered: Mar 2002
Location: West (By God) Virginia
Distribution: Debian Squeeze - Sid
Posts: 281

Rep: Reputation: 44
Never argue with and an Idiot Those watching may not be able to tell the difference.
 
Old 07-05-2012, 10:18 AM   #45
guyonearth
Member
 
Registered: Jun 2012
Location: USA
Distribution: SolydX
Posts: 399

Rep: Reputation: 82
Quote:
Originally Posted by caravel View Post
The Debian installer is solid - never had a problem.
1. Debian installer can not set up NTFS mounts during installaton apparently.
2. It took forever.
3. It failed to detect Windows installation at all, or offer to multi-boot.
4. It was unable to installl GRUB to ANY partition or MBR. I was left with an unbootable system.
 
1 members found this post helpful.
  


Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What distro is most stable? (Debian-Based) Acutical Linux - Newbie 17 10-17-2011 02:04 PM
LXer: Debian Squeeze set for Stable release on Feb. 5 or 6 - it's a distro you shouldn't ignore LXer Syndicated Linux News 0 01-21-2011 04:30 AM
tar.gz of a gnome-panel more stable for debian stable :lol frenchn00b Debian 4 05-07-2008 11:32 AM
LXer: For me, Debian Testing is more stable than Stable LXer Syndicated Linux News 0 04-22-2008 06:20 AM
using testing software in stable debian distro drrnsk8ter4 Linux - Software 1 04-25-2004 06:14 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:50 PM.

Main Menu
My LQ
Write for LQ
LinuxQuestions.org is looking for people interested in writing Editorials, Articles, Reviews, and more. If you'd like to contribute content, let us know.
Main Menu
Syndicate
RSS1  Latest Threads
RSS1  LQ News
Twitter: @linuxquestions
identi.ca: @linuxquestions
Facebook: linuxquestions Google+: linuxquestions
Open Source Consulting | Domain Registration